X axis fault alarm at startup Sharp SVL-2416SE-M ?

I have gotten an alarm when trying to move my X axis after start up at the beginning of the day. This has happened 2 times in 3 days I can hit the reset but it keeps happening and then suddenly clears each time the machine has operated fine all day afterwards. Today when it happened I could jog y and z axis but as soon as i tried jogging X it would alarm out. I didn't think I was going to get it going this morning I reset it probably 6 times I could hear a sound coming from the area of the X axis servo and it would alarm out. I noticed if I moved it only 1 graduation with the pendent it would move .010" I did this about 5 times one step at a time then it worked fine. Anyone know of something to check? The first time it happened 2 days ago I took off the way covers to make sure nothing was wrong and checked the connection to make sure it was not loose at the servo. Everything was pretty clean so I put it all back together and like today it suddenly started working again. I have tried shutting everything down and re-starting but that does not change anything. I am praying it works tomorrow I have so much work to get done in the next month.

Control is Siemens 828D the machine is a 2014 year model.

One more thing when trying to move the X axis when it was alarming I got an X axis overload alarm part of the time otherwise it just said X axis alarm. The X axis was not near either of the limits of travel.

aside from an electrical problem
it could be a bearing going out and binding up or ball screw. maybe some junk on the ways/guides. I would pop the motor(after you check electrical) and see how table moves by hand turning the ball screw.

also check your bushs. I am sure vance will have some good advice for electrical.

I have a 2003 Fadal with a Siemens 840D control and it does something very similar.On mine it's usually the X-axis,rarely y and rarely both.
I can also only jog slowly in tenths mode,and eventually it will fault out.Hitting reset does not help,only a complete shutdown.

So for the last month I've had to start up the machine at least twice to get it going,but afterwards it's flawless.

Funny thing is yesterday and today it started up fine.

Unfortunately I don't have a solution.

In the past I've had occasional X-axis contour monitoring faults while the machine was running,and after reseating the connectors of all the leads running from the Simodrive units to the servos,
I haven't had any more problems in that regard.

Please keep us posted on how the support is on the Siemens control ... I looked at them a few years back and could not find anyone in seattle area .... They seem to be a nice control but the support in the US is just not there ,, I think all of the "ORIGINAL" sharp mills were made by FIRST ( Taiwan machine builder) then Sharp started building there own mills and that is when they added Siemens to the Fanuc controls they had before that.

Delw said:

......I am sure vance will have some good advice for electrical.

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Since it is Siemens, I don't really have anything to offer. After a few bad experiences with them a long time ago I have avoided everything with Siemens drives or controls since.

Vancbiker said:

Since it is Siemens, I don't really have anything to offer. After a few bad experiences with them a long time ago I have avoided everything with Siemens drives or controls since.

Click to expand...

I was thinking more along the lines of the motor or encoders loose wire etc etc. not so much control
to me it sounds mechanical like its freezing up at some point.

had a cnc with hydrostatic bearings or the table slide floats on oil
.
and got X axis servo overload cause oil pressure was too low and it wasnt floating on oil so harder to push. i literally never knew about oil pressure problem til i got overload. the oil pressure gages were not visible or behind a access panel.

Slide the way covers off enough to get a good look under(after cleaning them off good so you don't drop a bunch of crap on the screws), check as many oil lines as you can see. I hate those tiny plastic lines.
A few years ago a Sharp 2412 owner here had a fairly new machine that the X or Y oil line let go on, probably never put in right at factory and it chewed itself to death. Odds are small it would be that, but still needs a good look.

This morning I am having the same issue here are the different fault alarms I am getting.

MX 1 drive fault
Drive motor locked speed controller at its limit
Axis MX1 servo_3.3:3(3):
Axis MX1 positioning monitoring

I can reset and the alarm goes away but when I move the X axis one of the above alarms comes in. I am able to rock it back and forth a few graduations but then I get a noise like it maybe binding and if I move it in the other direction the noise stops.

I am going to separate the servo motor from the ball screw and see if this still binds and if I can move the axis by hand. Here is my worry and that is getting it back in the same spot the machine has an absolute encoder. I do believe I remember there is a process for homing it I think I did that when I first got it after it was moved.

I am also going to check voltage this machine runs off a phase perfect single phase to 3 phase converter. I will report back what I find.

Voltage checks ok so I pull off the way cover to access the servo motor nothing looks off and I try jogging again and guess what it is working fine again. No noise no binding just as smooth as usual no alarms. I am going to run parts and see what happens.

The funny thing is this only happens at start up never during the day when it is being used. I usually start the machine and let the spindle run for about 10 minutes at 2000 RPM then when I shut off the spindle and try and jog it with the pendent I get this. I tried jogging it with the buttons on the control when it was acting up to eliminate the pendent and it still alarmed. Each time it has started working again I have done nothing special other than let it sit for a few minutes after resetting it.

Some observations I made while I had the way cover off the ball screw has a nice layer of oil on it so I don't think it is a lack of lube so did the linear rails. I tried to move the ball screw by hand back and forth and there is no slop in it. I don't think the problem is in the rails or ball screw. I am guessing the encoder or servo motor or amplifier and I don't know how to check those. Again I have been making parts with no issue once I got it going??

Is there any sort of servo battery on the Siemens stuff?
Just wondering if maybe its almost dead, but when its got juice for a little while once turned on its happy again? I'd think there'd still be an alarm somewhere though and do it to all the axis, so pretty unlikely.

I was having some intermittent issues on my mill, coolant pump turning off mid cycle once in a while, turned out all the wire connections in the connectors were loose, same for conveyor and skimmer, just barely holding in there. Had that on a few house appliances too, connections never pushed in all the way from the factory.

I have seen similar startup issues on machines with other drives/controls when coolant made its way into connectors on the motor.

Vancbiker said:

I have seen similar startup issues on machines with other drives/controls when coolant made its way into connectors on the motor.

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If and when it happens again I will remove the connectors off the motor and check that. Been running all day.

Apparently you power down at night?

Does your machine run hydraulic pump?

If not - I'd leave it "up".

I have replaced some of the "plugs" on some of the wires, but it seems like that may have been the spindle leads? Or maybe it was the servo's?

I bought a whole pkg of the new lead ends.

I don't recal what the initial problem was.


But the fact that it is only an issue first thing in the morning, I'd guess it's a failing capacitor?
Keeping it up may buy some time?


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Here is a picture of the connectors they have a thin clear plastic covering part of them and the one feeding the encoder has some type locking mechanism on it how do I remove that connector. I don't want to damage it. I guess I need to cut the clear plastic off and when I re-install it should I wrap it with electrical tape?

Funny thing is it did the same thing this morning and as soon as I remove the way cover it starts working again. The way cover bolts are not even close to the ways to bind. The way cover slides back and forth with no effort. I did blow air on the connectors before trying it again but when I did try it, it worked fine again. I don't want to put the way cover back on until I take the connectors off and check them.

I figured out how to remove the connectors the connector going to the encoder looked good I took it off and blew it out. The connector for the power going to the motor seemed loose I removed it and everything looked ok I blew it out and re-installed it making sure it was tight. Time will tell if I fixed anything. I am running parts again.

gundog said:

Funny thing is it did the same thing this morning and as soon as I remove the way cover it starts working again.

Click to expand...

You mean - like after the ele tronics had time to warm (charge?) Up?

Maybe next time just try leaving the machine up and walking away for a bit and try aggin later.


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

D.D.Machine said:

Please keep us posted on how the support is on the Siemens control ... I looked at them a few years back and could not find anyone in seattle area .... They seem to be a nice control but the support in the US is just not there ,, I think all of the "ORIGINAL" sharp mills were made by FIRST ( Taiwan machine builder) then Sharp started building there own mills and that is when they added Siemens to the Fanuc controls they had before that.

Click to expand...

Vancbiker said:

Since it is Siemens, I don't really have anything to offer. After a few bad experiences with them a long time ago I have avoided everything with Siemens drives or controls since.

Click to expand...

As I read these posts the other night - I was setting in a motel room in Toronto - while a fella was working on one of my Siemens controls!

After a few months of dicking around, I am finally back up as of an hour ago!


However - believe me that when you cross the border and she* (remember this part) asks you what your purpose for travel to a place 6 hours from home is - and you try to explain that you are getting some industrial controls worked on, and after the conversation all she heard was that "you are driving 6 hours to git'cher computor worked on" - THAT will get your truck torn apart! LOL! I had 3 guys rummaging through the cab of my truck for 5 minutes or more.

They're just dooin' their job....
I got nothin' to hide...

ALWAYS get the third degree when dealing with a female border agent. Not so with the guys.
Not torn apart - but long questioning. Sometimes all I can think is that it is my good looks and they just don't want to let me through too quickly?
I mean - what else can I think?

Also - while hooking mine back up this morning, I see the plugs that I replaced are likely the ones on the servo wires - plugging into the CCU. (amp)
I took a pic of mine today as one showed darkness on the plug. I didn't find my bag of new plugs right off, so I put it together.

I'm not sure if I had any real issues with that yet or not when I replaced mine?
I could have found the burnt plugs when replacing the CCU one time or ???
But then - maybe a burnt plug was the cause for the amp failure to begin with?


I might post a pic of the plug soon if Photobucket gets their files all up and going after a big crash....



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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

So, to get your Siemens control fixed you have to take it out of the machine and haul it to someone in another country???