What's new
What's new

Where to get parts for a K&T mill?

nethawk

Plastic
Joined
May 14, 2006
Location
Edmore, Mi
Just purchased a 307 S-12 combination mill. When I got it home and hooked it up the knee was moving real hard so I thought I would loosen the gibs and work some oil into it. All was going to plan untill I broke the clutch on the feed shaft :eek:
So I am looking for a used feed shaft, does anyone have a good source of parts for these machines?
Thanks, Bill
 
LL Richards Inc.

http://www.llrichards.com/

Ask for Hugh. He is easily in the top five of all people on the planet when it comes to K&T service knowledge.

First thing you do when you get your parts back and the machine up is check hydraulic pressures. 85% chance you problem is in the rapid switch on the right side of the knee. (Ask me how I know, got one just like it.)

What are you using as fluid? Unlike the manual Hugh will suggest you use a ISO 68 fluid because he says it make maintaining pressure in the knee easier. The knee pressures (Contstant, Rapid, and Feed)
 
Thanks for the help guys. I replaced all fluid and checked and adjusted pressures before I fired it up. I have had the speed box out of it also as the horizontal spindle would not engage. I freed up the clutch pac which helped but only a little. This machine appears in good condition, but it looks like it has sat idle for some time.
The fluid I tried to get was the vaculine 1405 but my supplier crossed it over to an ISO 68. What should I look for on the rapid traverse on right side of knee?
 
Machine Tool Service rebuilt my 3CH many years before I rescued it from a scrap salvage yard.They did an excellent job because very little was needed to bring it back on line.I don't know about parts prices from them,though.Besides L.L. Richards there's also Parts&Parts out of Ohio,I think.Both the latter are extremely high price wise but if you gotta have ,you gotta have it.Got a picture and diminsions of the shaft?I may have one laying around and if I do it's yours for free.You just pay the shipping.Let me know.
 
Ray, Thanks very generous offer
. The shaft is 20.93" long. The big splines are 26 involute splines 1.930" long, major diameter 1.674".
The smaller splines on the end are 16 involute 2.900" long, major dia. 1.049". Threaded part is 1 3/16-16 thread. 5 clutch teeth.

I will attempt to post a pic, if that does not work will email it to you.
 
The rapid switch, like the rest of the machine, is a hydraulic switch. At rest it is supplying pressure to the feed circuit, when the lever is pulled up it provides pressure to the rapid circuit. If the sping in the switch lets go the feeds will not work, same if the spring has been replace with one that is too weak.

Does your machine have a hydraulic hose on the right side that goes from the column to the knee? If so, this is pressure from the spindle interlock. This will not allow feeds unless the spindle is running, though rapids will work.
 
Harry,

I think you're right about the folks at MTS.The gentleman that I spoke with concerning my 3CH was able to tell me the complete history of the machine from it's birth.Turned out that my father had used the machine before and upon it's return to Lockheed/Martin(Martin/Marietta)back in the late 60's.I have a picture somewhere with my father standing beside this machine around 1968/69.Very plesant folks to deal with at MTS and extremely knowledgable.
 
Looks like the problem with the knee moving so hard is the elevating nut. Have not got it out yet but got the table and saddle off tonight.
Now if I can get the spindle to engage consistently should be good to go. Any thoughts?
When I turn the horizontal spindle on after the machine sets and the oil is cool it comes right up to speed. But after trying higher speeds a couple of times it will not "lock up".
 
nethawk,
I think you may be encountering filter problems with respect to the spindle.I know on the S15-415 there is a filter in the circuit that feeds the spindle and a local machinist ran into that problem with his.After finding that filter for him(it was buried deep within the machine)I was able to replace it and it solved his intermitant spindle running situation.His also had a filter buried deep in the knee(a real SOB to get at)and replacing it solved all his feeds,speeds,and rapid traverse problems.His machihne originally came from a gov. auction(before they started setting them outside)but it had probably not been cleaned out since the original oil had been put in it.Plus he had no manuals for the machine what-so-ever so I literally and figuratively had to feel around in the dark.IMHO these and all machines of this nature should be cleaned out with kerosene or a good commercial grade of mineral spirits a least once a year or more often depending on use.Especially on machines with hydralic circuits.These machines are somewhat like an automatic transmission in an automobile and they won't run correctly with water or any other crud floating around in the fluid.These machines condensate quite a bit depending on the weather where the machine is located and impurities collect in them just like a trans.I'll be getting back to you this evening on your broken shaft.Sorry about the long drawn out post guys.

Ray French
 
Another thought;if your elevating nut is damaged they AIN'T cheap from anyone and they are matched to the particular screw installed on the machine at the time of manufacture.If your nut can't be repaired then you'll catch hell building a new one unless you really know Acme threading.I don't,although I did get lucky on the crossfeed nut and screw on my Hendey lathe.Aable machine wanted $1650.00 for a used replacement so I biult my own using items purchased from McMaster/Carr.I do have one K&T elevating srew nut but I doubt it will fit your machine and the bad thing is it's in perfect condition.Just to small I suspect.
 
Mr. French is right on about the filter issue. He sent me in that direction with my own 307. The knee filter is a big screen on the pump pickup. I spent a couple of hours trying to figure out how to get it off and out though the side access panel before I said "Screw This!". I am going to have to take the entire front of the knee off. I am guessing this is something you have already done? Any tips?
 
Actually the knee filter I finally got out of the 415 was an automotive type screw on filter.It had renforced flex lines running to a remote adapter and the filter was mounted to the adapter.It was just sort of laying deep in the knee.Getting to it proved to be the easy part.Getting it out the access hole was pure hell.According to K&T literature this was how it was supplied originally.Took a Fram Chevy P8HA filter to replace it.IIRC the one in the column,for the spindle was the same # but much easier to get at.If you can hear cavitation noises when trying to run the spindle or any other of the hydralics it could very well be air or the filter begging to be cleaned or replaced.I had one hell of a time getting the air out of that 415.Ended up pressure bleeding nearly every line on the thing.K&T recommends flushing their machines once a year,as I said.To do this drain all the oil out(over night if necessary)then fill it with kero or spirits and run it for an hour or so.I used a commercial grade spirits that pulls all the crap off the gears,bearings, and any other surface that it touches and deposits it at the drain point on the machine.It does an excellent job of cleaning screen type filters with out removing them,although removing them is still best.The spirits I used has an extremely quick evaporation rate.I spilled about a half gallon on my shop floor and before I could find anything to soak it up it had evaporated.If using this type of spirits I recommend draining immediately after you've run the machine.
 
other questions about an S12. Can anyone tell me the wire numbers for the coolant pump? I am trying to get an S12 ready for several jobs and the owner told me today the pump just stopped working. Motor is free. haven't tried to power it up yet.
 
jkilroy,the distribution box on mine had not been off since it was made. I watched the paint crack as I tighteened the jack screws to seperate the front plate. Even so the box slid right out like it was put together yesterday, amazing craftsmanship. I used the sm-66 maintence manual for directions, I can put the directions on here if you need them.

Tips; the manual recommends removing the vertical trip lever for easier assembly on the S-12, it sure helped getting it apart. You just lock the table and push the box out with the hand feed. I put the forklift forks right under it and it slid right onto them then slid it onto a lift table. It must be about 300lbs.
 
Learned alot on this project.I bought this machine on its outward appearance, which I know better but just needed a refresher. I bought it at a decent price but with the parts I have bought for it I could have got a "good one". But it is ready to go and I know that it is fixed.

It looks like the first owner had a clutch problem and "parked" it untill it was sold. I spent a day cleaning out the oil lines under the table so it could oil the ways and gears.

My first problem was the elevating nut on the knee. It looks like the threads were stressed some time to almost seize the nut on the screw. The knee works fine now.

The horizontal not coming on was due to a bad piston carrier assembly in the speed box. The piston is like a throw out bearing. The rings were so bad it would not pressure up and engage.

Don't know if anyone was interested but thought this might help other K&T owners out.
 








 
Back
Top