Arboga Scam?

Martin P · Feb 7, 2018

There is an exceptionally beautiful Arboga ER 1830 for sale on german EBay with location in the Ruhr area (west central Germany):
Arboga Getriebe Bohrmaschine Ausleger Radialbohrmaschine ER 183 Vorschub | eBay

Very pretty, I wonder how high it will go. It would be eye candy in the shop.

Then I notice its also advertised by Marcel Machines from Switzerland and with location Switzerland in various places on the net (the usual ones) with exactly the same pictures.

This would not be quite the typical scam, although I was once observing an Aciera column drill where Ebay notified me that I should not deal with the seller, as he was a scammer. In general I am not sure how this scam is supposed to work.

It looks like a swiss location machine, as only swiss machines are usually this clean.

Monarchist · Feb 7, 2018

Martin P said:
There is an exceptionally beautiful Arboga ER 1830 for sale on german EBay with location in the Ruhr area (west central Germany):
Arboga Getriebe Bohrmaschine Ausleger Radialbohrmaschine ER 183 Vorschub | eBay

Very pretty, I wonder how high it will go. It would be eye candy in the shop.

Then I notice its also advertised by Marcel Machines from Switzerland and with location Switzerland in various places on the net (the usual ones) with exactly the same pictures.

This would not be quite the typical scam, although I was once observing an Aciera column drill where Ebay notified me that I should not deal with the seller, as he was a scammer. In general I am not sure how this scam is supposed to work.

It looks like a swiss location machine, as only swiss machines are usually this clean.

Rumour has it there are Germans equally as capable of cleaning up a machine. It is Swiss residences, kitchens most of all, as are borderline anal about all that "Swiss clean" stuff. With Germans, perhaps it is paranoia instead?

And it need not be a "scam".

High-value goods sold "on commission" - residential homes another example - are often listed by more than one quite reputable dealer. Location given that of the dealer if goods are mobile - not necessarily location of the goods, as with less-portable homes.

Contact them and ask. They'll usually say so when transport planning is brought up.

As-in "That one is in our yard at <??>.." really meaning "We have a deal in place to split the commission with <??>..".. whichever of us finds a buyer first.

Martin P · Feb 7, 2018

Its a scam.
Marcel says its their machine, its at their premises and they did not give authority to anyone to sell it. They also reported it to eBay.
I suspect the auction to be pulled now.

Monarchist · Feb 7, 2018

Martin P said:
Its a scam.
Marcel says its their machine, its at their premises and they did not give authority to anyone to sell it. They also reported it to eBay.
I suspect the auction to be pulled now.

That was quick!

Scams do happen, too. Obviously.

That's where keeping a few of those alert and ever-suspicious Germans on-staff adds value.

"Thanks for that!"

michiganbuck · Feb 7, 2018

Had they offered free overnight shipping to Michigan I would have put in my bid...
I have 8... 5/8 dia. x 2" parts that need to be drilled and tapped and that seems just the machine to do the job...

Martin P · Feb 7, 2018

ARBOGA | Marcels

pictures for once the auction gets pulled.

If it does not get pulled I may buy it just to see how they want to scam me. Its in driving distance.

ballen · Feb 7, 2018

Martin, well done! Cheers, Bruce

Monarchist · Feb 7, 2018

Martin P said:
ARBOGA | Marcels

pictures for once the auction gets pulled.

If it does not get pulled I may buy it just to see how they want to scam me. Its in driving distance.

Must be! Driving you to distraction, as it is..

Can't blame you, though. Nice machines and hard to find.

dominus164 · Feb 8, 2018

OK so we are all agreed this is the most beautiful small radial???

Screen Shot 2018-02-08 at 10.52.55 ?.?..jpg

kustomizingkid · Feb 8, 2018

Thats a mighty fancy drill press

Milacron · Feb 8, 2018

dominus164 said:
OK so we are all agreed this is the most beautiful small radial???
View attachment 219942

Another to consider...

Monarchist · Feb 8, 2018

dominus164 said:
OK so we are all agreed this is the most beautiful small radial???
View attachment 219942

Not here, no. So small that a conventional column DP can match the throat depth, and with an X-Y table beat positioning accuracy as well.

Not calling it wrong. Bound to serve a niche well-enough. Simply short of what most radials need to deliver to be considered general-purpose desirable in a world where too many were put out of a job for folks perverting decent milling machines into rather slow DP's with tightly constrained work envelopes.

Oh well. Straightforward holes as don't require SOME form of head-games seem to have gone out of style in any case, if the news feeds are to be believed.

zephyrous · Feb 9, 2018

dominus164 said:
OK so we are all agreed this is the most beautiful small radial???
View attachment 219942

Beautiful? Yes
Useful? No (for the 90% of radial users)

Radials in my part of the world are made to machine heavy and bulky workpieces, where it is easier to move the drilling head than the piece...
This machine has a moving head almost bigger than its work envelope...

Its like having a travelling column milling machine with a x-axis of 400mm... :nono:

I am more fond of the high speed radial drilling machines in terms of versatility

michiganbuck · Feb 9, 2018

We had a big radial at one shop and the vertical feed lever when pushed up would make the head go up, pushed down the head would go down..Yes It should have not been that way.. the lever should always go away not towards the work..

Yes one day a fellow went too far up and the feed safety stop stopped the feed ..It would only still go up, not down.
He went up a little more and broke the casting..Yes the feed motor was wired wring to go the wrong way.

AlfaGTA · Feb 9, 2018

michiganbuck said:
We had a big radial at one shop and the vertical feed lever when pushed up would make the head go up, pushed down the head would go down..Yes It should have not been that way.. the lever should always go away not towards the work..

.

???????????????? not sure i understand....Every mill i have ever run has had the feed movement go the direction the feed lever was moved towards....Move the "X" feed lever to the right and the table moves to the right....

Are you saying that the radial drill should be setup to move the drill up and away from the work when the feed lever is pushed down?????
Having it that way sounds pretty counter intuitive to me...
Cheers Ross

Monarchist · Feb 9, 2018

AlfaGTA said:
???????????????? not sure i understand....Every mill i have ever run has had the feed movement go the direction the feed lever was moved towards....Move the "X" feed lever to the right and the table moves to the right....

Are you saying that the radial drill should be setup to move the drill up and away from the work when the feed lever is pushed down?????
Having it that way sounds pretty counter intuitive to me...
Cheers Ross

Maybe I've just run the wrongs radials for too many hours, but Cannedy-Otto, Cincinnati-Bickford, and a Mutt n' Jeff combo of 5-foot and 8-foot ATW's twins in age and all other respects save size did it the "intuitive" way.

In all cases the card-carrier AT those controls was expected to have his head out, too. It was the drillpress, not the operator, that was permitted to have its head "up and locked", whether the sun shone there or just a tall layer of filthy air and flyblown artificial lighting.

Mining and railway repair shops, one used a knife and fork to get a ration of breathing air separated from the coal dust and zinc-chromate paint haze, many days.

michiganbuck · Feb 9, 2018

Sorry I did state it wrong..opposite what I wrote...when pushed lever up it went down.. pushed lever down it went up..so the safety stops were in the wrong direction and did not act to stop the movement.the up stop actually stopped the down travvel..
Think it was a big Carliton..

much like this carlton radial drill - Google Search

Tyrone Shoelaces · Feb 9, 2018

If you're looking for a very versatile radial arm drill I always liked the German " Donau " brand. They aren't built for heavy duty work but they've really nippy on the smaller stuff.

Regards Tyrone.

Martin P · Feb 12, 2018

to complete the story

So the auction was ended by the seller "due to the article no longer being available". Makes it look like a seller initiative and not Ebay bumping him off.
Marcels Machines is asking 5500 SFr for that machine (plus tax), a completely unattainable price on german EBay or in Germany in general. Arboga's are a bit to pedestrian for the big bucks.
The seller has other lower cost items still up for sale. His headspace will remain a mystery.

Arboga Scam?

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