Best practice setting angles of universal table?

Hi,

Since getting a Deckel with uni table in front of it the task of setting angles has climbed way up the "hot topic issues" in my garage.
I tried to google but not really found what i looked for. There is a lot of info about tramming, as in setting spindle square to table.
So I´d really appreciate some good practice advise as guide to choose a way forward.

I would imagine height gauges and sine bar would be the first go-to solution on general?
At the moment I´m lacking both of those, which indeed calls out to be addressed. Not only due to this Buuut.. It feels a bit slow worked.
How about these type of accruate angle gauges?
I do not have those either but just thinking about it my feeling is that it should be a fast move just selecting the right one/pair, put them on the table and sweep over with the indicator. And in my mind that would be (maybe almost) done before even one has found out which combination height gauges to use with the sine bar?
Also thought about to use two preciesly spaced balls on the table and indicting height diff with the Z-readout and indicator, essentially somekind of inversed sinebar. Or just even measure direct on the table.

I think in future I might be getting both as they don´t really replace each other. But I think also the angle gauges can be used in many other instances as well making themselves useful, like in the lathe and on the grinder etc.

Soo firstly
Is there a "good common best practice" to hit precise angles with the table?

Height Vs Angle gauges - thoughts / comments?


Angle encoders would of course be "da shit" but I have not found any encoders that would make things better/faster and still be within a reasonble budget. Still a bit too much - you get what you pay for I think.

Maybe I´m just over thinking it.

If the angle isn't too critical, spirit level apps on smart phones are pretty handy. I use it to set the clearance angles on the Clarkson.


I found one app which spits out the accelerometers internal raw data. It displays and angle to 14 decimal places (good joke), but the first decimal place is quite helpful.

Mark

[to hit precise angles with the table?]

[spindle square to table.] A quick attach indicator can be handy. I dint like to place a mag set on my grinders because magnetism is bad for bearings and makes other parts of machine and fixture attract and hold dust. so where possible i like some form of clamp. A cross skim on the part if having a little grind stock ids common and quick.

I have used a protractor to hang on balance to eyeball over the hanging down big end, used a straight edge to eyeball line up with a straight part if the machine. used a mounted indicator to the long travel on OD grinders and the like. used my short and long sine bar with jo blocks or just eyeball and have used gravity protractors.Made a set of thin angle parallels about 3.5 inches long to set on, eyeball across and could indicate over or set a level on(but never do so).. they have proved very handy.

*A hinged 4" sine with attached floor plate having a way to lock in the Jo Block stack would be the cats meow. Never saw one but if still highly active I would make one. If the US was still in the industry I might consider manufacturing that.

For re-work, sharpening I set the machine to ballpark(angles given or logical)then put s straight edge to the most important angle to eyeball to a reference like the table edge.. take a tickle and knock to straight.. than check the part. Clearance is usually 1/2 degree allowed so not the important angle. Seems checking the part is the only real proof. Tilt and roll is important to consider.. if you set 7* at the end of the part you get 7*. then as you swing angle that gets less and less to about half at 45* swing and zero at near 90*.. a 7* tilt and some roll is required to maintain 7* of the edge.

All good to some end. back at my first job (Cutmore tool)I had to trig out the target when intersecting angles made the actual set angle a bit off to make the checked angle to print..
That is a big problem with a universal as the set angle is only part of the getting the Part right.
Its been so log since I figured compound intersect i would have to get out my old math books to know how.

I'd have to say a sine bar or combination sine plate is the one tool that's essential, have both and a magnetic sine bar also. I have set the magnetic sine bar and used it on the side of my lathes compound slide for accurate angles also, very handy for that
The precision angle blocks are nice but I haven't got them and find a planer gauge or adjustable parallel set with a micrometer and the sine bar generally gets the job close enough for my class of work. If closer is called out then the gauge blocks need to be used.
Actually it all depends on the tolerance needed, a bevel vernier protractor can get a guy within a minute of accuracy if used carefully.
It really comes down to the machinists needs and sometime just acquired experience getting the job done. I did a job the other day that was set with the markings on the vertical head to get the job done, close enough for what it was.
Dan

Quick, easy and accurate : combination of DTI and DRO.

Calculate vertical travel over max distance within range of DTI.
Travel that distance using DRO while keeping DTI in touch with table or surface you wish to set at angle.

Altough not suited for the combo of big deviations from horizontal and long travels, this method will yield excellent results when used carefully.

Lambert said:

Quick, easy and accurate : combination of DTI and DRO.

Calculate vertical travel over max distance within range of DTI.
Travel that distance using DRO while keeping DTI in touch with table or surface you wish to set at angle.

Altough not suited for the combo of big deviations from horizontal and long travels, this method will yield excellent results when used carefully.

Click to expand...

Yup! That's how I do it.

I would say that as Danny says it all depends on what the needs are.....

Simple setting using a combination set with protractor top bevel vernier protractor to sine plate with gauge blocks.

Also as Lambert calls , you can use a DRO and indicator to give a sine bar effect...relatively accurate if the surfaces are good.
I have a set of angle gauges by Brown/Sharpe that can be set together to give 1/4* steps....works fine, although the sample size si limited as the gauges are only 3" long at the
base side.

Gravity levels that read out in degrees are nice for quick setup.....also use an precision level that can be set to an angle...but that is only as good as the base level of the machine....
Can also tram off an existing part if making replacements....

Layout with scribe lines..then use an adjustable parallel to get to the same height and set by eye..Line parallel with adjustable parallel....

Tool makers buttons...do the math layout and set each button at the correct location ...adjust to be correct at each end of the angle....in one plane..then move the work to get the buttons in line
(straight) with the cut to give the angle.....(better for large parts where longer sample is desired)

Cheers Ross

Thanks for the good input

I´ll try my ways using what I have for starters, essentially the DRO and the indicator, and see how it works out trying to find a good working method.

Cheers