Editing Ladder on Mits _ or _ Macro Work-Around?

1990 Mits Meldas

(are all Mits called Meldas?)


Machine has a hydro actuated sub-spidle for the linear axis. For the FWD direction it simply does a [semi] controlled crash into the rear turret. Amazingly enough - it seems to hold +/- .001 for the most part.

I have already used it to pull the bar, but I was pulling it all the way HOME.

I haven't used this machine all that much, and the sub even less as it aint the most user friendly set-up as comapared to a ball screw driven unit, but I am gitting more comfy with it and am dooing other things to the machine to make it more Ox freindly as well.

So today I was playing with it a bit. After having good luck with the pull HOME routine, and how well it repeated, I wanted to see what else I could doo with it that at first I would have guessed NOT.

Well - my first guess was right....


Once the sub has crashed, sub col closed, main open - I tried to doo a G1 Z+ on the rear turret to move the sub back W amount. It faults out and up pops the error code #223. "Machining Impossible [you bloody moron, you left the] Headstock collet open!"

Well - since I ain too sure how to pull with the sub w/o the collet open ....


So - Jist fer grins - I tried G0. That is not a feed code and thus may not trip the "Machining" threshold. ??? However - I can only imagine how well this will work!

Well - yep - she moved! Much faster than prefered, but she moved! And it scared the axis drive as much as it did me! (tripped out (easilly?) ) As well - that much speed (keep in mind this is likely only 400IPM) will ilkely "unseat" the sub from the rear turret when it stops anyway - tripping yet another alarm.


I have looked through all 18 macros and find nothing in there that even has error code text at all like I have seen in some other macros on Fanucs. So I am figgering that it is in the ladder. ???


While I don't want the prog to start if the main collet is open, but it would be swell if I could edit the ladder to allow it to doo a G1 with it open.

No idea if it would be possible to even make a werk-around in a macro for this?

Another option that I have thought about while keying this all in - would there be eny way to code into the prog to shut down the RAPIDS? I would think that if I could set the rapids to 25% and run with the G0 - that it should werk perfectly! and then speed it right back up aggin...

Actually - I really like that idea. That sounds like it should werk and seems like it would be pretty easy to code in. .... somehow....

Anyone know how?

FWIW - the RAPIDS is on a soft key as opposed to a mechanical switch. As a rule I hate this, but in this instance that may make life easier. ???


BTW - I [don't think that] I have access to see the ladder, and I ass_u_me that this is a burnt PROM chip? This machine was DOA when we got it and we had to load everything. But I don't find a ladder in any of the code. I know that even a dead battery won't lose the ladder on a Fanuc, so .... ????



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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Yea, that stuff is going to be in the ladder, along with the rapid rates. That soft key inputs to the ladder, very, very doubtful that rapid rate is mapped to a macro input/variable you can manipulate via the NC.

How about an hydraulic flow control valve in the hydro circuit for the sub spindle? Would give you control over how fast the sub moves forward.

As far as rapids, there should be machine parameters where you can set the max rapid rate for each axis. Maybe just set the rear turret Z-axis rapid rate at 25% of OEM???

I know, you might lose a few seconds due the the turret moving slower in rapid-Z all the time...but what's a few seconds on a several minute (hopefully) cycle??

G

Oh sure - I could slow the feedrate of the sub, but that's not causing any troubles.

Able to single out the rapid rate for any individual axis? You can doo that on a Yamazaki?

That soft key inputs to the ladder, very, very doubtful that rapid rate is mapped to a macro input/variable you can manipulate via the NC.

Click to expand...

You think?

It just seems to me that [especially with a soft key] that it would toggle a param somewhere. No?

And if it was a param, wouldn't a guy be able to edit that param in the code if he could find out which one it was?

If you don't think that it's likely that it goes to an editable param - I won't spend much time pursuing it.

I guess in an actual NEED job, I could run the whole job in slow rapids...

Another option would be to only run the job with the scren up that contains the soft key Rapid Overide, and install some ice cube relay and fire it twice via M code to slow and then some other M code to speed it back up aggin. Next issue than would be what M codes I could borrow and be able to toggle during cycle? I think I could use the gantry unloader codes....


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Able to single out the rapid rate for any individual axis? You can doo that on a Yamazaki?

Click to expand...

Sure can Ox. On one of the machine parameters page, each axis has a long list of parameters. One of those is "RF", which in Yamazaki (Mitusubishi) parlance, is rapid feed. It is in metric. Not sure how it would be spec'd for your Mits controlled machine...maybe the same??

I slow all my rapids about 25%, as the factory settings are "WFO", if you know what I mean. I also increase the accel/decel time constant for each axis, which effectively slows the start/stop in rapid mode. I also do the accel/decel rate reduction for the spindle drives.

These reductions help to increase longevity and reliability, of the drives, in my older Mazaks. Or so this hillbilly likes to think anyway...

G

cnctoolcat said:

Sure can Ox. On one of the machine parameters page, each axis has a long list of parameters. One of those is "RF", which in Yamazaki (Mitusubishi) parlance, is rapid feed. It is in metric. Not sure how it would be spec'd for your Mits controlled machine...maybe the same??

I slow all my rapids about 25%, as the factory settings are "WFO", if you know what I mean. I also increase the accel/decel time constant for each axis, which effectively slows the start/stop in rapid mode. I also do the accel/decel rate reduction for the spindle drives.

These reductions help to increase longevity and reliability, of the drives, in my older Mazaks. Or so this hillbilly likes to think anyway...

G

Click to expand...

GOTCHA!

Yes - I have actually done that to a Sub Linear axis on a Fanuc machine as well, and should prolly doo that to X2 on that same machine too.

I will look to see if I can find a page with that info! Good call!

(I still like the idea of changing the overal RAPIDS rate via code better tho... )





Keep Relays:

I didn't see anything like that in any scren that I could git to. But even then - you need a cheat sheet from the MTB as to what they all stand for.


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

PLayed around a little more.
Set Rapids to 25% and it werked super!
Then tried 50% and that werked fine too!


Searched for single axis sped params, but I didn't find anything on the pages that had descriptions. But I did find this screen that looked like it had a param that could possibly (?) be edited in cycle. ???

But the value never changed no matter where I set the O/R soft key to. ???

Then I changed the value in both the F0 and F1 fields and still couldn't find any changes in the program. I reset back and closed out.

I may check some un-identified params as well as see if I can find a book with that info, but I don't think so .... ???


BUT!

BUT I am sure that I could borrow 2 unloader M codes and sneak in behind the soft key and tap in and influence it that way if I make sure that it is on the right soft key screen during cycle, but better yet - if I borrow a 3rd M output - I could make sure that it is on the right screen too!

That should werk fine as long as someone doesn't come along and start punchng keys at just the wrong time is all.

But over-all, I think I can make this werk if the time comes that I have the app!


If I find a param that sets the G0 rates for a given axis, would I be able to edit that in cycle doo you think? Like on a Fanuc I think a G10 P_______ would get there eh? This control doesn't have G10 ability, but ... ????





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Think Snow Eh!
Ox