Found this video from Rego Fix testing the clamping torque of a few of there different collet nuts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ml4d3fcPMtU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ml4d3fcPMtU
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Rego Fix Video clamping torque of different ER-32 nuts.
- Thread starter Edster
- Start date
- Replies 23
- Views 6,188
DavidScott
Diamond
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2012
- Location
- Washington
Good find! I wonder how much changing the collet would make? One with a shallower taper and more contact, such as a TG or SG?.
DavidScott
Diamond
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2012
- Location
- Washington
Generally spinning the tool in the collet is what causes the rest of the problems.
DavidScott
Diamond
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2012
- Location
- Washington
Speaking of keeping things clean to work properly, I want to see that test with a 6 month old bearing nut that has chips in it. Let's see how much of a difference that will make.
converterking
Stainless
- Joined
- Apr 17, 2004
- Location
- Kolding Denmark
Years ago I had tool breakage that was caused by the end mill slipping in an er32 collet. Now I clean the tool holder and collet with brake clean and bought the torque wrench and torque the nuts to 125 ftlb. Haven't had a problem since.
DavidScott
Diamond
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2012
- Location
- Washington
Never have figured out how to clean the crap out of bearing nuts so I just use solid nuts and a little oil. Ever since I tried using a torque wrench I have NEVER tightened a nut without it, the only way to go! I think I will be trying some HPI SX collet holders next. A lot more $$ but it looks like they would be worth it.
Orange Vise
Titanium
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2012
- Location
- California
The fact that a bearing nut delivers more gripping power than a plain nut under the same installation torque should be obvious, just like how a greased screw delivers greater force than a dry screw under the same torque. The simple solution is to apply higher torque to the plain nut/dry screw.
Where the bearing nut really shines is the minimized twisting of the collet and the resulting runout improvement at any given installation torque. A side benefit is less torque required to achieve the same gripping power, which really makes a difference in machines where accessibility is an issue, like live tooled lathes.
Where the bearing nut really shines is the minimized twisting of the collet and the resulting runout improvement at any given installation torque. A side benefit is less torque required to achieve the same gripping power, which really makes a difference in machines where accessibility is an issue, like live tooled lathes.
Orange Vise
Titanium
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2012
- Location
- California
Most bearing nuts from reputable manufacturers do a good job of keeping chips out of the internals. I use dozens of Lyndex-Nikken bearing nuts and haven't experienced a single failure.
PegroProX440
Hot Rolled
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2012
- Location
- Ormond Beach
Kind of good timing. I ruined a mari tool nut this week (first one ever) Can I replace just the nut on my er32 holder with another brand? I would stay with Mari but i don't think they sell just a nut, I'm guessing because balancing could be off. I generally run tools in a gear driven haas vf3 so my rpms don't go over 7500.
DavidScott
Diamond
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2012
- Location
- Washington
Yes you can and yes they do. Look under spare parts on their website. When replacing nuts just make sure the thread size is the same. Some slim nuts are for a smaller diameter thread, guess how I know?
Orange Vise
Titanium
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2012
- Location
- California
bjorn toulouse
Titanium
- Joined
- Dec 26, 2007
- Location
- N.E. oHIo, USA
While ultrasonic cleaning is definitely an option, less exotic measures can be effective as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEG9swNT9NA
Bottom line: Clean tools are happy tools!
Rex
Jashley73
Titanium
- Joined
- Jan 24, 2013
- Location
- Louisville, KY
This seems kind of silly making this comparison at 50% of the max torque for these collet nuts. So who here knowingly torques their collet nuts to 50% of their max torque, on purpose? I'd be interested to see the test repeated, at 90-100% of the max torque - would be far more meaningful results then...
Ox
Diamond
- Joined
- Aug 27, 2002
- Location
- Northwest Ohio
Yes it should be obvious that a bearing nut would deliver more gripping power. What's less obvious is that the Plain Rego Fix nut delivers more gripping power than their original plain nut or the competitors plain nut. And it's still nice to see a real world test done with simple equipment that most of us can replicate if desired. The simple solution of applying more torque to the plain nut doesn't apply if your already at the max torque for both types of nuts.
FWIW, I really like the bearing nuts. I use a lot of Rego Fix collet holders with the HiQ ERB nuts, and some with the ERBC nuts, there sealing system for TSC is really slick. I also use Parlec collet holders with their bearing nuts. To me the bearing nuts are like putting a washer under a bolt head, a natural choice.
http://www.rego-fix.com/en/home-nor...pe/type/spannmuttern-mit-standardgewinde.html
Jashley73
Titanium
- Joined
- Jan 24, 2013
- Location
- Louisville, KY
How should I know? And besides, it just seems pointless, unless the comparison nearly-duplicates real-world conditions. Like I said, who here knowingly torques their collet nuts to 50% max torque, on purpose? If you're going to offer a comparison demonstration, then compare and demonstrate what's going to happen, when I go to use this in the real-world...
Er collets suck. Period.
I always have problems with the smaller er holders on the live tool lathes. I refuse to use them in mills. TG works. Pretty much anything with an 8 degree taper is going to beat an ER. Quality end mill (set screw) style holders are simple and reliable. When I need to hold tight tolerances and make nice finishes I use Schunk hydraulics. Again, cave man simple, the best run out going and the new tendo E's have crazy grip and aren't super expensive.
If you want or need the best of the best...those Fahrion deals that Rich S tested look pretty bad ass.
I always have problems with the smaller er holders on the live tool lathes. I refuse to use them in mills. TG works. Pretty much anything with an 8 degree taper is going to beat an ER. Quality end mill (set screw) style holders are simple and reliable. When I need to hold tight tolerances and make nice finishes I use Schunk hydraulics. Again, cave man simple, the best run out going and the new tendo E's have crazy grip and aren't super expensive.
If you want or need the best of the best...those Fahrion deals that Rich S tested look pretty bad ass.
Just what are real world conditions? Some guys tighten the collets with the short wrench provided, some beat on the wrench with a hammer, and some torque the nuts. I'm sure some guys clean their collets and holders and some don't. Way to many variables to consider.
We clean everything but don't torque them all the time. We will torque the nuts if there is a 1/2" or bigger end mill in them though.
There are different torque recommendations for different sized collets in the same ER family too.
http://us.rego-fix.com/er-system/pdf/collet-torque-chart.pdf
We clean everything but don't torque them all the time. We will torque the nuts if there is a 1/2" or bigger end mill in them though.
There are different torque recommendations for different sized collets in the same ER family too.
http://us.rego-fix.com/er-system/pdf/collet-torque-chart.pdf
I also use the schunk tendo hydraulics chucks for finishing tools, quality tool holders for a pretty cheap price.
I Also use rego-fix er chucks, have had slipping taps and other problems with other cheaper er chucks. But never experienced that with rego-fix.
Funny thing is that when I put a rego-fix nut on the cheaper (Holex, sold by Hoffman group in Europe) chuck that the tap(er32 with m12 form tap) slipped in it stopped slipping.. But it was cheaper to buy complete rego-fix chucks than a cheap chuck and a rego-fix nut.
I Also use rego-fix er chucks, have had slipping taps and other problems with other cheaper er chucks. But never experienced that with rego-fix.
Funny thing is that when I put a rego-fix nut on the cheaper (Holex, sold by Hoffman group in Europe) chuck that the tap(er32 with m12 form tap) slipped in it stopped slipping.. But it was cheaper to buy complete rego-fix chucks than a cheap chuck and a rego-fix nut.
Here's another video testing torque transmission for the Powergrip system vs. hydraulic, Tribos (polygon), and shrinkfit systems.
It's interesting that the max torque the Powergrip transfered was 141 newton meters which is 104 foot pounds. It started slipping at about 100 newton meters or 74 foot pounds. Not much better than an ER collet chuck.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GRbfzNCdeLc
It's interesting that the max torque the Powergrip transfered was 141 newton meters which is 104 foot pounds. It started slipping at about 100 newton meters or 74 foot pounds. Not much better than an ER collet chuck.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GRbfzNCdeLc
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