Deckel FP2, need help to tell what year!

Cykelmorfar · Jan 17, 2017

Hi everyone!
Finally i was able to upgrade my old milling/drilling machine for a way better one.
Old one was a "Modig UBM-AM"...

Seller lost the manual though and im not sure how to tell modelyears of these machines.
Machinenumber: 45121

So question 2 would be if someone got a manual for this one or know best place to get one?

I'm planning on giving it some love during the winter aswell, looks a little sad at the moment...

Best regards! /Magnus

Cykelmorfar · Jan 17, 2017

Found this;
(Didn't pop up on my first searches.)

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/v...-serial-number-information-fp2-series-109897/

According to that info it's a 1953!

Peter from Holland · Jan 17, 2017

Yes
Thats a old one But don`t worry The smoothest running FP2 I had was that same vintage
78 Dba at full speed

Peter

Milacron · Jan 17, 2017

The year doesn't matter, what matters is the generation...which is first generation FP2 in your case....which some prefer to the second generation as it has more X travel and a nicer hand wheel arrangement. A shame someone couldn't resist painting it that awful color however.

ballen · Jan 17, 2017

Wow, you have the 122nd FP2 ever made! Nice machine, apart from a bit of dirt it looks in great shape. Can you tell if the saddle has had grease injected into it (that's WRONG) or was properly lubricated (only oil)? Mine also has a horrible layer of bad paint on top of parts of it, but that is gradually flaking off.

Send me a PM with your email address and I can email you an English-language manual for the machine and a parts list/diagram. I also have a German-language manual but have not scanned it yet. Jersey John (member here) has recently scanned and posted some documents for these FP2s, I think it is in the last of the PM Forums (can't remember the name of the forum right now). Cheers, Bruce

Edit: the FP2-related documents are in this forum: http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/machinery-manuals-and-brochures/

Cykelmorfar · Jan 17, 2017

Peter from Holland said:
Yes
Thats a old one But don`t worry The smoothest running FP2 I had was that same vintage
78 Dba at full speed

Peter

Sounds promising!

Milacron said:
The year doesn't matter, what matters is the generation...which is first generation FP2 in your case....which some prefer to the second generation as it has more X travel and a nicer hand wheel arrangement. A shame someone couldn't resist painting it that awful color however.

Yeah the colour looks awful, it got a "SAAB" emblem on the side though, think it started it's life at the Saab aero prototype workshop.
Would be interesting to know who had that awful colour taste...

If i get some time over i'll repaint it with correct colour.

The guy i bought it from had only stored it for 5+ years.

ballen said:
Wow, you have the 122nd FP2 ever made! Nice machine, apart from a bit of dirt it looks in great shape. Can you tell if the saddle has had grease injected into it (that's WRONG) or was properly lubricated (only oil)? Mine also has a horrible layer of bad paint on top of parts of it, but that is gradually flaking off.

Send me a PM with your email address and I can email you an English-language manual for the machine and a parts list/diagram. I also have a German-language manual but have not scanned it yet. Jersey John (member here) has recently scanned and posted some documents for these FP2s, I think it is in the last of the PM Forums (can't remember the name of the forum right now). Cheers, Bruce

Edit: the FP2-related documents are in this forum: http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/machinery-manuals-and-brochures/

Cool, nr 122!

Yeah i think it's in good shape under the dirt and i could't find any marks in the table either.
I have to come back with a reply about the grease though as soon as im feeling better!

I've been in bed with fever and a really bad cough last days so i only managed to put it inside the shop.

Thanks a lot, ill send you a pm!

/Best regards! /Magnus

Milacron · Jan 17, 2017

Cykelmorfar said:
Yeah the colour looks awful, it got a "SAAB" emblem on the side though, think it started it's life at the Saab aero prototype workshop.
Would be interesting to who had that awful colour taste...
If i get some time over i'll repaint it with correct colour.

Ross I think still holds the record for the ugliest painted Deckel ever....some sort of "peach" color with accents.... :vomit:

But then that made the transformation all the more glorious...

Yes, that really is the same machine..... first generation FP3. Probably holds the record for the best "before and after" Deckel as well.

Cykelmorfar · Jan 17, 2017

Milacron said:
Ross I think still holds the record for the ugliest painted Deckel ever....some sort of "peach" color with accents....

IMG...

But then that made the transformation all the more glorious...

IMG...

Yes, that really is the same machine..... first generation FP3. Probably holds the record for the best "before and after" Deckel as well.

Beautiful transformation, really ugly peach though haha!

AlfaGTA · Jan 17, 2017

That FP3 came according to its asset tag from Northrup Aviation. Got the impression that all the machines in that shop were like painted...
Motor had been rewound for single voltage 440V as well.
Rewound by a local shop to run dual speed like the later FP3's...giving spindle speeds from 25 through 2500...
Good score on your FP2...They are great machines!
Cheers Ross

ballen · Jan 17, 2017

Cykelmorfar said:
I have to come back with a reply about the grease though as soon as im feeling better!
I've been in bed with fever and a really bad cough last days so i only managed to put it inside the shop.
Thanks a lot, ill send you a pm!

Manuals sent, that will give you some nice reading materials to help sleep off the fever!

ballen · Jan 17, 2017

Hi Ross,

AlfaGTA said:
Good score on your FP2...They are great machines!

How true. I recently did something horrible to my FP2. I am too ashamed to admit the details in this esteemed company, but it involved a piece of 10mm steel plate that I had clamped poorly, a vise that was not firmly-enough fixed to the table, and a shell mill that was probably not right for the job. The good news is that at the end of this, the only damage was a wrecked shell mill and a piece of steel plate that had some embedded bits of HSS shrapnel which needed to be removed. But the FP2 horizontal spindle and the rest of the machine just shrugged it off.

The ability to withstand abuse by ignorant idiots is one sign of a good machine. Perhaps one reason that lots of these FP2s are still around.

Cheers,
Bruce

lucky7 · Jan 17, 2017

Ross's FP3 transformation is impressive, and an inspiration for hacks like me who mostly just use a machine in current condition, whatever that is...

I am amused that even Ross looks like he has to jam his machines close together in his shop ;-)

Lucky7

Milacron · Jan 17, 2017

AlfaGTA said:
That FP3 came according to its asset tag from Northrup Aviation. Got the impression that all the machines in that shop were like painted...
Motor had been rewound for single voltage 440V as well.
Rewound by a local shop to run dual speed like the later FP3's...giving spindle speeds from 25 through 2500...

Your post reminded me that Reliable had two late peach Deckels on eBay back then (Feb. 2001) and I couldn't remember if the other was FP2 or FP3...so I looked in my files and found it. Was a last generation FP3, painted the same horrible colors. Being 1978 and before the "inch" capable Active TNC113 was available, it was probably bought new without any DRO. It also was 440 volts.

Interestingly, a DRO was added at some point...a Sony LC10 with a CRT screen.....which prompted Reliable to just assume it was a CNC machine and thus it was described.

It sold for only $4,600....why didn't you buy that one instead ?

AlfaGTA · Jan 17, 2017

Funny story that.
First off, i had already bought the FP3 at auction from Reliable when the second machine came available.
And you are correct that there was misinformation regarding the machine being "CNC"
Called them up and pointed out their mistake and complained that i would have rather have bid on the second machine..

To their credit, Reliable gave me the option....I could bid on the second machine and if i won that auction, they would exchange it for the one i had already purchased (not yet shipped).
Or if i did not win the second machine, the original deal would stand.....
Well i bid on the second machine, but as things go, got busy and missed the close of that auction and my last bid was just out bid., so i kept the original machine...been a good purchase in all.
Other than the paint, very good mechanically.

Did fit it with an ND 750 DRO , did the paint, and i did purchase a table from Germany....Originally the machine had the smaller , non screw adjusting adjustable table.....
Replaced the bellows and rebuilt the spindles...

Cheers Ross

zephyrous · Jan 17, 2017

Ross' work was an inspiration.

AlfaGTA · Jan 17, 2017

Nice looking machine....
Clean, nicely turned out machines always turn out better work.....IMO.
Cheers Ross

Milacron · Jan 17, 2017

AlfaGTA said:
Funny story that.
First off, i had already bought the FP3 at auction from Reliable when the second machine came available.
And you are correct that there was misinformation regarding the machine being "CNC"
Called them up and pointed out their mistake and complained that i would have rather have bid on the second machine..

To their credit, Reliable gave me the option....I could bid on the second machine and if i won that auction, they would exchange it for the one i had already purchased (not yet shipped).
Or if i did not win the second machine, the original deal would stand.....
Well i bid on the second machine, but as things go, got busy and missed the close of that auction and my last bid was just out bid., so i kept the original machine...been a good purchase in all.

Ah yes, now that story is creeping back into my brain.... interesting as I was thinking they were both on eBay simultaneously but now that you mention it I guess not. This must have been "pre-Sean at Reliable" as he would have set them straight about the Sony DRO.

Do we have any idea who got the 1978 one ? Wouldn't it be funny if it's in a shop somewhere still with the same horrible paint colors ?

AlfaGTA · Jan 17, 2017

"I am amused that even Ross looks like he has to jam his machines close together in his shop ;-)

Lucky7"

Indeed! Everything here is close..., space is at a real premium! Plus I want to keep everything in reach of the crane.
Good news is that Deckels in addition to their other qualities, "stack" well, as you don't have to allow for the table travel in the "Y" direction,
and at the rear there is usually some space where you can set up to a wall or corner or another machine....Small space requirement with a relatively large work envelope = Win/Win

Cheers Ross

Cykelmorfar · Jan 25, 2017

Finally feeling better and i have started to give the FP2 some love.
Been rewiring some electrics, and started to give it a good cleanup...

Do you guys happen to know the colorcode of this generation deckel?
Might it be RAL7005?

ballen · Jan 25, 2017

My Deckel FP2 is gray, basically RAL 7005 Mouse Gray with a small amount of black added to it (60 grams per kg, probably to match the aging). Since your machine is green, my understanding is that the "standard machine green" in Germany is RAL 6011 Reseda Green. Or do you plan to move it to gray? Cheers, Bruce

Deckel FP2, need help to tell what year!

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