Drill press vise with magnetic base activated with foot switch? Need one.
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  1. #1
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    Default Drill press vise with magnetic base activated with foot switch? Need one.

    Working with magnification drilling a bunch of .026 holes in circuit boards. Instead of holding a board/vise by hand and asking for a small bit to break.
    Or clamping the vise for each hole and then re-starting the power, repeat etc. (For hours).

    So I was wondering if there is a foot operated magnetic vise which can allow the guy (me) to reposition the work piece under a microscope and live to see
    another day. I can get up and personal with a drill press and maneuver a vise. But not so much if I had to crank handles on a mill. A run of 50 .026 holes
    may not line up perfectly and I would be correcting x and y.

    I remember about 10 years ago I saw a demo of a 3 axis machine that would finish cut circuit boards. Compared to that, my process prints the image on special
    paper through a laser jet printer. The paper is held against the copper board and run through a heat sealing machine with rollers. The black plastic particles
    from the toner transfer off the paper and tack onto the copper. If that special paper I bought was just butcher paper then the have a good business. This paper
    has a shinny side and a dull side. Like tin foil. Then there are touch-ups that I have to do with a small pin strip brush for .020 wide traces. For that I use
    lacquer with some black dye. X-Acto knife is also used for trimming

    The copper etch actually proceeds from the board edges to the center. If left in bath for all excess copper to be removed there would be under-cut traces
    near the edges and but looking traces near the center.

    Therefore I had to etch say 2 minutes, removeand wash with water, cover finished areas with lacquer, wait to dry, then back to another 2 minute etch.
    Repeat this until all the excess copper is gone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rons View Post
    Working with magnification drilling a bunch of .026 holes in circuit boards. Instead of holding a board/vise by hand and asking for a small bit to break.
    Or clamping the vise for each hole and then re-starting the power, repeat etc. (For hours).

    So I was wondering if there is a foot operated magnetic vise which can allow the guy (me) to reposition the work piece under a microscope and live to see
    another day. I can get up and personal with a drill press and maneuver a vise. But not so much if I had to crank handles on a mill. A run of 50 .026 holes
    may not line up perfectly and I would be correcting x and y.

    I remember about 10 years ago I saw a demo of a 3 axis machine that would finish cut circuit boards. Compared to that, my process prints the image on special
    paper through a laser jet printer. The paper is held against the copper board and run through a heat sealing machine with rollers. The black plastic particles
    from the toner transfer off the paper and tack onto the copper. If that special paper I bought was just butcher paper then the have a good business. This paper
    has a shinny side and a dull side. Like tin foil. Then there are touch-ups that I have to do with a small pin strip brush for .020 wide traces. For that I use
    lacquer with some black dye. X-Acto knife is also used for trimming

    The copper etch actually proceeds from the board edges to the center. If left in bath for all excess copper to be removed there would be under-cut traces
    near the edges and but looking traces near the center.

    Therefore I had to etch say 2 minutes, removeand wash with water, cover finished areas with lacquer, wait to dry, then back to another 2 minute etch.
    Repeat this until all the excess copper is gone.
    What exactly are you asking for again ?....

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    Mag chuck with existing vise.

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    Two things.

    Why do you need a vise? I have drilled a lot of holes sliding it around by hand and using the pad or trace for the hole center.

    Circuit boards are a dollar a square inch or less these days even in small quantity.

    Ed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scruffy887 View Post
    Mag chuck with existing vise.
    And rig up a foot pedal with a cable that turns a lever attached to the factory hand lever. Plenty of very strong cables in the automotive and motorcycle world.

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    X-Y table? Still have to turn cranks, but they're 'right there' with no reaching like a mill table

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    Or a vacuum pad with hose & pump/generator.

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    Thompson Mill-Drill table

    111.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mud View Post
    Thompson Mill-Drill table

    111.jpg
    Yes, and didn't they make one that would lock with a foot pedal acetated switch (pugged into 120 vac, I think it was magnetic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by digger doug View Post
    Yes, and didn't they make one that would lock with a foot pedal acetated switch (pugged into 120 vac, I think it was magnetic.
    They are all electric, apply electric to release the brake.

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    The issue is vibration leading to small drill bits breaking. In case you have not seen them those circuit board drill bits come in cases of 50 or 100.
    Don't have many small sizes like .026. Also the issue is the drill press table. I use a piece of 3/4 oak scrap. It does slide so that will not do. The reason
    for a loose 3/4 plywood base is so I can move it around as the holes get drilled. The idea is always to have a firm backup on the work piece. Therefore:

    I will cut a piece of plywood and screw it to the circuit board and then use a rubber mat over the drill press metal table. (3/4 scrap removed).

    Another question is the single phase motor on the Rockwell drill press. Would a 3 phase motor + VFD make the tool run smoother?
    (Christian Bale would say I drive my drill press like a school teacher). Would like to go slower for metal but the belt is always at the lowest
    position. So it's only really good for wood which is what I use it for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rons View Post
    The issue is vibration leading to small drill bits breaking. In case you have not seen them those circuit board drill bits come in cases of 50 or 100.
    Don't have many small sizes like .026. Also the issue is the drill press table. I use a piece of 3/4 oak scrap. It does slide so that will not do. The reason
    for a loose 3/4 plywood base is so I can move it around as the holes get drilled. The idea is always to have a firm backup on the work piece. Therefore:

    I will cut a piece of plywood and screw it to the circuit board and then use a rubber mat over the drill press metal table. (3/4 scrap removed).

    Another question is the single phase motor on the Rockwell drill press. Would a 3 phase motor + VFD make the tool run smoother?
    (Christian Bale would say I drive my drill press like a school teacher). Would like to go slower for metal but the belt is always at the lowest
    position. So it's only really good for wood which is what I use it for.
    Harvey carries CB drills down to .002"

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    Quote Originally Posted by rons View Post

    Another question is the single phase motor on the Rockwell drill press. Would a 3 phase motor + VFD make the tool run smoother?
    (Christian Bale would say I drive my drill press like a school teacher). Would like to go slower for metal but the belt is always at the lowest
    position. So it's only really good for wood which is what I use it for.
    well yes, sort of. a common mis-understanding about a VFD is that it can be used instead of a true low gear.

    no it can't, generally speaking a VFD is only able to run a 3ph AC motor down to 30-35 HZ and put out decent torque, and it should be an inverter rated motor for any hard use. as you slow down the ALTERNATING part of AC, the frequency, eventually it becomes effectively DC. the collapsing magnetic field that provides the inductive reaction (not sure if that's the correct terminology there..)
    diminishes in its ability to counteract the inrush of current, becoming nearly a short circuit. the inductance ("resistance" to alternating current) effectively dropping as frequency drops, this is the way an analog audio crossover works, the big coil you see in a speaker.

    if your motor is DC rated, that is a different animal, obviously, but someone that knows a lot more about electricity/motors than I do will have to take it from here... (and feel free to correct any of the above as well! )

    on to the practical implications, I put a VFD on my Delta (1957) floor drill press. it has the original 3PH motor, and with the belt on the lowest speed step it still can't really go slow enough to drill steel over 1/2" or countersink well. if you do turn it down to the low 20s, it shuts down from over current fault if you try to do any real work.

    P.S., I think what you really need is a better drill press for this work, something with low vibration, high speed, and a sensitive quill feed like a Dumore.

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    With a circuit board that has a lot of holes. Mess up one hole and probably the whole board is scrap.

    A metal vise holding the board at whatever rotation and immediately clamping without stopping the motor. Nice and fast with a foot peddle for speed on/off
    and a hand lever for a magnetic vise.

    I just have a drill press table and a scrap plywood base. I mean the smallest size number drill is .040, and I'm using .026. Trying to drill a lot of holes
    with accuracy and no drill bit breakage. Any small drill press spindle vibration can transmit to the bit and then it might break. So would like a way to hold
    the circuit board for drilling a small hole. The operation is done by looking under some magnification and holding/moving the work manually.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rons View Post
    With a circuit board that has a lot of holes. Mess up one hole and probably the whole board is scrap.

    A metal vise holding the board at whatever rotation and immediately clamping without stopping the motor. Nice and fast with a foot peddle for speed on/off
    and a hand lever for a magnetic vise.

    I just have a drill press table and a scrap plywood base. I mean the smallest size number drill is .040, and I'm using .026. Trying to drill a lot of holes
    with accuracy and no drill bit breakage. Any small drill press spindle vibration can transmit to the bit and then it might break. So would like a way to hold
    the circuit board for drilling a small hole. The operation is done by looking under some magnification and holding/moving the work manually.
    "Edlund" made just what you want...drill press's for circuit board drilling.

    If it was me, I would get the above table, and mount a Dremel over it.

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    I did this for half a year - worked in an electronics shop (U of A, tucson) where they fabbed circuit boards. After
    etch they were drilled. The drill for this was a dumore high speed head, on a pneumatic lift (foot pedal operated)
    that pushed the drill up from underneath - and the microscope cross-hairs showed the pad in the board. The
    microscope was zeroed out so the cross hairs were right on the drill.

    Drills did not break, and I could do a hundred holes in a half hour or so. No lockdown for the board, it was just
    held in place by hand on the platten.

    (ear protection needed, also the system had an exhaust system to pull out the FR4 dust. It was home-made, the
    guy that ran the shop was an ex-nuclear sub man)

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    Do your boards not fit into a typical quick turn vendor's process?

    I am pretty novice when it comes to PCB design, but I have had a bunch of stuff made and am amazed how cheap and fast it is.

    PCB Prototype & PCB Fabrication Manufacturer - JLCPCB
    USA PCB Manufacturer & Assembly | Advanced Circuits

    I think my last order was 30 small 1"x2" basic 2 layer boards, $25 or so including shipping and in my hands in less than a week from ordering.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rons View Post

    I mean the smallest size number drill is .040, and I'm using .026. Trying to drill a lot of holes

    Any small drill press spindle vibration can transmit to the bit and then it might break.
    .026 is a #71 drill, # 80 is .0135.

    no, it won't. see what Jim rosen posted. try using a Dumore drill press and you will understand why its completely insane to use a vise to drill PC boards.

    (Jim, you reminded me, a Dumore is an "upfeed" drill, that sounds like a nice rig, suited to the work)

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    Quote Originally Posted by digger doug View Post
    "Edlund" made just what you want...drill press's for circuit board drilling.

    If it was me, I would get the above table, and mount a Dremel over it.
    I actually still have the original Dremel drill press that mounts a Dremel tool. Best bet for drilling PCBs is to buy the carbide circuit drill regrinds that are widely available. These are all carbide, short and stiff with 1/8" shanks and color coded plastic collars. PCB manufacturers use these bits in a CNC router/drill and use a sheet of Masonite under the PCB.

    Travers also carries carbide bits meant for circuit board drilling.

    Circuit Board Drills | Travers Tool Co., Inc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by newtonsapple View Post
    Do your boards not fit into a typical quick turn vendor's process?

    I am pretty novice when it comes to PCB design, but I have had a bunch of stuff made and am amazed how cheap and fast it is.

    PCB Prototype & PCB Fabrication Manufacturer - JLCPCB
    USA PCB Manufacturer & Assembly | Advanced Circuits

    I think my last order was 30 small 1"x2" basic 2 layer boards, $25 or so including shipping and in my hands in less than a week from ordering.
    I always wanted to do my own. I used gEDA tools which are free. I draw a schematic and got components placed and auto-routed the connections.
    Still a lot of hand work.


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