I'm running out of space in my new shop....have room for ONE more machine....am confronted with buying a T&C Grinder (KO Lee most likely) or a small honing machine (Sunnen). No specific tasks identified, just hoping to have a well equiped shop. SOOOOO....which would you aquire if you only had room for one ?
Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
Largest Manufacturing Technology Community on the Web
Stay Connected:
Decisions, decisions: T&C Grinder or Honing Machine?
- Thread starter drcoelho
- Start date
- Replies 21
- Views 3,397
rblalexander
Aluminum
- Joined
- Oct 28, 2015
Grinder for sure. You can just hone or lap by hand.
CarbideBob
Diamond
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2007
- Location
- Flushing/Flint, Michigan
A strange question and wonder why a hone is even on the list.
That is a really specialty niche machine while a T&C is a do many things device.
If you had customers lined up for precision holes, then.....
Bob
That is a really specialty niche machine while a T&C is a do many things device.
If you had customers lined up for precision holes, then.....
Bob
Dan from Oakland
Titanium
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2005
- Location
- Oakland, CA
Totally depends on what kind of work you plan on doing. My hone is next to my T&C grinder and the hone gets used 20x more than the grinder. I would hate to have to grind all the bores that I hone to size.
greggv
Hot Rolled
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2006
- Location
- so cal, usa
I'd definitely go for the Sunnen hone. Tool grinding is an art best left to tool grinding shops. Honing is used all the time.
AlfaGTA
Diamond
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2002
- Location
- Benicia California USA
Totally agree with the last two posters...Definitely the hone....
Plenty of shops that do on demand T&C grinding and there are business that will make specials of cutters if needed...work that IMO takes time and skill to get right.
I have both a Sunnen MBB 1660 and a #2 Cinci, and like Dan my hone sees almost constant service for fitting bushings and other parts that are difficult to do on the lathe or mill...not to mention the finishing of hardened parts.
Have a nice #2 Cinci...but since i got my Myford ID/OD cylindrical grinder the Cinci sees little work!
Big thing about a hone is you gotta tool it up....stones and mandrels, shoes and the like...Buying the machine is the easy and cheap part.
Further, fro prototype and one-off's you don't need a power stoker....Wasted expense in my book....the hand stroke machine will do just fine.
Sunnen used to have two sales divisions...Automotive and industrial....The industrial machines (green) are better with adjustable mandrel centering and more speeds. Currently think they now
just make one style machine...more to the industrial design.
Assume you are going to have a surface grinder.
Cheers Ross
Plenty of shops that do on demand T&C grinding and there are business that will make specials of cutters if needed...work that IMO takes time and skill to get right.
I have both a Sunnen MBB 1660 and a #2 Cinci, and like Dan my hone sees almost constant service for fitting bushings and other parts that are difficult to do on the lathe or mill...not to mention the finishing of hardened parts.
Have a nice #2 Cinci...but since i got my Myford ID/OD cylindrical grinder the Cinci sees little work!
Big thing about a hone is you gotta tool it up....stones and mandrels, shoes and the like...Buying the machine is the easy and cheap part.
Further, fro prototype and one-off's you don't need a power stoker....Wasted expense in my book....the hand stroke machine will do just fine.
Sunnen used to have two sales divisions...Automotive and industrial....The industrial machines (green) are better with adjustable mandrel centering and more speeds. Currently think they now
just make one style machine...more to the industrial design.
Assume you are going to have a surface grinder.
Cheers Ross
Limy Sami
Diamond
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2007
- Location
- Norfolk, UK
IMO These days most ''common or garden'' milling etc cutters are cheap enough, so unless you use a lot of custom shaped / special cutters, I would go for the hone.
All this good advice, and nobody asks what kind of work you do?
IMHO, a hone goes with lathe work. If your best lathe bores a .002 taper, a hone on will make your bores much better.
A tool and cutter grinder is better for a shop with mostly millwork. But just like the hone, the usefulness is in the accessories.
IMHO, a hone goes with lathe work. If your best lathe bores a .002 taper, a hone on will make your bores much better.
A tool and cutter grinder is better for a shop with mostly millwork. But just like the hone, the usefulness is in the accessories.
triumph406
Diamond
- Joined
- Sep 14, 2008
- Location
- ca
I have 2 Sunnens and have tooled up using ebay over the years.
Used mandrels that take replaceble shoes don't wear out, replacement shoes aren't expensive of ebay. Stones off ebay are cheap, but occasionally I've had to buy from Sunnen when I needed a specific stone grade I didn't have or wasn't on ebay.
The smaller hones that don't have replaceable shoes are a crap shoot used. I only buy NOS these days.
The learning curve to use a Sunnen is short and shallow. You could be honing holes competantly in a few hours (or less) if inclined.
The other good think about a Sunnen is their tech service, it's second to none. If you have a problem with a bore or can't get the finish required etc, the tech service will have the answer. Also ordering from them is a pleasure, very friendly people.
Used mandrels that take replaceble shoes don't wear out, replacement shoes aren't expensive of ebay. Stones off ebay are cheap, but occasionally I've had to buy from Sunnen when I needed a specific stone grade I didn't have or wasn't on ebay.
The smaller hones that don't have replaceable shoes are a crap shoot used. I only buy NOS these days.
The learning curve to use a Sunnen is short and shallow. You could be honing holes competantly in a few hours (or less) if inclined.
The other good think about a Sunnen is their tech service, it's second to none. If you have a problem with a bore or can't get the finish required etc, the tech service will have the answer. Also ordering from them is a pleasure, very friendly people.
donie
Diamond
- Joined
- May 17, 2003
- Location
- Walla Walla Wine and Wild Turkey
Where I am, there are no tool grinding shops, no next day air either. So, a cutter grinder comes in handy.
I have an old Sunnen MBB1600, I have found very useful for many fields of work, I happen to keep the hone next to the cutter grinder, its a small machine that usually does not need a lot of room.
I used this AN 600 mandrel to finish hone motorcycle cylinders.
The cutter grinder here is set up for the simple job of grinding a brazed carbide boring bar, that is used for finish cutting in a boring machine. I could buy inserts but, carbide high shear inserts are expensive and have a relative short life, also, the tool angles can be quickly altered to suit the most difficult materials.
The old machine grinds to near perfection.
I have shown this photo before, don't ask if I turn on the workhead motor doing this operation!
I have an old Sunnen MBB1600, I have found very useful for many fields of work, I happen to keep the hone next to the cutter grinder, its a small machine that usually does not need a lot of room.
I used this AN 600 mandrel to finish hone motorcycle cylinders.
The cutter grinder here is set up for the simple job of grinding a brazed carbide boring bar, that is used for finish cutting in a boring machine. I could buy inserts but, carbide high shear inserts are expensive and have a relative short life, also, the tool angles can be quickly altered to suit the most difficult materials.
The old machine grinds to near perfection.
I have shown this photo before, don't ask if I turn on the workhead motor doing this operation!
Yes, surface grinder is a given.
Conrad Hoffman
Diamond
- Joined
- May 10, 2009
- Location
- Canandaigua, NY, USA
When you need a hone, nothing else will do as well. It will nickel and dime you to death because you'll never have the arbor or stones you need for a particular task. It will often sit unused for months. It uses a large quantity of stinky oil unless you modify it and use special oil. Nothing works as good as the special honing oil, even if you find a dead mouse in it every now and then. Yes, the learning curve is short if you have "the knack". To be really good, say doing 15 millionths sort of work, takes a bit longer, but the machines are capable of it if well maintained.
When you need a T&C grinder, nothing else will do as well... I'm still looking for one I can afford and have no patience to build a Quorn.
When you need a T&C grinder, nothing else will do as well... I'm still looking for one I can afford and have no patience to build a Quorn.
daryl bane
Titanium
- Joined
- Mar 12, 2002
- Location
- East Texas
Funny thing, I have a T&C grinder(KO Lee) and I never seem to sharpen cutters with it, but do all sorts of piddly stuff. Alittle ID grinding here , alittle OD grinding there. Surface grind some spacers. I even semi finished ground my home made replacement tailstock quill for my lathe. Very handy machine. And I guess the quality of my hole making has never needed to surpass a reamer.
Last edited:
This is the mode of use I am thinking for my shop, can think of all sorts of useful little tasks it would be good at.
Similar threads
