Aciera F4 original price tag

Kingbuxton · Dec 17, 2020

Hi all, I own two (round model) Aciera F4 machines with cabinet and most accessories, slotting head etc. I often reflect on the fact that these machines were waaaay beyond the budget of hobby workshops, and probably most commercial workshops too when they were new and that it’s a treat and privilege to be able to own them.

I’m wondering if anyone knows what the original price tag on these machines would have been back in the day when they were new. Also interested to know the same for other well known machines if anyone has old sales catalogs with prices?

ballen · Dec 17, 2020

I don't know the answer to your question. But here is an invoice for a well-equipped Deckel FP2 in the year 1971:

Deckel FP2 Invoice 1971

In 1970 a new house in Germany cost significantly less than the 70,000 DM which New Zealand paid for this mill.

AlfaGTA · Dec 18, 2020

The question i would ask "what does it matter?" We are here now....unless you have a way back machine....Suffice it to say that machine was expensive...The Swiss like the Germans knew how to write an invoice.No bargains in this realm, then or now.
Cheers Ross

Botje · Dec 18, 2020

I have a 1960 offer for a well equipped F4. Prices are 1960 prices, did not adjust for inflation.
Bare machine was 17400 CHF with 21 month lead time.
Vertical head nr433: 1700 CHF
Slotter head nr434: 1200 CHF
And so on and so on, adding up to 34K with the spiral mill attachment etc. No universal table etc, not the super nice rotating table, no center microscope etc.

Agreed that price then was irrelevant but I understand it is fun to have an idea.

ballen · Dec 18, 2020

Botje said:
I have a 1960 offer for a well equipped F4. Prices are 1960 prices, did not adjust for inflation.
<SNIP>
And so on and so on, adding up to 34K with the spiral mill attachment etc. No universal table etc, not the super nice rotating table, no center microscope etc.

I just checked. In 1960 the Swiss Franc and the German Deutschmark had almost equal value. So the cost of the well equipped Aciera F4 circa 1960 was somewhat less (about half) the cost of the well equipped Deckel FP2 circa 1970. Not sure if the comparison is fair, the Deckel may have had significantly more accessories included at that price.

The Swiss Franc and the German Deutschmark were worth about 20 to 25 US cents during this period (so about one quarter of a US dollar).

DM-Wechselkurse: Deutschland in Zahlen

shapeaholic · Dec 18, 2020

A quick inflation calculator, and USD conversion shows somewhere near $90,000.00 in 2020 dollars.

ballen · Dec 19, 2020

shapeaholic said:
USD conversion shows somewhere near $90,000.00 in 2020 dollars.

For the FP2 or the F4?

Kingbuxton · Dec 19, 2020

Great info! $90’000 in today’s money sounds very cheap to me.
As to the question what does it matter? It doesn’t of course. I’ve heard so many older machinists talk about these machines as being soooo expensive that nobody was even allowed look at them so I’ve always been curious just how much they would have cost new or are people exaggerating. $90’000 is a lot of money, but not in an industrial workshop.

Botje · Dec 19, 2020

For reference, IIRC I found the offer on Passion-Usinages : Machines outils, Usinages et Documentations

BillE · Dec 20, 2020

Kingbuxton said:
I’ve heard so many older machinists talk about these machines as being soooo expensive that nobody was even allowed look at them

Spoke to one old toolmaker, who sold up a decade ago, mentioned his long bed deckel cost well over twice what he paid for his adjacent weatherboard house in the 70s.

Time period and size are a bit different to you, FP4MK was listed without accessories here at $Au79,960, exchange rate was DM1.10=$Au1 on the undated offer. Which would put it around half the price of a middling house back then around here.....now lucky to serve as a deposit on most. Dating sticker I found most recently was 1994 on the Y axis bellows.

Moral of the story, don't buy machinery for investment value!

DeadMahoDude · Dec 27, 2020

Invoice I saw a while ago on ebay for a Maho 600E with color graphics capable Phillips 432/11 and 90° non-universal table in 1988: 144'656 DM.

Maho600-E-432 — ImgBB

So the average 5000€ ebay Deckel/Maho/Mikron/Hermle CNC from that time was worth about 2 houses or so at that time

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Aciera F4 original price tag

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