What's new
What's new

Deckel FP2 1966 #5147

milohiscox

Plastic
Joined
Nov 26, 2013
Location
UK
Hello

A couple of months ago I bought a Deckel FP2 from another member - Jersey John.

I’ve done a lot of lurking here learning a load about the machines, but thought I would post some info to entice you in and hopefully get some answers to questions that are rattling round my head.

The mill was in beautiful condition, really clean and tidy and well looked after. The seller was extremely helpful, so thank you John.

As John pointed out, it’s 50 years old (more on that to come) but I’m already in love with it.

Some pics of the transport crew:

db765397b2c05e91903926a39c1dd7fc.jpg
470cdba68e730b785b2d0d4882c7317e.jpg
61dca03dcebc240cdd52504d1b81d309.jpg
98555843d6ad79e8ee84e01d2cf1328f.jpg
7f147a88d61035879c96c359f676dcc6.jpg
e80b0ec18cff3a26fd330f06e46b3e85.jpg


61dca03dcebc240cdd52504d1b81d309.jpg




A pic of me looking very excited:

ed4f5e3f7807dfff1e27d8b0b1145824.jpg


I will post some details here as I service the machine. My primary hobby is rebuilding vintage Harley Davidsons motors, and I’ve got a 7 month old boy, so progress will be slow, but it’ll be here for your viewing pleasure and critique.

Thanks

M


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
First thing I did was wire it up wrong and run it backwards for a bit. D’oh.

Second thing I did was cut some aluminium! Never used a horizontal spindle before, but this was very smooth and satisfying.

3c686a861fd7e5089e286568099ffd55.jpg
 
Spindle rebuild. Now we’re getting to the good stuff.

I put an indicator on the female taper of the vertical spindle and measured the run out at 0.0005” (0.01mm). More than I was hoping for to be honest.

Fortunately the horizontal measured <0.0001” (0.002mm) which I was very happy with.

Decided to tear down the vertical spindle to see if the bearings are ok. Some amazing threads on PM on how to do this, but I’ll repeat photos here for fun.

Got it out.
f85a22bedd01f9321aac16d822b65673.jpg


Gross grease everywhere.
788b0bcff81b0c6b03f48972175021f7.jpg
fe006b505f702318a4783c15591567c7.jpg
1705e161f154baf70b3a9152e2ecdde9.jpg
4eeabcf739ec1e183c44d8d610492060.jpg



Quill feed spindle twisted after years of hammering:

b38f79d33eed5f5ddefb42813d01b853.jpg
f17708c0439814c836bd92a40f20be95.jpg
80c5a091ba59ee4714677401104039e0.jpg
 
The other posts I read mentioned that the thrust washers in a FP2 spindle have a flat race and a concave race, which prevents radial forces on the spindle. But mine only had standard concave races throughout. Maybe just an earlier design?

09d6dbb0f6980f0017140e8d6445bd8d.jpg
0d28141b113ee67e6a40360edd1e27f5.jpg



Everything cleaning up nicely:

16e0057ceafe4c450689cf59af1062e4.jpg
dae020094e21e380827e26964e9512cf.jpg
a858501bcf5301c64b18e6ef5e3e5aab.jpg


The spacer between the thrust washers was badly scored. I decided to grind it flat, taking 0.0015” off. This would help the thrust bearing sit where it wants to, without really effecting the spindle location too badly:

8620d066d99a328cce5123ccf4edca9b.jpg
52187bec20c01ca9b5d8ad3b73370dac.jpg
 
Measuring time.

I wanted to measure the needle bearings’ radial play directly over the bearings themselves. So instead of putting the spindle back in the head and measuring the tip, I held it in our bench centres (used for flywheel truing) with a small tool holder in place.

Measured it in all different orientations and the results were really good: all measurements were between 0.0003-0.0005”, which is perfectly in spec (despite a little ovality).

7bf5d2f7a49fb41323726b03db7d5b86.jpg


So that’s very good news.

Greased it all up sparingly with some Franz Singer grease and reassembled.

9cc00a7f103907cd7e3cb140fa756019.jpg


Set the end play by holding the spindle on the surface plate and lifting the quill up and down. Quite hard to measure once greased.

8fca2858e00eabd9f68a28e045c984e2.jpg


That’s enough for one day.

Beer time.
 
That's a nice machine. I suggest that you replace the Y handwheel with one similar to the X and Z handwheels (with a spinner handle). Otherwise it's very slow to crank Y over. If you post the diameter here, someone might have a spare. (On my FP2 I also replaced the horizontal quill handwheel with one that has a spinner handle, for the same reason.)

My other suggestion: add a DRO. You'll be able to work at least twice as fast.

Not surprising that the horizontal spindle is in good shape compared to the vertical. Many people are not used to having this and don't take advantage of it.
 
That's a nice machine. I suggest that you replace the Y handwheel with one similar to the X and Z handwheels (with a spinner handle). Otherwise it's very slow to crank Y over. If you post the diameter here, someone might have a spare. (On my FP2 I also replaced the horizontal quill handwheel with one that has a spinner handle, for the same reason.)

My other suggestion: add a DRO. You'll be able to work at least twice as fast.

Not surprising that the horizontal spindle is in good shape compared to the vertical. Many people are not used to having this and don't take advantage of it.

Thanks for the tips


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Going deeper underground... Next instalment: The Head.

I went to put the spindle back in the head and noticed some pretty bad scoring on the inside:

f5013f1a7b79151adf2f20bb7fa2ac28.jpg


Also, interestingly, the very bottom of the bore seems to taper outwards, looks like it might have been opened up. Is that correct? I would have thought they would have designed the quill to have as much support as possible, but then this is also a removable piece.

Ah the smell of old grease:

4cdf678d737b46b4a125695da3fd598c.jpg
d7f629e1aa2d6e923ba35794606cbf51.jpg
01555a17cefc718fd4b539bd59f83739.jpg
af6a0758d0c954e7384c9aaa2d18d55b.jpg


Out comes the gear:

209ff676ed305be33fc2732181102988.jpg
f3ad84ba43e9f67d839cbfb61b57ec65.jpg
e7da431ceff3ab07a0be38fd8143661d.jpg


Only seem to be able to post 9 pics per post so will split it out...
 
Cleaning up nicely:

f0e1ebe973adc77acc8a60d89a4a4f86.jpg
0c6b155c77571fbb217cd23f648e008e.jpg
886b0bbe5118d7f98276abc6460654b1.jpg
53491d40ed77bdc9b327ec959878b786.jpg


Uh-oh found something bad... One of the bevel gear thrust bearing races had fractured. Lucky really, could have got nasty in there:

2149e7f6ba13619f0d1bcad7747c68bb.jpg
a879e1856fa9e6ee6062fb3cd28f4999.jpg


Next question: Can I replace it with a standard ********* 51109 thrust bearing (£20)?
This broken race has C.B on it - does anyone know what that means? I can’t find any information on it:

8d79dd5e6d2cc9e583827bcb46691f62.jpg
 
My last request for tonight. Does anyone have a scan of the manual for the long reach head?

I have a manual (thanks John) but covers all the other attachments except the long reach, which in itself is confusing.

For example,
This nipple on the spindle cap has had 60 years of grease through it, but is it actually for oil?

4373dfee0f59f79a5d84ea341dccf4cf.jpg


And this one, oil or grease?

02be3227783c23c2d43e9b86068ccde0.jpg


I don’t really understand the function of this block at the back, maybe if I take the whole attachment off it will become clear:

810bd8f71f06c61d3a03e674912393ae.jpg
 
Block at the back is for two purposes. First, safety. Keeps you from pulling the long reach head off in the forward direction and dumping it in your lap. Second, needed to lock the long reach head in place. Look closely at how the clamping mechanism works for the long reach head. It's a poor design, these front and back black clamps are needed to make it work properly.
 
Couldn’t find out what C.B meant for the thrust bearing so replaced it with a normal ********* thrust bearing which seems to be fine.

Turns out someone had attempted a repair before and had ground out whatever fastener holds the key into the bevel gear. You can see a little track on the race where their dremel got away from them. The thrust bearing was the wrong way round and the tight bit was against the housing so scored a groove in the gear.

Anyway I re-machined it all nice using a stone to grind a countersink in the hardened gear.

9c395907f9cd1d481cc3e85aea726ea2.jpg


Also remachined the vibration brake:

4b499f0d588b9ca2414af01f94cc02ba.jpg
b1fd928de80f56ffc4bc752eedbcff21.jpg


All back together:

6fc7535f05dac6a0b0baf6cb7902c7c3.jpg

dceec20303a3165f48c7235c98184873.jpg


I only took the gear apart because all the old grease looked gross but I’m really glad I did because I found a cracked race, loose key and wrong assembly order!
 








 
Back
Top