Clausing variable speed drill press motor cuts out at speed.

bruszw1 · Jun 23, 2019

Hello,

I recently took delivery of a used Clausing Series 22V drill press in pretty good condition for the price: no spindle sloppiness, no evil bearing noises, only one small hole in the table. It has a 110V 1ph motor, 1725 RPM. It has a new variable speed drive belt, and it's been sitting around for a while. It appears that it has never seen the outdoors.

Here's what happened when I fired it up yesterday for the first time:

- started slowly at the lower end of the speed range; I had to help the thing start spinning;
- it ran fine at the lowest speed (300 at the spindle);
- it ran OK thru the speed range until I got to about 700 (top speed is 2000), then a breaker clicked in the motor and it began to slow down;
- at a lower motor speed, the breaker clicks and the motor accelerates, then, click, slows down, etc.
- I could only get the thing to run in a stable fashion when I decreased the drive speed by about 100 RPM
- it does not run at all when connected to GFC outlets in the shop (I've heard this is common with older motors)

What's going on here?

Today, I'm opening up the motor and inspecting wiring. I'm also gonna connect direct to a wall outlet without GFC. It is currently connected to the wall with a big extension cord (600V). The motor came with a 600V 12Ga power cord.

Thanks for your responses!

Walter

atomarc · Jun 23, 2019

Walter,

I would say your motor is dropping below the start/run threshold as it comes under load. It drops RPM, hits the start winding and zooms back up. The motor is either too small for the machine or there is some component that's imposing a greater load than the motor can power.

Is the belt new and relatively pliable or is it old and stiff..maybe with a kink in it. If it's a dual voltage motor, is it connected for the proper voltage?

Stuart

Bill D · Jun 23, 2019

Did the motor run fine without the belt? The grease in all the bearings is old and dry. Let it run and warm up the grease for a while before going to high speed and see what happens. I would say 5-120 minutes warm up time. If it still has problems feel all the bearings for heat.
Bill D.

thermite · Jun 23, 2019

bruszw1 said:
- started slowly at the lower end of the speed range; I had to help the thing start spinning;
- it ran fine at the lowest speed (300 at the spindle);
- it ran OK thru the speed range until I got to about 700 (top speed is 2000), then a breaker clicked in the motor and it began to slow down;
- at a lower motor speed, the breaker clicks and the motor accelerates, then, click, slows down, etc.
- I could only get the thing to run in a stable fashion when I decreased the drive speed by about 100 RPM
- it does not run at all when connected to GFC outlets in the shop (I've heard this is common with older motors)

What's going on here?

You didn't perchance have to change the male plug on that cord that came with it, did you?

Beside feeding it 120 where it is strapped for 240, a possibly faulty start/run switch, a single-phase motor "may" use a start capacitor, a "run" capacitor, one only, or neither.

If you have either/both, it may be time for a replacement.

CalG · Jun 23, 2019

If the motor is wired 220V, and supplied 110V, how does it behave?

jonok · Jun 23, 2019

I live right down the road from Clausing in Kalamazoo.

I was very pleasantly surprised a few years ago when I bought a big drill press at an auction and needed to replace bearings,belt and the actuator rod for the variable speed mechanism. I was resolved to source/make stuff on my own, but decided to call Clausing because they were close.

I got everything I needed for less than $50, it was all in stock, they gave me a nice cup of coffee, and a reprint manual for my drill press for lagniappe.

Even though everything they sell is now made somplace else, they will do their best to fix you up.

bruszw1 · Jun 25, 2019

Yup,

They are nice folks. I've spent a lot of time with them on the phone to figure out part numbers for this old drill press. I just talked to them again today and they recommended that I take the motor to a motor shop and have them look at it. Plus they provided me with the correct manual for my serial number plus a circuit diagram. We spent a while on the phone and the guy discussed it with his boss, too.

Quite a concept: call a number and a real person talks to you and gives you useful advice for no charge! I like it!

Walter

Milland · Jun 25, 2019

Glad to hear Clausing still gives great support!

But in your case you should just replace the motor before bothering with taking it to a motor shop. Smaller electric motors rarely have repair costs at a sensible level compared to getting a new one, unless the housing or other features are unique.

See if other suggestions on incoming power or wiring issues come up here, it still may be a simple fix for you. But if it's truly a damaged motor then make lemonade - see if there's a slightly more powerful one that will fit to give you more options on hole drilling.

bruszw1 · Jun 26, 2019

Good suggestion, especially the lemonade part!

Not being an electrical engineer (wish I was!), I'd just like the motor shop to pronounce the thing dead or alive. More power, or especially less speed, or even 3ph 240V would be fine with me. And there is always eBay . . . for a new motor.

Getting the motor out is also gonna allow me to check for mechanical load from the spindle and jackshaft bearings. Also, there may be something sketchy about the switch wiring and / or the ancient (1960s) switch.

It still is a fine specimen of a tool, and just what the shop needs.

Patience!

Walter

bruszw1 · Jul 2, 2019

Here is the progess on the vintage Clausing drill press: It works!!

I did know that the thing was a dual-voltage single phase motor. I pulled the birds-nest of wires out of the motor junction box and my first response was brain-lock!

Then I consulted YouTube, searching for "dual voltage motors". I figured out the different winding leads with a multimeter and found that the thing was wired for 220V. I only have 110V at the spot for the machine and am too lazy to bring 220 to it. Changed the motor wiring to 110 and it's done.

Problem, however. When I get the thing up to max speed (2000 RPM at the spindle), it sounds like an airplane. There is a fair component that is belt noise, particularly the Reeves drive belt. It's new (a Dayco) and probably stiff. What should I do?

Eventually, I will isolate the motor and see how the spindle and jackshaft bearings are. Maybe the noise is coming from there.

Thanks,

Walter

thermite · Jul 2, 2019

bruszw1 said:
Problem, however. When I get the thing up to max speed (2000 RPM at the spindle), it sounds like an airplane. There is a fair component that is belt noise, particularly the Reeves drive belt. It's new (a Dayco) and probably stiff. What should I do?

In increasing order of spend:

- Free: JF get used to it. Nature of the beast.

- Free: be glad it isn't a workalike Powermatic DP as those were even noisier. Brain numbing off an 8-hour shift. DAMHIKT.

- Cheap: learn to make holes at lower speeds than "calculated".

- Cheap: wear a good grade of ear protection.

- Costly: earn enough money with it to upgrade to an Alzmetall. Their variable-speed drives are not as annoying. OTOH, they get to price their DP according. TANSTAAFL.

atomarc · Jul 2, 2019

Bill,

Looks like you're nearly back up to full steam after your forced hiatus. More gibberish and lots more posts. Welcome back..

Stuart

thermite · Jul 2, 2019

atomarc said:
Bill,

More gibberish and lots more posts. Welcome back..

Stuart

Only the first 30 days was a gift from PM(S), but thanks...

And I'm serious. One didn't appreciate the old Clausing variable speed DP's as "not all THAT noisy" ...until.... "the Company" replaced our one with a new Powermatic of similar specification.... and lower cost.

Purchasing Manager didn't have to run the rude bugger. We did. Worse - in all-shift-long "production" tasking, not just the odd few holes needed once in a while.

bruszw1 · Jul 3, 2019

Bill,

Thanks! I'm applying all your suggestions except the last. Good thing I didn't get a Powermatic! I wondered about Alzmetall; there are always a few on eBay.

thermite · Jul 3, 2019

bruszw1 said:
Bill,

Thanks! I'm applying all your suggestions except the last. Good thing I didn't get a Powermatic! I wondered about Alzmetall; there are always a few on eBay.

About as good as "column" drills ever got, or do still - especially the no longer made AB5/S @ 7 HP and around 4,400 lbs Avoir with the big rectangular table.

I credit ( or is it "blame"..?) Milacron himself for whetting my appetite for 'em in several threads on PM. That, and lacking space and headroom for a proper Canedy-Otto, Cincinnati-Bickford, or ATW radial.

crrmeyer · Jul 3, 2019

bruszw1 said:
Problem, however. When I get the thing up to max speed (2000 RPM at the spindle), it sounds like an airplane. There is a fair component that is belt noise, particularly the Reeves drive belt. It's new (a Dayco) and probably stiff. What should I do?

Years ago as a kid my Dad buys a 17" Rockwell Delta drill press with the variable speed Reeve drive. It squealed like a pig! Many years later I end up with it and it was still really loud! Replacing the belt did no good. But I have converted other drill presses to DC motor drive with very good results, so I find the parts to convert the variable speed drive back to step pulley with a big DC motor. Right before I start the conversion teardown, I see a mention that Powermatic recommends in their old manuals rubbing solid paraffin wax on the belt edge to quiet the noise on their reeves drive type drill presses. So for fun I try it out. It quieted down a fair bit. This did not minimize the volume of the swearing coming from the shop as I starred at all the parts and motor I had just acquired. In the end I did end up making the DC motor conversion. That remind me, I should really sell all those Reeves drive related parts.

So try rubbing some paraffin wax on the belt edges WHEN IT IS NOT RUNNING.

CalG · Jul 3, 2019

I've got my Clausing 15 inch VS on a VFD.

There always seems to be some combination that results in a "less noisy" operation. And for drilling 5/8" and larger, slowing things down is so useful! I tend towards using the VFD 20- 70hz, always trying for 45-65 hz, and the VS as required, but usually at the low end. I've got an old Sears DP for the little holes and wood.

bruszw1 · Jul 19, 2019

I like the paraffin wax idea! I always have a few blocks of it around in the shop. I consider it "the secret weapon" for some obscure problems.

Thanks a lot! I will try to remember to not do it while the machine is running.

Walter

Clausing variable speed drill press motor cuts out at speed.

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