Cost effective, best method for cutting 1.25" thick 4140/4142 steel?

DanMerrick said:

I make hammers for rock climbers out of 1.25" 4140 square stock. This is a small market with lots of hand work. There are cheaper hammers but people seem to like what I do. I also make the handles and the various other parts.

I'm considering finding somebody to do the rough cuts. For the head, I cut the stock to length, drill some holes and then cut the shape on a band saw. Right now I make four band saw cuts, three have a 6" radius and one has a 2" radius. Even with radius jigs and auto feed, doing this on a band saw is time consuming and sometimes blows the part when the blade wanders. There has to be a better way.

I'm thinking of looking for a shop that can cut these - maybe with a waterjet. I'd prefer to not harden the steel with a flame cut so they are easier to grind, chamfer and finish before I harden and temper. Again, small lots. Maybe 25 or 50 at a time. Maybe even 100 if the pricing works out.

If anybody has any helpful thoughts about the best way to do this, I'd appreciate hearing them.

Thanks in advance.

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Spinit said:

The forging process sounds very interesting. Milland what is needed to do that?

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gbent said:

Those are not drop hammers in the first video Milland linked, but a powered press of some type. With a drop hammer the upper die descends under the power of gravity.

A power hammer may be able to rough form your shape with flat dies. I think a 100# mechanical hammer would be satisfactory.

As far as forging 4140, it is forged frequently. Forging has nothing to do with the stability of the steel, but is about proper grain flow for strength, economy of material, and reduced manufacturing time.

My 260# hammer is still in pieces or I would gladly make a few samples for you. I think my 50 would be to small to do a good job.

You might contact member Reis, as he has a lot of forging experience and has working hammers.

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DanMerrick said:

Thanks to you all for the responses.

I’m a home shop, hobby guy so all the equipment I have is small, worn out and/or cobbled together. I work in the garage and don’t have room for things like power forging hammers. I would love to learn blacksmithing but don’t have the space – or probably the time.

I’ve made and sold about 100 hammers. This is just a hobby. I find it easier and faster to make money as a consulting engineer.

The band saw cuts are all on a radius so I use jigs with a pivot to do them. It usually works if everything is set up right but my saw likes to wander. A weight on a cord over a pulley pulls the piece through the saw so all I have to do is control the end of the cut so it doesn’t crash. I have guided them through the saw by hand following a line but it takes a lot of time. The band saw is junk and that is of course a big part of my problem. I’m watching for a better saw but room in the garage is a concern.

I have considered roughing the shape and finishing up on a rotary table but my toy mill isn’t up to the job and the rotary table I have isn’t big enough. I don’t have a CNC anything.

I get the impression that water jet cutting is slow and expensive.

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Ries said:

You should check out the work of Nathan Robertson, one of the best hammer makers currently working in the USA today. All forged, to within 10% of final shape, hot drifted tapered holes for the handles, and then hand ground to finish shape. His hammers are a work of art. He has a bunch of little videos showing various parts of the process. Yes, they are on facebook. He doesnt have a website, doesnt put em on youtube- he doesnt need to- he sells every hammer he makes. Jackpine Forge - Sometimes one bolster just isn't enough....

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Spinit said:

I really get excited when someone here on PM really enjoys something and pours good honest labor and skills to make something unique.
Rise Thankyou for the interesting link.

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hanermo said:

Em .. contact anyone with a modern CNC mill.
Say Brother or small Haas.

Ask for these to be done as a fill-in job when no other work is critical.
Emphasize zero concerns with accuracy vs modern cnc stuff.
As-is from machine is fine for your use.

It will possibly cost you (much) less than your bandsaw approach.
And be more accurate.
And any decorative stuff can be carved in foc.

Potentially, you might get blanks made for less than your current cost of materials.

If you work with your new cnc supplier, have them do odd size batches, pre-pay, you can get their price breaks on 300 tons of material costs, because you ride along and they use their remnants to do your bits in the odd free time.
I really really suggest You pre-pay.

That will get you 20x cheaper pricing on a volume basis - immediately - and very good free consultancy on how to do your bits cheaply and efficiently.
ANYONE who pre-pays is by definition a major industrial customer worth of serious effort.

1.25" steel cut to shape has a hard cost around 1-5$.
A medium VF4 might do 30 in one hour for 120$, but maybe 2$ less/part than your current materials cost.
There is no way you bandsaw stuff for less than 8$/part.[/QUOTE

Makes great advice Han. Did you note the points on forging? I think that adds a lot of extra work and stuff to do it. What do you think?

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gbent said:

Those are not drop hammers in the first video Milland linked, but a powered press of some type. With a drop hammer the upper die descends under the power of gravity.

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