Craftsman Tools -- RIP - Page 3
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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by juergenwt View Post
    Do we have someone like ANSI or SAE specify the minimum requirements for hand tool in the US? If "YES" - than why are those not listed by the manufacturer.
    I cannot say for other types of hand tools but I know there are ASME standards for torque tools and drive tools that go over things like the minimum amount of force that can be used to pull the socket off of a square drive, the dimensional tolerances of the square, etc.

    Fun fact (not really) - for torque wrenches to comply to the applicable ASME standard(s) they need to be cycled at full capacity for 5,000 applications in each calibrated direction (CW/CCW) and still be within 4% accuracy in the CW direction and 6% in the CCW direction. THEN they are to be cycled 20,000 times at 50% capacity, after which they are not required to be within calibration but they need to be able to be calibrated.

    Here's the thing...who the hell is testing and enforcing the ASME B107.300 torque wrench spec calibration life requirement test? No one! We list the ASME, ANSI, and MIL standards our tools comply to but, in short, I feel like no one just cares any more. There is a scary lack of...integrity, shall we say? in our culture. I feel like no one "cares" or "values" doing things "right" (whatever that means). I know this makes me sound older and grouchier than I probably am but it takes a special kind of weirdo to run the family torque wrench business...torque wrench talk at Thanksgiving, torque wrench talk at birthday parties, etc.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by ratbldr427 View Post
    I have a couple of the torque wrenches made by Precision ,Snap On inch lb and ft lb.
    What type of Snap-On? TQ, QT, TE... Maybe we made them! Let me know if you ever need help or have any questions!

  3. #43
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    I don't see the surprise? Their ratchets and wrenches have been junk for 20+ years. The sockets are OK, as are the extensions, but they wont fit where a Snap On will because they're much larger. The screwdrivers are an offense to any hand.

    Ive never had their pliers, they could be great....but I'll stick to Knipex.

    There's two reasons to pick up a hand tool, pleasure or need, and neither are the time for fuckwit devices like Craftsman.

    Sent from my SM-G930R4 using Tapatalk

  4. #44
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    I need any hand tools these days, I order from McMaster. Dont know what brand I'm gonna get, and don't care. I just know it's not gonna be crap and that's good enough.

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  6. #45
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    Standards for tools are pretty meaningless ,except in the case of Indian made cast iron tools .....quite a few of them about.Far as I know the top grade of nut and bolt tools now is Stahlwille ....I have a few of their combi wrenches ....and no I didnt buy them for sure ,
    probably purloined them...All my original mechanics tools have long since worn the chrome off ,been busted with impact wrenches ,or lost ....Some years ago I bought a job lot of chrome sockets for scrap price .....most partially roll stamped for various illustrious tool brands ,rejected for faulty roll marking ,not any manufacturing fault.......which set me to thinking .....if I roll stamp a blank socket ,can I say its manufactured in USA?

  7. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    if I roll stamp a blank socket ,can I say its manufactured in USA?
    Not truthfully. It needs to be “all or virtually all” made in the USA.

  8. #47
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    I'm kinda proud of the fact that my tools are a hodge-podge of makes and models I've accumulated over the years.....not a shiny memorial to Snap-On or any other big brand. I have some of almost every tool. Probably Blackhawk and Mac are my 'favorites' but I also have some nice S-K and Barcoloy and Williams tools among others.

    The Craftsman stuff...the best of the lot are the 'V' series wrenches. I have a 1/2" x 9/16" that I actually used so much I wore the teeth out of and it can no longer be used. That's a lot of use, not because it was crummy steel.

    The Craftsman ratchets have always been clunky and easy to break. The screwdrivers...good enough to work well but not so good you weren't afraid to sacrifice when stupid-time arose.

  9. #48
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    I also have a mix of brands including some used 'USA Made back when they were good' bought at yard sales or ebay.

    I still have many of the old good quality Craftsman as well as SK Tools, Snap-on, Mac, and dozens of other brands. Some of the newer tools are European or Japanese and some are even quality Taiwan-made. Even my woodworking gouges and chisels are a mix of Marples, Stanley Sheffield, old USA Stanley, Buck Brothers, and several other odds and ends.

    All I care about is that they work.

    I even have a couple of items from Horror Fright such as a serpentine belt wrench which is nothing more than a flat piece of steel with a 3/8 square drive welded in and then painted with a vinyl handle added. Works fine on the rare occasions I need it with high quality sockets of course.

    Years ago I replaced a bearing in the electric clutch unit of a Harrison A/C compressor in-car using a couple of inexpensive remove/replace tools (about $15 each) from JC Whitney. Along with the bearing and a few other items the repair cost me about $60 instead of $300 for a rebuilt compressor.

  10. #49
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    I know most of the conversation is about mechanics tools, but I do miss a lot of the other 'stuff' branded craftsman

    All of the Sears tools were what I would call 'reliable'

    not great, but great, but useful

    If you tried to buy something from HF or Kmart[historically] it may break on first use or just be unsuitable

    YOu know like hand drills. You get older and start buying Milwaukee or something, but you got some miles out of Craftsman drill

    I still own a couple craftsman drill presses at work. Basically always for deburring. Was a time I would be ready to turn out the lights and hear a quiet hum. Floor model craftsman drill press thrumming along....They were just a step up from the other Chinese crap, a little better handles, little better finishing. Throw an off brand keyless on them and set them beside the CNC knee mill before I had tool changers. Could run out at night and pick one up, chuck is in from MSC in the morning and off we go. Scouring the used market for a 'real' one was not in the cards.

  11. #50
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    Thanks guys for the input. Most of my Craftsman exchanges over the years are to replace worn out screwdrivers. I'm in the same camp as Greg:

    Quote Originally Posted by GregSY View Post
    The screwdrivers...good enough to work well but not so good you weren't afraid to sacrifice when stupid-time arose.
    I use them like properly most of the time, but I will admit that they sometimes end up being used for inappropriate uses like pry bars.

    Many moons ago I bought myself a trio (1/4, 3/8, 1/2) of their "fine tooth" ratchets and I gotta say that I've been very satisfied. I also have a couple of their rebuild kits in the toolbox so if I break a pawl I'm still OK. So assuming I don't snap the handle or something, I should be good there.

    One of the other things that was originally quite good was their needle file sets and they carried the same lifetime guarantee, so when they got dull or I snapped one, I could get a new set. Now, however, they are coarse toothed crap. Last time I swapped those out a bunch of years ago, I was much less enthusiastic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobw View Post
    Those POS coarse tooth ratchets. Absolute pure GARBAGE. I've finally thrown them all away. There are a
    couple of dents in the roll up doors from when my knuckles got mangled and the POS ratchets somehow
    got launched.

    And yes, I did THROW them away. I wouldn't give one of those POS's to my worst enemy.


    And when I was a kid, I thought Craftsman was the only company that made hand tools.
    And they used to be good, I haven't bought a Craftsman tool in 18 and a half years,
    and the hand tools and sockets were decent, but those ratchets...
    There used to be an empty lot across the street from my parents house.

    Today there's a house there.

    Somewhere under that house is the last craftsman ratchet I ever owned.

    I put my knuckles in to the radiator trying to remove an alternator when the POS let go...and I let it fly. A very calculated decision, since I removed the socket first.

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  14. #52
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    FTF Engineering --

    I consider the Craftsman "fine tooth round head" ratchets that were introduced in the earliest 1970s (IIRC) to be, by far, the queens of the Craftsman Ratchet Ball. That said, they were the homely sisters of their clan. Their maker, Moore Drop Forge -- which became Easco, which itself became Danaher Hand Tool Division -- put the same mechanisms into round-shank-with-knurled-cylindrical-grips bodies that were branded as Easco, K-D, and Allen (Danaher brands), and as house brands for several large hardware chains.

    Ironically, the later "economy model" Craftsman round-head ratchet that was introduced a couple of decades later, was undoubtedly the crappiest piece of crap ratchet I've run into. Between the tiny grip and lousy mechanism, they weren't really worth the effort of throwing them away . . . although I've chucked several of them into a deep canyon or into the bay.

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    John, I looked for my ratchet style on Sears' website, but couldn't find them. I assume (since they WERE worth a crap) they stopped selling them.

    I found them for sale on ebay though. People on ebay refer to them as "V Series".

    Mine all say "Forged in USA" on them and they look like this. Are these the queens of the ball you referred to above? :

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  18. #54
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    Interestingly, besides the old examples, I have a few Craftsman metric combo wrenches for some Japanese workholding used on the Bridgeport. They are nice forged wrenches, stamped made in USA and I bought them new circa 2010 direct from Sears. As nice as the Wright combo wrenches are, I think the Craftsman handles are better shaped for grip- OTOH Wright makes a big deal about the fancy shaping of the jaws though I don't push the wrenches hard enough to tell the difference.

    I have a metric toolbox for the motorcycle, a bunch of those tools are later purchases from Sears- certainly not up to the quality of the above examples.

    While looking thru the wrenches, looks like I have a fair number of made in USA Kobalt wrenches which are (were) pretty good value for money- a coarse finish on the shank instead of chromed to help with grip and so on. I've not been in the Lowes tool aisle recently, don't know if they still sell the USA made tools.

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    I found a Craftsman ratchet in a ditch at a cattle feedlot 25 years ago, I thought I had a prize now I know why it was there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FTF Engineering View Post

    Mine all say "Forged in USA" on them and they look like this. Are these the queens of the ball you referred to above? :
    Definitely some of the best ratchets to ever wear the Craftsman name, I have several of them (as well as some that aren't marked Craftsman).

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  22. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by excello View Post
    I have a pair of Diamond "Diamalloy" groove joint pliers.They have that neat horseshoe and diamond logo.Very good quality. Bought 'em new back in the early 70's probably about when I bought my Wright socket set. Also have a 15" Mont.Wards adjustable wrench which was made by Diamond - good tools.
    I grew up on a farm in Lancashire and in the workshop we had an 18" adjustable wrench of great quality. It was a Diamalloy and I always liked the description ' Manufactured by the Diamond Caulk Horseshoe Company of Duluth, Minnesota USA' My uncle thought it was probably sent over in WW2 and he probably bought it from a Gvt surplus shop- Williamsons of Oldham.

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  24. #58
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    I join the group of broken Craftsmen ratchet people. I believe that was the only Craftsmen hand tool I ever had fail. I am not sure about it's year of origin, but believe I returned it in the late 90's. I got a used one as an exchange that looked like someone used it as a hammer frequently.

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    I have several of those round head Craftsman ratchets pictured above as well. Out of all my Craftsman ratchets, those are the only ones I've never had a problem with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LIFTED View Post
    I've brought some broken Craftsman stuff to Lowes.

    They will honor the guarantee with a Chinese replacement... if they have the item in stock...
    They won't brake open a kit to replace a socket.

    They bought the brand and "reputation" - I don't feel guilty.
    That's all this country is running on, is "Brand fumes".
    I don't feel guilty about it at all, it wasn't the working class that tried to have a brand without manufacturing it here. The knuckleheads who caused this to happen basically destroyed the brand they valued so much, when they sent the manufacturing elsewhere.

    BTW, all my Craftsman ratchets have the "flying vee" with oil ports, and they work just fine
    (see pic)

    wrenches.jpg


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