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  1. #881
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    Quote Originally Posted by jz79 View Post
    what puzzles me (as non doctor) is how some are apparently hit very hard, yet others in same age group and similar condition get over it with just the fever

    I'm thinking the worse cases were with people who were under constant exposure for days (asymptomatic carriers that have went contagious), they got high doses of the virus in their lungs, milder cases might have been less exposed (or got it from touching a contaminated surface and then T area on their face), so the immune system started already reacting when smaller doses of the virus had caused some damage, so I'm guessing - the greater initial exposure - the crazier the immune system reaction is, the worse it gets till (if) it starts to get better

    I'm on 4-5th day since I noticed odd stuff, sore mouth, not throat, but mouth, then throat, then little chest tightness, hasn't gotten any better or worse for last couple days, mouth and throat feels fine, but the lungs remain "hot", yesterday evening noticed chill sensation (not yet fever), today measured around 38C (or 100F), but no difficulties breathing, no coughing either, not risking going to the testing centers though...
    I also wonder if this gets worse more often for those who medicate themselves with ibuprofen/paracetamol and keep on rocking/working like nothing happened?
    Normal flu(influenza) is well known to kill you lot more likely if you don't take rest.

    I have had also non-typical "flu" or upper respiratory infection for a 7 days now. Only slight fewer first 2 days, tightness of chest, mild couch or itchy throat and exhausted even by just standing. Now seem to be getting better, pulse oximeter readings are also slowly getting back to normal. Pulse oximeter was reading 94-95% SP02 when chest felt worse, now back to 98%

  2. #882
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    One thing I have noticed is that with traditional care methods, we are keeping these patients lying down. That is a normal reaction when anyone of us is really sick.

    The human body is normally upright and the lymphatic system works best when we are vertical.

    I suspect that we could lessen the severity of the lung inflammation if we would at least keep the patients setting up early on in the disease process. Help keep the lung fluid accumulation minimized.

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    I'm watching these two for news regarding this, general media seems pretty useless in this regard

    YouTube

    and this explains the mechanics as understood so far
    YouTube

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy2 View Post
    One thing I have noticed is that with traditional care methods, we are keeping these patients lying down. That is a normal reaction when anyone of us is really sick.

    The human body is normally upright and the lymphatic system works best when we are vertical.

    I suspect that we could lessen the severity of the lung inflammation if we would at least keep the patients setting up early on in the disease process. Help keep the lung fluid accumulation minimized.
    Doesn't it bother you that doctors and hospitals don't know they should be doing as you suggest? Slight sarcasm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattiJ View Post
    I also wonder if this gets worse more often for those who medicate themselves with ibuprofen/paracetamol and keep on rocking/working like nothing happened?
    Normal flu(influenza) is well known to kill you lot more likely if you don't take rest.

    I have had also non-typical "flu" or upper respiratory infection for a 7 days now. Only slight fewer first 2 days, tightness of chest, mild couch or itchy throat and exhausted even by just standing. Now seem to be getting better, pulse oximeter readings are also slowly getting back to normal. Pulse oximeter was reading 94-95% SP02 when chest felt worse, now back to 98%
    interesting you noted the self medication and anti inflammatories, one of the channels I mentioned earlier, the doctor there looked into Spanish flu and aspirin was the new wonder drug at the time, and stats show a huge deaths spike after they used aspirin to treat that flu, not conclusive of course, but interesting non the less

    YouTube

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trueturning View Post
    . . . I just think when you are baiting good Christian folk about the POTUS you should not jump tracks . . .
    Hope this comes across as inquiring rather than baiting. Can you explain what "good Christian folk" love and admire in a POTUS who's broken 9 of the 10 Commandments, says he's never done anything to apologize for (much less repent) and claimed his supporters wouldn't care if he shot someone in broad daylight (breaking the last remaining one of those 10 Commandments)?

    That's pretty much 0 for 10, with no recognition or intent to do better. Disregard for safety and deaths on his jobsites - and citizens in the current pandemic - and kids at the border - and support of Saudi Arabia -- might actually count as flying in the face of that "thou shalt not kill" thing.

    Is it the honesty you like? His relations with women? The modesty? His willingness to listen to those with vastly more knowledge? How he's earned his money? His empathy and regard for others; Golden Rule and all?

    Serious question. Far as I can tell it's a tribal thing. More us vs. them than a serious question along the lines of "what would Jesus do?"

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    1 in every 22000 folks have it on the planet and it is decimating our economies. Sheesh

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattiJ View Post
    I also wonder if this gets worse more often for those who medicate themselves with ibuprofen/paracetamol and keep on rocking/working like nothing happened?
    Normal flu(influenza) is well known to kill you lot more likely if you don't take rest.

    I have had also non-typical "flu" or upper respiratory infection for a 7 days now. Only slight fewer first 2 days, tightness of chest, mild couch or itchy throat and exhausted even by just standing. Now seem to be getting better, pulse oximeter readings are also slowly getting back to normal. Pulse oximeter was reading 94-95% SP02 when chest felt worse, now back to 98%
    The Ibuprofen/paracetamol does seem to exacerbate the immune response mechanism making the disease process worse. Tylenol/acetaminophen is the better choice for the Covid-19.

    Good to hear that you seem to be recovering.

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    The fascinating thing to me:

    Italy, China, US, Germany, Spain time from 100-20000 cases: 20 days + or -

    China, Italy, Spain, high mortality, US, Germany, not so much

    I mean, lung health, Germans smoke like chimneys apparently

    Age? Germany is older than Italy or Spain, we are younger

    Density? Germany is more dense than Italy. Spain less, US way less.

    I mean, just an item of curiosity, but it seems so much like a different thing

    Germany is a total statistical outlier, 2 critical cases, I don't know if I can buy that. I mean, more than two old Italians must have wandered into German hospitals

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon B. Clarke View Post
    Doesn't it bother you that doctors and hospitals don't know they should be doing as you suggest? Slight sarcasm.
    I dunno, pretty much the worst position for giving birth is flat on your back, and whattaya know, thass how the doctors do ya

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    Quote Originally Posted by gustafson View Post
    China, Italy, Spain, high mortality, US, Germany, not so much
    You have to be careful with China numbers. There's the Wuhan numbers, and there's the rest of the country numbers. They are very different. Wuhan was like 4%, rest of the country under 1%. The US will probably not hit the low mark.

    If you are doing fatality stats, there's a jump when you can't accomodate all the patients. If you have enough equipment you can keep a lot of them breathing until they recover. But when you exceed hospital capacity, it's over for however many new ones you get. Last numbers I saw were about 15% of cases need hospitalization.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trueturning View Post
    Are you and Milland bored? It is understandable in times like this. Changing up the regular Trump bashing to include Bill Clinton is like a train jumping to another track right.
    Was for a while but should be back working now ... except this is like a giant train wreck, impossible to look away

    About Bill, you were not paying attention. I have despised Slick Willy since he sold out the democratic party. NAFTA, the Bank Modernization and Corruption Enabling Act, selling off the media, Alan Greenspan, Larry Summers, Robert Rubin, too many other things to count. The man is scum, absolute scum. Your ears should be less tribal.

    What we're working to avoid is a time, a month later, then 1 becomes 2, then 4, then 8, then 16, then 32, 64, 128, 256 . .. until it's something like 11,000 of 22,000 folks.
    Right now in the US it's doubling every 2 to 3 days.

    But he may have a point, PeteM. If you can't stop it (or won't), the other option is to hand out morphine and get it over with asap.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Speedie View Post
    1 in every 22000 folks have it on the planet and it is decimating our economies. Sheesh
    What we're working to avoid is a time, a month later, when 1 becomes 2, then 4, then 8, then 16, then 32, 64, 128, 256 . .. until it's something like 11,000 of 22,000 folks.

    Like a fire with plenty of fuel it is both possible for this to grow exponentially and possible to put it out. Sooner we contain it, the better.

    That doesn't make sense to you?

    If not, search for coronavirus in Italy for an example of a country that let it grow a bit too fast - even with good doctors etc.

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    It's a lovely day in the Manchester area today. We have a really nice country park by a nearby lake close where I live. Today it had to be closed because of the numbers visiting it ! Garden centres are packed apparently. This is the UK supposedly under lock down. Pubs in Scotland refused to close on Friday night and now an emergency law is being rushed out to compel closure by law.

    We truly are terminally stupid in the UK. The results of 40 years of the " We do what we want " culture.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gustafson View Post
    On the positive side, yesterday new cases dropped for the first time in this country, and the previous day cases did not double.

    Not time to get excited, as Italy had a similar pause at around 2 weeks after the 100 case mark[which apparently means something] and kept right on growing after that.

    It does make sense, as it has been about a week since many state restrictions started coming into play.
    Aaaaaaaaaaaaand 4 hours later NY testing numbers come in, doubling cases and adding 80 deaths

    Jezuus

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    Quote Originally Posted by EmanuelGoldstein View Post
    Jing'an district, Shanghai.
    Thanks....and yeah context. Doing a bit of studying up to bring me up to date....Guess it's fair to say..."Shanghai--Too Big To Fail" that's for sure.

    Looks to be an amazing city.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces View Post
    It's a lovely day in the Manchester area today. We have a really nice country park by a nearby lake close where I live. Today it had to be closed because of the numbers visiting it ! Garden centres are packed apparently. This is the UK supposedly under lock down. Pubs in Scotland refused to close on Friday night and now an emergency law is being rushed out to compel closure by law.

    We truly are terminally stupid in the UK. The results of 40 years of the " We do what we want " culture.

    Regards Tyrone.
    If hand sanitizer with alcohol kills the virus maybe the booze will from the inside out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dualkit View Post
    alcohol kills the virus maybe the booze will from the inside out.
    that's what I am betting on

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    Quote Originally Posted by gustafson View Post
    Aaaaaaaaaaaaand 4 hours later NY testing numbers come in, doubling cases and adding 80 deaths

    Jezuus
    oh boy.

    EG: remember that "bet" on 80k infected in US by wednesday?
    Well they just hit 13000 new cases in New York alone.
    38000 cases total at the moment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dualkit View Post
    If hand sanitizer with alcohol kills the virus maybe the booze will from the inside out.
    They tried that theory in Iran. Only a couple dozen died. Seems that they only had methanol available and didn't know the difference between methanol and isopropanol.


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