Deckel FP2 acquired (Preliminary) - Page 17
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  1. #321
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    Yep Bruce you're absolutely right .... I blame the Gin & Tonic

    Good spot and cheaper than Franz (by a couple of Euro's) .... or FREE if you spend enough

    John

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  3. #322
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    Just a heads up that I'm still alive and haven't forgotten this thread.

    Been really sick for a good long while now and just haven't had the energy... But eventually there should be some actual activity again...

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  5. #323
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    Get well and keep the forum posted on your progress!

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    I have been sick for like two months now, started with a cold and it just didn't want to give up, would get better, then worse, then I got an eye infection as well while my immune system was compromised. Still coughing now and then but starting to slowly feel better since a week or two...

    Anyway I am stuck at the moment. I want to ge the vertical table off the machine but there is no room on the operator side of the machine to get it off, and it has to come off that way. So I will have to move the machine a little bit in order to be able to proceed...

    That means I will need to fix the 2T shop crane I bought so I can get it between the pallet and lift the machine off, and also move it a little. I have made plans for the modifications and am working on them right now, mainly involves modifying the base, also taking the opportunity to stiffen up the frame. Cutting, welding and fabricating feels more my thing than machining.







    Had to make custom U-profiles. It will make more sense later.


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  8. #325
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    Brave guy, not the ideal working conditions after being sick for so long....

  9. #326
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    Actually I think the cold fresh air helps after being shut inside for so long, sure feels better now.

    I have welded the base mostly done and started putting the crane back together.







    Here it is with the legs extended in wide mode, now it's a nice ~87cm between the legs so a euro-pallet will easily fit inside. I still need to weld some supporting caps over the inner U-profiles where I also welded on more square profiles. With a lot of weight on the crane those might be weak points and fold. The wheels under them should help but I wouldn't want to count on them alone.




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    Today I used the crane I built and got the mill off the pallet.

    I first lifted it both at the front and back so I could drag out the pallet, no pictures of that....

    I lifted the mill as little as possible, a millimeter clearance perhaps. I pulled the pallet halfway out, stacked up a bunch of boards at the front and lowered it onto that. Then I lifted only the rear of the mill and removed the pallet completely, and put some boards there... Then it was lift at the front, remove board, lower, then lift the back, remove board, lower down. And keep on doing that until it was on the floor.







    I could perhaps have just removed the pallet and lowered it to the floor at once but I felt this was safer. It's a lot scarier than you think to lift a machine like this for the first time, I got a real adrenaline rush from it. It's damn scary actually.

    That's enough for tonight, still gonna have to do some more lifting and rotating the mill to get the vertical table off, but it will be a lot less scary since the mill will be alot closer to the ground.

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  12. #328
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    Glad you got it safely onto Terra Firma. Nice looking machine! Looking forward to the next installment.

    To remove the horizontal table, put a small workbench underneath the horizontal table, lower the horizontal table onto the workbench, then slide the horizontal table off the machine and onto the workbench.
    Last edited by ballen; 01-11-2019 at 12:55 AM.

  13. #329
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    well done!

  14. #330
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    Nice modification to the shop crane....I like the wide stance and the folding legs.
    Not too different from the "Blue Bird" crane we have here at the shop....Made to come apart for storage with no tools...Just "snaps" together. Has a wide stance like your addition.

    Looks like this: Used Construction, Agricultural Equip., Trucks, Trailers & more

    Anyhow, nice job getting your machine on the deck....
    Cheers Ross

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  16. #331
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    Thanks guys,

    I moved the mill around a bit so I could get the vertical table off.


    Some help from the crane is handy


    Years of grease and filth...






    Pushing in some oil to see where it comes out, brought some grease along with it. I also note that the scraped surface is more worn towards trhe edges, in the middle it is more intact.



    Oil distribution channel is filled with caked in grease


    After some cleaning. Wear pattern seems to be more worn towards edges.


    Also removed the gib for the Z-axis finally.


    Worn more towards the ends, center is least worn.


    And here's the galling damage on the vertical table


    Next step is to lift the vertical table on the work bench and begin the cleaning process and repair the galling damage.

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    I decided to also remove the backing plates as I wanted to have a look at them and they were not in as good a shape as I had hoped. Scraping is mostly worn away and the one on the operators side has galling damage. And so does the mating surface on the saddle. Now I can see grinding these should be doable, there is a machine shop nearby which might have this ability, not sure. And scraping them for oil pockets I can perhaps do myself after some training.

    But what of the saddle, there is sadly quite a lot of galling there on the edge on the operator side, the whole saddle is large and cumbersome. How would this be refurbished normally? Maybe I don't need to do that at once, if I get the high spots down since I don't think the area is exposed to anything. But this was another victim of grease here.

    Unfortunately I was not able to take photos of this just now, tomorrow I should be able to show some pictures.

  18. #333
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    Here are the pictures.


    And on the saddle.


    I don't think you can get a grinder in there but I am no expert, milling it and applying turcite perhaps. Then scraping it parallel to the other bearing surface.

    Now that I think about it, this area is actually exposed, though from underneath in a sort of protected position. Do you think I should fill this with epoxy as a stop gap solution until I can afford to have it fixed professionally?

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    A follow up thought... Would moglice be a candidate for this?

    EDIT:
    The idea also strikes me of simply not filling up any material, just mill off enough to remove the damage, scrape it for oil retention and parallelism, and adjust the backing plates to suit. The whole setup would become a little narrower that way, but I don't think it would matter.

    Anyway machining on the saddle is in the future... my plan now is just to put it back together after everything is cleaned.
    Last edited by DennisCA; 01-14-2019 at 07:31 AM.

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    Hi Dennis,

    My first impression is that the majority of the gibs and backing plates look OK. I think that they would benefit from getting some oil pockets scraped in them, which is not hard to do.

    The exception to this is the top back of the support (last photo in your post 333) where the tendency of the vertical table to droop down in in front is controlled. Moglice might be a good solution here, but would require putting the support on a large milling machine to cut away metal from the galled surface to make space for the Moglice. With patience and a jig you could probably also grind it away "by hand".

    Does the top back of the support look that galled everywhere? Some more photos of that area and the damage would be helpful in gathering advice.

    Peter V, how would you fix that?

    Dennis, getting it cleaned up and back together is a good idea. You should at least stone off the galling damage.

  21. #336
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    Yes I used a burr file to remove any burrs, I should hit it with a stone too.

    The galling damage on the operator side backing plate I need to fill in as well. I believe it will be exposed as the table travels and is so liable to track in particulates, so I want to fill the gouges there, same as with the dovetail in the table. I had bought some general 5 euro chemical metal stuff from the local store... But some people I have talked to don't believe epoxy or metal putty like that would work, that it would be liable to break down itself and work as a grit. But I read about it being used plenty here.

    This is basically what moglice is I believe, a form of epoxy with metal formulated for this application, also comes in a putty form for vertical applications which might suit me.

    Question is can I buy it anywhere in small enough quantities... If not I have heard of Devcon being another brand of epoxy/putty used in these applications.

    P.S. got a package from Franz Singer last night:

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  23. #337
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    Hi Dennis,

    Quote Originally Posted by DennisCA View Post
    The galling damage on the operator side backing plate I need to fill in as well. I believe it will be exposed as the table travels and is so
    liable to track in particulates, so I want to fill the gouges there, same as with the dovetail in the table. I had bought some general 5 euro chemical metal stuff from the local store.
    SKC specializes in these materials Gleitbelage – SKC Gleittechnik
    I have purchased small quantities at reasonable cost from them in the past, and was happy with it.

    Their SKC 63R product might be a good choice (R means "Repair"). I suggest you write to them with some photos. Page 17 of this document describes its use, but that's for filling holes and defects in surfaces already covered with the molded materials. http://www.skc-technik.de/content/wp...eitbelaege.pdf

    Note: I have always corresponded with them in German. I don't know if they can manage in English. I can't get the web site to do anything but Deutsch.

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    THanks for the suggestion, I googled the product code and found an english version of that document:
    http://skc-technik.de/bilder/antifriction_coatings.pdf

    I have been looking into Devcon Putty. Smallest batch I can get it in is 500g, which is probably 450g more than I need.

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  26. #339
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    Heard from a number of people. Diamant in Germany says they no longer deal with private customers, also contacted Devitt, who refered me to Diamant, so catch 22.

    But even so, I was today called up by a finnish person who said he had been told by Diamant to contact me and offered a 350gram kit, I was wondering about the 100g kit but he did not know about that. He would get back to me.

    I also got hold of the finnish Belzona distributor but they only have 1kg kits.

    Devcon also answered my questions and explaining my sitution and intent to them they recommended their WR-2 putty. Which I have found cheaply on ebay in estonia. I am leaning towards this because proximity to me and the affordable price of 60 euros with shipping.

    Have not heard from SKC.

    I also cobbled together a grinder for carbide inserts:

  27. #340
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    so you turned down a guy associated with a company that doesn't deal with private individuals because the kit was too big? the company went out of it's way to help you solve your issue and yet it still wasn't good enough, not hard to understand why companies tend not want serve non businesses, is it?

    and it is not like a 350g kit is a large one...
    /rant


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