Coolant going bad after a month of inactivity machine stood idle

lionelt · Jul 23, 2015

I've not used my turning centre for a month, just had a new mill delivered so been painting the floor and walls and generally having a good tidy up.

Changed the coolant yesterday as when I pulled out the drawer to check, it had black patches all over it.

Any suggestions to stop this happening?

Had similar happen on a couple of manual machines and adding a litre of Dettol solved the problem. Jeyes Fluid helped in the past but workshop smelt like public toilet.

machtool · Jul 23, 2015

Use it or lose it. A month off? Cycle your coolant pump at least one per week, Failing that an air bubbler just to keep the coolant turning over will help.

and adding a litre of Dettol

Our American brothers mightn't get that. Its a disinfectant. Kind of shit you can poor on your hands when you shred a bit of blood. Dr. Google tells me its, Chloroxylenol, Isopropyl Alcohol & Pine Oil.

It's the U.K / Aus equivalent of adding a dash of bleach.

Terry Z · Jul 23, 2015

run TRIM microsol 685 after a machine cleaning no more problems for us.

machtool · Jul 23, 2015

"Turning Centre". You aught to be in the CNC section. Double Pom mistake. CNC & Dettol CNC Machining

machtool · Jul 23, 2015

Jeyes Fluid helped in the past but workshop smelt like public toilet.

Could that be, that Jeyes is a public toilet cleaner.

http://www.jeyes.com/en-gb/our-products/jeyes-fluid/

PixMan · Jul 23, 2015

Bacteria festering because the coolant had a thin layer of tramp oils over the top. Seal off the oxygen supply to the coolant, bacteria blooms. Solutions (as mentioned) is keep a small air bubbler (fish aquarium pump) running, a tramp oil skimmer, or at least run it for a bit every few days.

In my home shop I've had a full synthetic coolant in my lathe and my surface grinder for 6 and 3 years, respectively. I have no tramp oil skimmers, and I rarely use the coolant pumps. While the surface grinder doesn't ever get any tramp oil and is no problem, I do get that on the lathe. My solution is to manually clean tramp oil off the top with hydrophilic pads. They absorb oil but not water, so I just take a small patch of the fiber pad and lay it on the surface of the coolant tank for a few minutes. When I lift it, I fold it with the oiled surface in and toss it. Top off coolant by ALWAYS adding a very low concentration of coolant, NEVER adding straight water.

No problems.

JRIowa · Jul 23, 2015

Secrets to long coolant life

1. start with a clean machine. IE, wash you machine and coolant sump out BEFORE filling
2. use a quality semi or full synthetic coolant
3. use RO or DI water for the mix.
4. do add stuff to your coolant system that the coolant makers hasn't approved
5. check your coolant with a refractometer.
6. have a "make up mix"
7. bubblers are good, but you go from anaerobic to aerobic bacteria which gives a higher risk of dermatitis.
8. get a tramp oil skimmer.
JR

lionelt · Jul 23, 2015

machtool said:
Use it or lose it. A month off? Cycle your coolant pump at least one per week, Failing that an air bubbler just to keep the coolant turning over will help.

Our American brothers mightn't get that. Its a disinfectant. Kind of shit you can poor on your hands when you shred a bit of blood. Dr. Google tells me its, Chloroxylenol, Isopropyl Alcohol & Pine Oil.

It's the U.K / Aus equivalent of adding a dash of bleach.

No not bleach, that contain hypoclorite and can cause rusting.

Jeyes fluid old school method in the UK, used for years to sterilise soil with gardeners amongst other uses.

lionelt · Jul 23, 2015

JRIowa said:
Secrets to long coolant life

1. start with a clean machine. IE, wash you machine and coolant sump out BEFORE filling
2. use a quality semi or full synthetic coolant
3. use RO or DI water for the mix.
4. do add stuff to your coolant system that the coolant makers hasn't approved
5. check your coolant with a refractometer.
6. have a "make up mix"
7. bubblers are good, but you go from anaerobic to aerobic bacteria which gives a higher risk of dermatitis.
8. get a tramp oil skimmer.
JR

Thanks for all the detail, yes use a refractometer, I am using Blasocut BC 25-MD.

I have a skimmer that is moved from tank to tank.

Have considered deionised water, cost about £10.00 for 25 litres, my turning centre takes 100 to 125 litres.

Usually I have no problem with not using the machine regularly.

Just noticed it this time.

lionelt · Jul 23, 2015

PixMan said:
Bacteria festering because the coolant had a thin layer of tramp oils over the top. Seal off the oxygen supply to the coolant, bacteria blooms. Solutions (as mentioned) is keep a small air bubbler (fish aquarium pump) running, a tramp oil skimmer, or at least run it for a bit every few days.

In my home shop I've had a full synthetic coolant in my lathe and my surface grinder for 6 and 3 years, respectively. I have no tramp oil skimmers, and I rarely use the coolant pumps. While the surface grinder doesn't ever get any tramp oil and is no problem, I do get that on the lathe. My solution is to manually clean tramp oil off the top with hydrophilic pads. They absorb oil but not water, so I just take a small patch of the fiber pad and lay it on the surface of the coolant tank for a few minutes. When I lift it, I fold it with the oiled surface in and toss it. Top off coolant by ALWAYS adding a very low concentration of coolant, NEVER adding straight water.

No problems.

Do try and keep the oil off with a skimmer. top up with a lower percentage, usually run on 5 to 6 percent, top about 3 percent as the water evaporates off and it can go up to 12 percent by the time it runs low.

Have just orders an air pump so will give that a try as well.

Thanks

lionelt · Jul 23, 2015

Terry Z said:
run TRIM microsol 685 after a machine cleaning no more problems for us.

Tried a few soluable oils over the years using Blasocut BC 25MD now.

Not had any problems untill recently.

Larry Dickman · Jul 23, 2015

lionelt said:
Tried a few soluable oils over the years using Blasocut BC 25MD now.

Not had any problems untill recently.

We ditched the Blaser a couple years ago because of the smell. We use Trim 585XT with no problems at all.

TedinNorfolk · Jul 24, 2015

Sure your operators aren't weeing in it? &#55357;&#56832;

lionelt · Jul 24, 2015

TedinNorfolk said:
Sure your operators aren't weeing in it? &#55357;&#56832;

One man shop.

Strange that it's been fine for years then suddenly goes bad. Gets changed about twice a year. Machine used every three weeks or so. Run of a few hundred blanks one week then run them in the mill the following weeks.

JRIowa · Jul 24, 2015

lionelt said:
Have considered deionised water, cost about £10.00 for 25 litres, my turning centre takes 100 to 125 litres.

I use distilled water in my home shop, $.99/gal at the grocery store. Here where we have a couple hundred machines, the shop is plumbed for RO.
JR

alonzo83 · Jul 24, 2015

One machine in the shop almost never gets used. I turn the coolant on once a week and add a bit in the hot months, good to go.

tomwalz · Jul 27, 2015

Don't put anything in your coolant you wouldn't want to breathe.

vanguard machine · Jul 27, 2015

i rarely run flood and yet i keep coolant in the tanks for a very long time btwn changes. the trick is distilled water and a cheap $10 aquarium pump to keep things circulating. just set it on the bottom with a homespun filter over the inlet (piece of scotchbrite)and keep the return hose a little off the surface so it continually 'splashes' a little.
i may have to buy a new one every year or two for each tank, much better than dumping 20 gallons of coolant down the drain.
an air stone will help as well tremendously and they are also super cheap. both can be found at your biog box or local pet supply.

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