What's new
What's new

Cutting small gear teeth on index 55 vert mill? DIY garage

Homebrewblob

Stainless
Joined
Apr 5, 2020
Location
Cincinnati
Hi all, I have a 1952ish index 55 (not super) knee mill with original flaking on all the ways so I feel it holds a tight tolerance.

I am not a pro and only have a “garage shop”.

I want to expand my Capabilities to include cutting my own gears.

I’m interested in hearing any advice on common/recommended setups
And if my index knee mill would work for this.

I know technically it would but your guy’s opinions are worth 10x what a vintage index sales Brochure can offer.

I’m not lookin to build ring gears nor oil tanker parts :D

I’m thinking basic gears in the range of 1” to 10”ISH*

I’m learning every day and so far it feels like I open (PDF) a book before I do anything and still lack the important info those of you have learned in the Field.

So far it looks like I need cutters that are Appropriate for the tooth count I’m cutting and an indexing wheel.

Anything more really?

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
 
You'll be best served by getting a dividing head and tail stock.

This is the input I seek.

So my (mis)understanding was the dividing head (what I (Incorrectly) referred To as a indexing wheel) would hold the gear on some sort of arbor.

You suggest using a table mounted tailstock and dividing head to hold the gear blank huh?
 
if anyone is interested in pictures!

attachment.php


attachment.php


attachment.php


now the next pic is with a hand held shop light directly above the way at a 90 degree angle and it really makes the frosting disappear, belive me there is NO spot in this old beast that is without flaking :drool5: :) :cloud9:

—-redacted—-

if you cant tell i LOVE this mill
 
Last edited:
attachment.php


attachment.php


attachment.php


now the next pic is with a hand held shop light directly above the way at a 90 degree angle and it really makes the frosting disappear, belive me there is NO spot in this old beast that is without flaking :drool5: :) :cloud9:

attachment.php


if you cant tell i LOVE this mill

I'm just posting too "See" the imagery as Images don't always lay up.
 
This is the input I seek.

So my (mis)understanding was the dividing head (what I (Incorrectly) referred To as a indexing wheel) would hold the gear on some sort of arbor.

You suggest using a table mounted tailstock and dividing head to hold the gear blank huh?

Around 1978, I bought a new Japanese copy of a Brown & Sharpe 0 dividing head. It came with a set of indexing plates and a tailstock. The spindle is bored for B&S No. 7 collets, which can hold up to 1/2" shanks, so I bought some collets. I first wanted to make ten sets of 48 DP change gears for watch lathes. I made an arbor with a 1/2" shank and capable of holding ten 1/8" thick blanks held on the arbor with a nut. The nut end of the arbor has a center drilled in it for the tailstock, so that the arbor does not deflect during the cutting of the gear teeth. I bought a set of 48 DP 14.5 degree gear cutters and an arbor to hold them in my vertical mill's R8 spindle. Some of my blanks were brass, some stainless steel and some carbon steel. The brass blanks were quicker to cut because the cutter could be run faster. Anyway, the job got done with no real problems. Later, I made a bunch of 30 DP 14.5 degree steel change gears for old Hardinge lathes. I lost count of turns on one gear and spoiled the blank, so it does pay to keep your mind on the job when running a dividing head. But getting the equipment and cutters is where you start.

These days you will not see nice but inexpensive new Japanese dividing heads for sale. Stay away from things made in India, but often the Chinese products are OK. My BS-0 head is fine for the small gears I made, but will not make a 10 inch gear. The next one up is a BS-1 for larger work. You do not want a BS-2 because they are meant for gear drive spiral work and are very large and heavy, not to mention costly.

This is a good book for beginners and will probably tell you more than you want to know.
https://www.amazon.com/Machinists-P...words=gears+law&qid=1600214916&s=books&sr=1-1

Machinery's Handbook (any old cheap edition) will have the tables for using a dividing head, but a new head should include printed instructions.


Larry
 
Around 1978, I bought a new Japanese copy of a Brown & Sharpe 0 dividing head. It came with a set of indexing plates and a tailstock. The spindle is bored for B&S No. 7 collets, which can hold up to 1/2" shanks, so I bought some collets. I first wanted to make ten sets of 48 DP change gears for watch lathes. I made an arbor with a 1/2" shank and capable of holding ten 1/8" thick blanks held on the arbor with a nut. The nut end of the arbor has a center drilled in it for the tailstock, so that the arbor does not deflect during the cutting of the gear teeth. I bought a set of 48 DP 14.5 degree gear cutters and an arbor to hold them in my vertical mill's R8 spindle. Some of my blanks were brass, some stainless steel and some carbon steel. The brass blanks were quicker to cut because the cutter could be run faster. Anyway, the job got done with no real problems. Later, I made a bunch of 30 DP 14.5 degree steel change gears for old Hardinge lathes. I lost count of turns on one gear and spoiled the blank, so it does pay to keep your mind on the job when running a dividing head. But getting the equipment and cutters is where you start.

These days you will not see nice but inexpensive new Japanese dividing heads for sale. Stay away from things made in India, but often the Chinese products are OK. My BS-0 head is fine for the small gears I made, but will not make a 10 inch gear. The next one up is a BS-1 for larger work. You do not want a BS-2 because they are meant for gear drive spiral work and are very large and heavy, not to mention costly.

This is a good book for beginners and will probably tell you more than you want to know.
https://www.amazon.com/Machinists-P...words=gears+law&qid=1600214916&s=books&sr=1-1

Machinery's Handbook (any old cheap edition) will have the tables for using a dividing head, but a new head should include printed instructions.


Larry

My mother was born 1969 (flower child she says lol) and father 1971, you’ve lived a life my friend! I hope I get to as well, my little brother is fighting Leukemia and so far holding his ground, I’m aware of the survival and odds stacked against us, it’s been 5 years so far and he’s part of the minority in his group.
 
Buy a chip brush.
Anyway, just kidding.
I have a used Ellis dividing head that i bought specifically because it had the collet adapter, drawbar and 8 hardinge 3c collets which are also used in the spindle of my Barker pm milling machine. I use it to (very occasionally) cut wheels and pinions. The Ellis is a bit big for the little barker, but it works fine.
For larger gears, you definitely want a matching tailstock. I've never felt the need to use mine.
 
I am unfamiliar with the Index55 mill, so googled it. Plenty of info on the Lathes UK website, which also states parts are still available "off the shelf" from the manufacturer. I regularly cut gears on my vertical mill, which is a bit larger than yours, but you will do fine. I would recommend a dividing head and tailstock, together with the correct cutter required for your job, ie DP, Module, number of teeth able to be cut (each cutter has a range. Small diameter gears (say up to 1")can be cut on a stub arbor, larger will need an arbor and tailstock, but there are loads of variations. Cutters are available on ebay (have a look at the RDG tools site for prices) and run about £25 each for a 0.75 module (which is small). As said, plenty on you tube and the tinterweb, but do realise just because someone posts, may not mean it is right! I mean, look at me! You could also have a look at HPC Gears, Chesterfield, UK on their website. Plenty of info about their products, but more useful is the data they provide, such as calculations, outer diameter of blanks and pcd details.
A 10" gear will be a slow process and you really need a method of measuring your gear so it runs correctly with the corresponding one. I would perhaps start cutting smaller stuff in plastic, that way if you make a boo boo, you don't smash or blunt your cutter.
Good luck and let us know how you get on.
 
Lots of good book out there on dividing methods geared to the home shop. Here is one such:
https://www.amazon.com/Dividing-Workshop-Practice-Harold-Hall/dp/1854862383

Also if you "love this mill" please take the vise grip with no soft packing on it off the mill!

Thanks all!

And the visegrips are clamped onto the handle of one of the table locks, it was broken (no “tee” left) when I got it, it’s a reverse thread (lefty tighty) and I’m not good at threads yet on the SB16 so I’m waiting to make a new one. It was the only Simple way to use the table lock

It’s not a guideway or feed rod of any kind.

I’ve used all my vice grips on my SB16 and index already LOL.

The drum switch on the SB16 has a missing handle so vice grips it is!
The index 55 has a awkward Allen head table lock on the BACK of the table (between the machine and table) in general is a awkward machine.

But I do love it, paid 400$ for it

If You haven’t noticed I have vide grips on the broken knee handle too! Ha
 
if you are new to machining, I suggest getting a used sr hs/college text book. They're small dollars and once the text book mafia has declared them an old edition and they are simple to follow; intended for the beginner. It'll cover so many basics that it'll really help you come up the curve quickly.

As for DH & TS, avoid a DH that doesn't come with a tailstock. You need the TS for some things and trying to find one later the right height would be a pita
 
Get a copy of Gears and Gearcutting by Ivan Law, an inexpensive book in the Workshop Practice series. It is a straightforward guide to the theory and practice of making gears on milling machines.
These are a series of simple to understand books on specific engineering topics aimed at the home engineer
 








 
Back
Top