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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by metalpyro View Post
    Excellent Job!!! Your passion for metalcrafting is reflected in the finished product, for sure. I'm sure the 100 hours you say don't include the hours of what I call "Brain Time" before the first time you put pen to paper?

    I take the same kind of jobs mainly for the challenge. I hate bidding these projects, I would rather do T&M since the details usually can't be completely figured out early on.

    You're probably your own worse critic also. You expect more out of yourself than any customer expects. It's a curse, man, but it's not a character flaw.

    I say again, Excellent Job!!!
    Thank you, you do know what it’s like, obviously you have been there, done that!

    In this case the design wasn’t mine, so I didn’t sweat that part, but there was a bit of “brain time” on this figuring things out, and just living with the job in my head!

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    I enjoy seeing the work of others, especially when it's better than my own. None of the furniture I've made comes close to this. Outstanding craftsmanship, the metal work alone would have sent me through the wringer. The satisfaction of accomplishment AND being done with the project must have been two reasons to celebrate. Thanks for posting photos.

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  4. #23
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    But does the food taste better from a $45,000 table?

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    Wow! That is impressive.

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  7. #25
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    just experimenting with trying to post full size;


  8. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry Keeley View Post
    Very nice but some folks got WAY too much money!
    And I aim to get as mush as they'll give me.

  9. #27
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    We live in an area with a lot of premium woodworkers. Like out of this world premium. Guys that the National Park Service contacts to restore/stabilize the "Rising Sun" Chair that President Washington sat in during the drafting of the constitution.

    So a while back, an old guy in sweat pants (covered in flour - he'd been baking cookies with grandchildren) walks into one of the places that recreates vintage pieces. The type of place that buys logs that have been raised from the floor of Lake Michigan for 200 years after falling off a barge and sinking, so that they can have the proper wood. Anyway, the old guy had done some homework.
    "Could you recreate a 'Smith' chair?" [Smith is not right - I can't recall the actual name, but the chair is a 250 year old museum piece]
    "Yes sir, we could. That's a great chair design by the way"
    "Yeah, I like it too. How much would it cost?"
    "A chair like that, done properly, could be done for $5000"
    "Wow. A lot of money. Is it worth it?"
    "I can't answer that for you sir, but it IS a great chair and we can do a properly respectful job of recreation, and to do that $5000 is a fair price".
    "Hmmm. Ok, I'll take 16 of them".
    Turns out the old guy had a venture fund or some such and was a billionaire who really had an appreciation for fine furniture. He went on to let out about 2.5 million dollars (IIRC) in projects to the firm, to put in the house he'd just built (you can imagine the woodwork in the floors and walls of that house!).
    Anyway, the Rising Sun chair (beyond priceless), and some of the pieces from the commission (very dear!):

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  11. #28
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    I found the article online. I was pretty close to correct. The file has pictures of the furniture and house. Pretty awesome.

    https://irionlumber.s3.amazonaws.com...ssion-Ever.pdf

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  13. #29
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    That's kinda what I mean...the workmanship is incredible. And some of the stuff looks nice. But actually sit on it? Not so great. The worst of the worst...Frank Lloyd Wright. Spend 15 minutes on one of his chairs, head to the chiropractor.

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  15. #30
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    Impressive work cyanidekid, that table looks really well made! As a retired studio furniture maker, I can understand how the woodworking was done, but making the metal parts to fit perfectly is amazing. Well done! Do you know who the designer was?

    That Irion stuff just knocks me out, was not aware of it before. Incredible wood, and what looks like phenomenal craftsmanship (have to see it up close to really judge). Most people think those skills and knowledge are lost now, but clearly not. Ok, so that stuff ain't so comfortable, but it comes from a very different time. I guess people didn't expect to be comfortable all the time like we do.

    And as for those prices, it's the only wsy stuff like that can be made. The originals were probably equally costly in their time. Luckily for cabinet makers there have always been rich people who wanted to display their wealth, taste, and power in a material way. Just the way it is. Enabled me to have a career pushing my limits, til I burned out and the market collapsed.

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  17. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by GregSY View Post
    That's kinda what I mean...the workmanship is incredible. And some of the stuff looks nice. But actually sit on it? Not so great. The worst of the worst...Frank Lloyd Wright. Spend 15 minutes on one of his chairs, head to the chiropractor.
    My understanding is that Frank Lloyd Wright was an egotistical, self-centered control freak . Great aesthetics, not always so practical or comfortable. Somehow architects assume they are all great furniture designers, some are, most not.

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  19. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by yardbird View Post
    That looks Awesome! I love it! I'm not the most educated woodworker by any stretch of the imagination so don't be offended by this question. Because really it is beautiful. But how does it cost $45,000?

    Brent
    Because someone will pay that, and thus that is the market value.

    Do you think iPhones cost $1,100 for Apple to make? Or a car has a manufacturing cost anywhere close to what it sells for? Prices aren't set based off what it cost to make "plus a little profit". It's all about what someone will pay. There are endless products that would be useful and people want to have, but just can't be manufactured for a cost that people would pay, making them non-viable products.

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    It cost 45k because shop time is expensive based on rents, machinery and labor.
    The last yacht table I made was closing on 10k.
    Just a solid top with fiddles to mount on an existing pedestal.
    Nice enough- quite nice really but I would have griped about $500 if I were paying for it.

    One of the things I have never quite gotten over is not applying my own economics to a client.
    There are quite a few who want custom work, have a good ideal what it costs and happily pay the bill if you can provide it.
    It’s how artisans have made a buck from the beginning of time.

    Short story..
    I was at one of the waterfowl festivals the Eastern shore has all the time in these quaint towns on the bay.
    I stopped into a carvers booth who was making some very nice duck decoys of the kind you put in a glass case in the house.
    The guy has a whole presentation worked up- his accent, back history, cues for authenticity all through his manner- really a polished presentation.
    About a minute in we get to the spot where he realizes I’m just some chippy who is not buying his wares.
    He drops 90% of the sales pitch and we are just two guys in the trades talking about work.

    What do they say- ‘it’s good work if you can get it’...
    There are not that many workers who can produce at the top end of their trade.
    Fewer still who have the knack for presentation of their work.
    That makes that artisan and his work worth more to the clients who pursue such things and they are willing to pay for that distinction.

    I get a few referrals from the shop where I buy lumber.
    It’s usually for a person who has chosen some great slab of wood imported from the far ends of the earth and wants some signature table made from it for the great hall.
    I turn them all down- I just don’t have the design sense to hit a home run on projects like that and know it.
    If I had it I would sell it..

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  22. #34
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    Most fields have a 'top tier' of 'artisans' who are just that - excellent at presenting their product. The whole package. And most of those artisans are not the best at what they do...they just have the spiel down. For example...in the automotive world there are certain 'tuners' who will take your new $100K BMW or Viper or Corvette and spend another $75K tuning it for you. These are the same guys who get a lot of magazine time, have fancy logos, and a long history of bankruptcies and lawsuits over 'failure to perform'.

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  24. #35
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    do you get paid up front ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steven-Canada View Post
    do you get paid up front ?
    haha! sounds like you are planning a heist... like I said, I just did the metal, and trust me, its all gone already!

    thank you Richard, its good to be reminded I've got some skills now and then.

    the architecture firm did the design I believe, I think it was part of a multi- million apartment renovation.

    as to the food tasting better, I wouldn't know!

    tr, yea, never ask for a "reasonable" amount, that's a sure way to go broke.

  26. #37
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    Maybe they need some wood or metal serving trays to go with the table. How about making some chairs to match.
    Bil lD

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    Quote Originally Posted by GregSY View Post
    Most fields have a 'top tier' of 'artisans' who are just that - excellent at presenting their product. The whole package. And most of those artisans are not the best at what they do...they just have the spiel down. For example...in the automotive world there are certain 'tuners' who will take your new $100K BMW or Viper or Corvette and spend another $75K tuning it for you. These are the same guys who get a lot of magazine time, have fancy logos, and a long history of bankruptcies and lawsuits over 'failure to perform'.
    No joke on the automotive stuff. I've been the bail-out shop for a couple uber custom vehicle builds gone to shit by big name builders. Even with those big names and massive budgets they are often just parts changers and farm the complex stuff out. Guys that make really cool shit generally aren't good at impressing the big spending customers.

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  29. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by GregSY View Post
    That's kinda what I mean...the workmanship is incredible. And some of the stuff looks nice. But actually sit on it? Not so great. The worst of the worst...Frank Lloyd Wright. Spend 15 minutes on one of his chairs, head to the chiropractor.

    I grew up in Racine Wisconsin, home of Johnson's Wax. The Johnson family was a significant patron of FLW. He designed their HQ building, and a home that later was a conference center (Wingspread). Pretty awesome. But he designed some furniture for the HQ. I recall one chair had two legs in front and only a single one in back. Guys would lean back and go careening left or right...


    Pic of Wingspread, below:
    wingspread.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by Garwood View Post
    No joke on the automotive stuff. I've been the bail-out shop for a couple uber custom vehicle builds gone to shit by big name builders. Even with those big names and massive budgets they are often just parts changers and farm the complex stuff out. Guys that make really cool shit generally aren't good at impressing the big spending customers.
    yea like some of those dipshits with "reality" tv shows? OH, look what we got in the box today!! lets see if it fits on the bike, then we'll send it out to someone else who actually knows what they are doing! then someone will start yelling and screaming and throwing shit around.. fascinating..

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