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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbter View Post
    Adding onto Ox's words...my thoughts of 3x simples over 1x headache....
    If 1x simple breaks, 2x are still running.
    Headache (for instance) gets swarf in a microswitch and stops. Then you gotta fault find it....
    Part gets revised - prove on 1x simple and load copy prog into other 2x and you're away.
    Headache surely takes longer?
    Quality of guy to get headache running would be much rarer than getting simples running.
    Part qty ramps down, 2x simples can make other parts.
    Part ramps up, add 1x simple.
    Also....more simples are made than the headaches. This = lower lead time and also "teething" problems. High end manufacturer machine or not, on these types there's always PLC or parameter type teething and this can take an age to get running. Iron out bugs in a simple - copy the parameters across (within reason)....
    Obviously floor area is a compromise, which is an ever increasing cost nowadays.
    The plc errors vary a lot with different mtbs. Gf so far has been ahead of everyone else (IMO).
    It helps that they own system 3r

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by bryan_machine View Post

    I think that applies to Barbter's argument - it's not that a 2-axis CNC live tool lathe with a bar feeder and parts catcher is really all that "simple" - but rather that people undertand them, deeply. The deeply part is key - the knowlege or intuition of "always do this, never do that, if it does A do B immediately..."
    Quote Originally Posted by empwoer View Post
    The plc errors vary a lot with different mtbs. Gf so far has been ahead of everyone else (IMO).
    It helps that they own system 3r
    My learning from experience, from mates in the game, reading here and other forums etc, is more moving parts = exponential "headaches".
    Basic VMC with 24tool side changer single table = reliable.
    Add the options of a twin pallet, 60 tool changer on the side, large filtration swarf system, and the issues start climbing.

    Also yes, people tend to stay clear of more complicated machines - how many 2ax turners are there, compared to Swiss?
    Yes, there's also the fact that there's more 2ax machines around, but finding Swiss can be a nightmare.
    People (on the whole), want an easy life...!


    Ref this machine - I'm not knocking GF at all. Absolutely awesome piece of kit.
    For the right application!


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