Laser Centering Jig for Deckel using Dan Gelbart's concept - Page 2
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  1. #21
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    The centering device is equally usefull on all machines. I use in on the Moore JB, Makino mill and Jet mill/drill. The limit is, of course, the limited accuracy (30-50um). I have also a different home-made centering device, accurate to sub micron, which is harder to build (it incorporates a rotating wireless camera). This device is much more accurate than anything available commercialy.
    Your post plus many other posts inspired me to do a special video on edge finding and centering devices. Will happen sometines in next few months.
    Dan

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    Quote Originally Posted by dangelbart View Post
    I have also a different home-made centering device, accurate to sub micron, which is harder to build (it incorporates a rotating wireless camera).
    There are a bunch of inexpensive USB microscopes available for $10-$40, which have built-in illumination and a range of magnifications and depths of field. These typically have barrel diameters of 8-12mm.

    I was thinking about building a centering microscope based on one of those, built into an SK40 toolholder. This would not be rotating and wireless as you describe, but fixed and wired. The idea would be, after mounting it, locate the center point in the image, and then identify that point by layering a bulls-eye or crosshair over it. In other words, it would not be necessary that the spindle axis aligns exactly with the image center, the image center could be identified once then layered over the image.

    Surely you have thought about this or tried it, could you comment?

    Cheers,
    Bruce

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    you might mant to look at what nick müller did.

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    [QUOTE=dangelbart;2507866]
    Quote Originally Posted by AlfaGTA View Post
    He might know about optics...but I don't think he knows much about milling machines.
    Just to defend myself: this is not my milling machine, this is my drill press. The video was intended for student so I opicked a machine familar to them. My milling machine is a Makino KE55.
    Dan
    You have nothing to defend yourself against.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dian View Post
    you might mant to look at what nick müller did.
    I'd like to, could you please post a link?

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    Mr. Gelbart, or anyone that might know, where do you get your rolls of 17-7 untempered spring wire? I've looked all over to no luck.

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    "... inspired me to do a special video on edge finding and centering devices."

    Dan, If you are still on the board, can you post a link to this video?
    Thanks, Lan

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    Quote Originally Posted by dangelbart View Post
    The centering device is equally usefull on all machines. I use in on the Moore JB, Makino mill and Jet mill/drill. The limit is, of course, the limited accuracy (30-50um). I have also a different home-made centering device, accurate to sub micron, which is harder to build (it incorporates a rotating wireless camera). This device is much more accurate than anything available commercialy.
    Your post plus many other posts inspired me to do a special video on edge finding and centering devices. Will happen sometines in next few months.
    Dan
    Alan how did you go with your laser centering attachment?

    I can't say I blame Dan Gelbart for not wanting to "hang out" here, why would he? Look how people poo-pooed his choice of what turned out to be a drill press! Personally I don't watch TV but instead spend the seemingly endless hours I have in hotel rooms as part of my job reading, modelling in CAD, and watching YouTube videos from credible educators, rather than just wasting that time. Of all the hundreds, if not thousands, of videos I've watched, I would consider the series by Dan Gelbart as the pinnacle of what I've seen, and I watch them many times, each time learning something new! We're all only on this earth for a finite time, and we hopefully leave behind something better than we found it, so I can only hope Dan does indeed continue to make more of his videos to pass on just a little of his wisdom to those who follow.

    Does anyone have any information on the centering device that uses a camera? I've considered a centering microscope for my Aciera, indeed had one at one stage, but it didn't fit well, and was missing a critical part so was sent back. However I would like to continue to pursue the idea and the teaser he provided seemed ideal. Maybe a patent search would reveal more, and I highly doubt he would be offended by anyone mimicking his design for personal use.

    Unfortunately Dan Gelbart has an intimate knowledge of optics and lasers that I can't even begin to understand. So a throw away line like "re-focus the laser" or the focal length of a lens is difficult for somebody like me to understand how to do that in real life. Maybe I need to sign up to engineering at UBC and all shal be revealed

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete F View Post
    Alan how did you go with your laser centering attachment?
    About 60-70 percent done, but haven't worked on it for some time as I've been working on other projects. Amazing how many people poo-poo'd the idea, not just on PM but at a local metalworking group also...

    I've been busy doing other stuff. Haven't hung out too much here on PM lately.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete F View Post
    I can't say I blame Dan Gelbart for not wanting to "hang out" here, why would he? Look how people poo-pooed his choice of what turned out to be a drill press!
    I have respect for the people here also, they are just different in their approach and how they look at new ideas.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete F View Post
    Does anyone have any information on the centering device that uses a camera? I've considered a centering microscope for my Aciera, indeed had one at one stage, but it didn't fit well, and was missing a critical part so was sent back.
    He talks about the one on his lathe in one of his videos. It was made from a car backup monitor as I recall.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete F View Post
    Unfortunately Dan Gelbart has an intimate knowledge of optics and lasers that I can't even begin to understand. So a throw away line like "re-focus the laser" or the focal length of a lens is difficult for somebody like me to understand how to do that in real life. Maybe I need to sign up to engineering at UBC and all shal be revealed
    He's a pretty smart guy, and one thing I like about him is that he's willing to think outside the box. There's a lot of folks here on PM that think inside the box, and are good at it. Dan is quite the opposite. His videos were intended to help college kids learn how to fabricate and machine parts as I recall, and he did them for a local college by where he lives in Canada. Most of his ideas are approached from an inventive perspective, where many people on PM approach it from a job perspective with a need to get it done.

    I will dig this back up soon and finish it. I'd like to have it on my Deckel.

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    Here is a link to Nick Muellers USB camera certering device...

    DIY Optical tool setter for CNC lathe

    Mark

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    I think many people here like to poo-poo everything around them Alan. Whch possibly excolains why they're on the bones of their arse criticising everything in sight instead of living in a mansion in British Columbia

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete F View Post
    I think many people here like to poo-poo everything around them Alan. Whch possibly excolains why they're on the bones of their arse criticising everything in sight instead of living in a mansion in British Columbia
    Keep in mind that the majority here are blue collar workers. Many of them hold a grudge as machining has turned into a commodity. Dan Gelbart is from the other spectrum of white collar workers that enjoys machining and has the money to throw at it to really play around.

    This is not to say that everyone on this forum is a blue collar worker, or even that Dan Gelbart is above them, just to point out that someone like Dan Gelbart has a more lucrative life that affords him the time to spend inventing things and trying to educate people with less skills like me. He seems to want to give back with his videos, and I think some of the great machinists on PM take that offensively that he didn't work himself up from the gutter.

    I 'spose I'm somewhere in between. I don't have as much to throw at machining as a hobby as someone like Dan Gelbart and I'm not sure I would classify myself as a true white collar worker. But I do live in an area where a modest 3 bedroom home sells for a fair chunk of change. It does afford me to be able to buy machines to play around. I'm not the best machinist, because I never needed to machine my entire life to feed my family, Yet, my family eats well...(both my wife and daughter are in culinary...LOL). It's all good at the end of the day...

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    The problem is most people assume that those who are "well off" financially, were born with a silver spoon in their mouths. More often than not, that's not the way it is. Instead, while others are making excuses as to how tough they have it while pissing their life away, some work very hard, use their brain, and are sometimes in the right place at the right time. Put yourself in enough places however, and eventually one will be the "right place at the right time".

    I had previously read the biography of Dan Gelbart, hence why I have the greatest respect for the gentleman. Here it is in a nutshell. He wasn't always living in a large house surrounded by a dream workshop!

    Beginner's Luck

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete F View Post
    The problem is most people assume that those who are "well off" financially, were born with a silver spoon in their mouths .. I had previously read the biography of Dan Gelbart, hence why I have the greatest respect for the gentleman. Here it is in a nutshell. He wasn't always living in a large house surrounded by a dream workshop!
    That's a valid point and those who may think otherwise might want to research his bio using that Google thing.

    You do have to respect a person who chooses to give back to others, sharing his hard won knowledge, vast experience, and most importantly giving up for gratis what has proven valuable in commercially successful engineering.

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    I made a Gelbart inspired laser centre finder a few years back. I was just re-alerted to this thread. I can say that I find the device useful for any number of tasks. last week I posted details of its construction and a use example on another forum which can be seen here http://www.homemadetools.net/forum/a...r-finder-60413

    laserfinder028.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by tonyfoale View Post
    I made a Gelbart inspired laser centre finder a few years back. I was just re-alerted to this thread. I can say that I find the device useful for any number of tasks. last week I posted details of its construction and a use example on another forum which can be seen here http://www.homemadetools.net/forum/a...r-finder-60413

    laserfinder028.jpg
    Tony,

    Thanks for posting that link. Hopefully it will inspire me to pull this project out and dust it off again. I'm in the middle of making a radius turner, but this is still on my list. I've made a similar holder for the laser, and need to finish the body/holder.

    Do you find it accurate ? There were a bunch of people poo-poo'n Dan's idea, but I see it as being sound.

    I find Dan to be a very bright person who is willing to share his ideas.

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    Greetings. It seems a lot of people here have been interested to craft their own version of this laser center finder or centering device, which makes sense since there hasnt been an industrialized product on the market. I love the one I've purchased from Centerquic, which can be found here: www.centerquic.com. Considering that it's only $100 at this point - save yourself some time and get one that seems to have been really thought through down to the details. The centrifugal switch is a cool feature for increasing battery life.


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