Okuma Genos M560
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  1. #1
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    Default Okuma Genos M560

    So I will start this out with the statement that I'm new at this hole Machining center thing. We have had bridgeports and manual lathes for years last year we bought two new prototrak bedmill and lathe. This year we stepped in the deep end with an Okuma Genos M560 high pressure TSC probe just basics. I have learned a lot just playing with it but also from these forum's. The thing we are going thru now that im hoping to get some feedback on is tooling. We went with some middle of the line holders SECO ER25P ER16 and fixed EM holders. Double octomill face mills with .5-1 inch feed mills as well. We are happy with the tooling my machine literally looks like the fancy videos you see of the feed mills ripping and shitting. But I'm having a bit of an issue finding a good variety of end mills that will hold up and not break the bank. We are a custom machine builder so most of our jobs are one or two of a part to build a machine times that by 1000-1500 parts on a machine so lots of setups we keep three different vises on the table to help speed changeover up.

    I have ran the gamit with Iscar, Niagra, Guhring, the higher grade Accupro, and a few cheaper end mills as well. We have noticed great tool life from the stabilizer 2.0 but not great finishes we get great finishes using Accupro HS Series 6-7 flute end mills but I feel like there has to be something else out there worth trying. We machine a lot of 1018 and A2 with a good amount of 4140PHT. Appreciate any feedback.

  2. #2
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    Niagara is good stuff, the 6 flute eccentric ground mill in particular. The guhring diver mills are decent but overall the Guhring line doesn't impress me.

    Finishes often come down to the tool holder as much as the tool. The fixed or sidelock set screw style holders are Ok for roughing but depending on brand sometimes don't give the best finish. If you are really looking to take advantage of the abilities of the 560 maybe look at the various milling chucks, hydraulic holders and heat shrink holders.

    Fahrion chucks from PH horn, Shunk hydraulic shrink fit from a good name like lyndex or haimer. Shrink fit is a bigger investment because of the accessories needed but it's considered the best performer.

    The Fahrion holders are good stuff but spendy, hydraulics are super easy to live with but tend to deflect a little under roughing loads...so everything has it's pluses and minuses. They all have superior runout and will provide excellent finishes.

    Also look at the machining parameters and coolant.

    1018 and soft A2 don't give great finishes anyway..the 4140 PH will be better and A2 in a hard state will has potential for excellent finishes.

    The machine is capable of great finishes but it about finding the right mix of tool, holder, parameter, toolpath..etc to get the most out of it.

  3. #3
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    Garr.
    Excellent prices and quality. Look to buy them from Carbide Depot if you don't have a distributor in your area.

  4. #4
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    MA Ford. Great performance/price ratio. And they LAST.

  5. #5
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    Imco! Great tools, you'll love them. Great support too in case of the obscure problem.

  6. Likes lakey0 liked this post
  7. #6
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    Like about everything else in this business most of it boils down to support.

    We bought the exact same machine 1.5 years ago, and i have had most of the popular brand cutters in the machine at some point.

    I settled down with SGS for 2 reasons:

    My local tool distributor gets high discounts because of the volume they sell

    The local "sales guy" has been in the trade for 30 years, might as well be a materials scientist, will replace
    or refund any tool that doesn't perform to exactly how he offers it to, and in the last year has never once
    given me bad cut data.

    We have a Helical distributor up the street, they're great cutters but they have a fixed pricing model, and while you get a reasonably powerful aid in their 'machining advisor' if your new to the game having support with a heartbeat that can take work holding, machine power---all of these other factors, into account is nice.

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    Thanks guys I have wanted to try some SGS cutters as we use there taps alot for our standard parts use Emuge for anything tough and have had good luck with the SGS taps. I agree on the Helical tools we also have a local rep but he offered the same pricing i can find online and was pushing there downloadable tool which i wasn't fond of. The Guhring diver end mills i have nothing good to say about we had a rep in here brought three tools we threw a slab of 4140A in and went to town the first two mills exploded running it at his suggested speeds .5in TSC version. He called up some one he worked with we backed the chip load to .002 and half way thru broke a third one. The guy didn't know what to say. He left and we ran a stabilizer thru the same program and it cut like butter.

  9. #8
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    I may be somewhat biased these days due to who I work for.... But I will say, for any type of solid milling or carbide drilling ditch the ER and go for hydraulic. If you are using cheap HSS jobber drills, use your ER chucks for those. As for whose hydraulic chucks to use/buy? Test a few out. But I would recommend the entire offering of hydro chucks Kennametal, per application recommendations. Hydroforce HT for medium to heavy solid end milling, standard HP for light milling and drilling, and slim for clearance drilling and tapping applications. Hydraulic chucks will significantly increase your tool life in milling drilling and tapping applications. The tapping life increase was a total surprise to me, but indeed will get minimum 30% more even after increasing cutting speeds in some cases 100%. This was in H13 mind you.

    Best of luck

  10. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaztor View Post
    So I will start this out with the statement that I'm new at this hole Machining center thing. We have had bridgeports and manual lathes for years last year we bought two new prototrak bedmill and lathe. This year we stepped in the deep end with an Okuma Genos M560 high pressure TSC probe just basics. I have learned a lot just playing with it but also from these forum's. The thing we are going thru now that im hoping to get some feedback on is tooling. We went with some middle of the line holders SECO ER25P ER16 and fixed EM holders. Double octomill face mills with .5-1 inch feed mills as well. We are happy with the tooling my machine literally looks like the fancy videos you see of the feed mills ripping and shitting. But I'm having a bit of an issue finding a good variety of end mills that will hold up and not break the bank. We are a custom machine builder so most of our jobs are one or two of a part to build a machine times that by 1000-1500 parts on a machine so lots of setups we keep three different vises on the table to help speed changeover up.

    I have ran the gamit with Iscar, Niagra, Guhring, the higher grade Accupro, and a few cheaper end mills as well. We have noticed great tool life from the stabilizer 2.0 but not great finishes we get great finishes using Accupro HS Series 6-7 flute end mills but I feel like there has to be something else out there worth trying. We machine a lot of 1018 and A2 with a good amount of 4140PHT. Appreciate any feedback.
    Fraisa makes some BITCHIN endmills and their support is second to none.

  11. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaztor View Post
    So I will start this out with the statement that I'm new at this hole Machining center thing. We have had bridgeports and manual lathes for years last year we bought two new prototrak bedmill and lathe. This year we stepped in the deep end with an Okuma Genos M560 high pressure TSC probe just basics. I have learned a lot just playing with it but also from these forum's. The thing we are going thru now that im hoping to get some feedback on is tooling. We went with some middle of the line holders SECO ER25P ER16 and fixed EM holders. Double octomill face mills with .5-1 inch feed mills as well. We are happy with the tooling my machine literally looks like the fancy videos you see of the feed mills ripping and shitting. But I'm having a bit of an issue finding a good variety of end mills that will hold up and not break the bank. We are a custom machine builder so most of our jobs are one or two of a part to build a machine times that by 1000-1500 parts on a machine so lots of setups we keep three different vises on the table to help speed changeover up.

    I have ran the gamit with Iscar, Niagra, Guhring, the higher grade Accupro, and a few cheaper end mills as well. We have noticed great tool life from the stabilizer 2.0 but not great finishes we get great finishes using Accupro HS Series 6-7 flute end mills but I feel like there has to be something else out there worth trying. We machine a lot of 1018 and A2 with a good amount of 4140PHT. Appreciate any feedback.
    Lakeshore Carbide. Best value out there. Call and ask for Carl and tell him Bill sent me

  12. #11
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    We used to cut a lot of A514 and AR500 1" to 2" plate (oil field "bit breakers") and had the best luck with MA Ford 5 flute in TG-100 holders. Parts came in water jet roughed out and we did did finish profiling and put other holes and features. The MA Ford lasted a lot longer than anything else we found and the TG100 holders worked even better than sidelock or hydraulic holders.

  13. #12
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    Holders, Holders, Holders.

    I've found that to give me the best parts and tool-life over specific endmills. The Best endmills held in a half ass ER collet can be outperformed by an Accupro em in a precision holder.

  14. #13
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    Pretty much every end mill manufacturer has been suggested. Seems to me the best thing to do is buy based on service and support from whatever vendor you like, and make whatever brand they sell work for you.


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