Drill and Tap AR500

drom68 · Aug 13, 2020

Well I have a request for doing plates made out of AR500. They require cut to size, which I can have the supplier take care of that. But they require drilling and tapping; 3/4-10TPI. Range from 2 - 5 holes per plate and up to 10 plates at a time.

Any best methods for tapping AR500? Plate is 1 1/2" thick and overall size is not an issue, it will fit on a Bridgeport, not that I would use the Bridgeport.

Also, any good suppliers in the PA/OH/Upstate NY area?

I would rather spend the money upfront to get the correct tap vs trial and error resulting in more money and time.

Thanks,

ChipSplitter · Aug 13, 2020

Disclaimer: I haven't done AR500, just AR400.

Yes it can be done, drill your hole as large as the customer will allow, buy a good tap (OSG, Emuge, Guhring, Nachi), use a good tap lube (Moly-Dee

As far as suppliers go, Alro has the best quality AR I've seen. Not the cheapest around, but their plate is flat.

Phil in Montana · Aug 13, 2020

Pass up the job, ar500 will kill any tap you use, the cost per hole will be over the top, let some other sap lose the war, or get the cust to change the material...Phil

DDoug · Aug 13, 2020

I'm thinking "thread milling"...…?

If the length/dia. is doo-able (or is that "Dew Able"...?)

pavt · Aug 13, 2020

My old job did a lot of this stuff with AR400, about 60 pcs 2 or 3x per year. They purchased from Klein Steel in Buffalo, cut to size. I think Klein gets it from Alro just down the street. I will say the stuff work-hardens instantly like superman's dick, and breaks all your tools if you're not careful and slow and lots of lube.

Hardplates · Aug 13, 2020

Used to work with the stuff ever day of the week and still do a fair bit of it. Forget tapping, thread milling is the way to go. Are you looking for a supplier of taps or the plate itself?

drom68 · Aug 13, 2020

ChipSplitter said:
Disclaimer:

Use a cut tap and not a form tap, because AR has a super high tensile strength.

I like these: OSG | Taps | End Mills | Drills | Indexable | Composite Tooling | Diamond Coating | Die Products. A Brand A-POT - Inch
flat.

Awesome, THANKS! Wish they would list prices instead having to put in a freaking quote.

Phil in Montana said:
Pass up the job, ar500 will kill any tap you use, the cost per hole will be over the top, let some other sap lose the war, or get the cust to change the material...Phil

I can't unfortunately. Reason; I like this type of work/challenge, nobody else wants to do it. I get myself into trouble, but I have PM to save my a$$.

Hardplates · Aug 13, 2020

ChipSplitter said:
Disclaimer: I haven't done AR500, just AR400.

Yes it can be done, drill your hole as large as the customer will allow, buy a good tap (OSG, Emuge, Guhring, Nachi), use a good tap lube (Moly-Dee ), and go slooooowwwww.

Use a cut tap and not a form tap, because AR has a super high tensile strength.

I like these: OSG | Taps | End Mills | Drills | Indexable | Composite Tooling | Diamond Coating | Die Products. A Brand A-POT - Inch

Also, AR is sloppily heat-treated so you may find hard spots.......use a rosary.

As far as suppliers go, Alro has the best quality AR I've seen. Not the cheapest around, but their plate is flat.

Alro uses CMC Impact metals. I believe CMC has around a 20 ton minimum to buy direct.

"Back in the day" I used to go through a couple hundred tons a year of the stuff, hence the name hardplates

DDoug · Aug 13, 2020

drom68 said:
Awesome, THANKS! Wish they would list prices instead having to put in a freaking quote.

I can't unfortunately. Reason; I like this type of work/challenge, nobody else wants to do it. I get myself into trouble, but I have PM to save my a$$.

You have not completed the job yet eh ?

drom68 · Aug 13, 2020

Hardplates said:
Used to work with the stuff ever day of the week and still do a fair bit of it. Forget tapping, thread milling is the way to go. Are you looking for a supplier of taps or the plate itself?

Both. I found a supplier in OH for material, so far they are extremely helpful and willing to work the prices.

What I need are a few options for the tap. So far you and Digger Doug are recommending thread milling.

If you have a good source for taps, please share. Much appreciated!

drom68 · Aug 13, 2020

digger doug said:
You have not completed the job yet eh ?

No, I'm sure there is headache coming, haven't even started. My next step is ordering the tooling. And that is why I want to buy what is needed vs trial and error.

Mtndew · Aug 13, 2020

drom68 said:
Both. I found a supplier in OH for material, so far they are extremely helpful and willing to work the prices.

What I need are a few options for the tap. So far you and Digger Doug are recommending thread milling.

If you have a good source for taps, please share. Much appreciated!

Another vote for thread milling.
If you must use a tap, I'd contact OSG, Emuge AND Guhring directly to see what they recommend.Or any reputable tap manufacturer for that matter.

OCTANE WORKHOLD · Aug 13, 2020

It really is not that scary, like everyone else said get a high quality tap and build some cushion into your quote.
Threadmill if that is an option.

Worst case you lose a few dollars but gain some experience for next time.

Hardplates · Aug 13, 2020

drom68 said:
Both. I found a supplier in OH for material, so far they are extremely helpful and willing to work the prices.

What I need are a few options for the tap. So far you and Digger Doug are recommending thread milling.

If you have a good source for taps, please share. Much appreciated!

Unless you are buying tiny amounts you should have no problem getting USA made plate for around $1 a pound. I wouldn't bother trying to tap it. Not that it can't be done but thread milling is going to be much more straight forward.

MattiJ · Aug 13, 2020

possibly some usefull tidbits even if you are probably not able to get SSAB steels

https://ssabwebsitecdn.azureedge.ne...hining-strenx-and-hardox.pdf?m=20160420085241

Archer120x · Aug 13, 2020

Send them to me.

AR is pretty much all I do.

pavt · Aug 13, 2020

drom68 said:
What I need are a few options for the tap. So far you and Digger Doug are recommending thread milling.

If you have a good source for taps, please share. Much appreciated!

I have no doubt thread milling would be way easier, but if you have to tap it, I did it with brand-new GTD/Widia taps. Hand tapping in my case, (it's slow, so at least the stuff won't harden up on you) I'm sure that power tapping would just give me breakage.

tjd10684 · Aug 14, 2020

I was doing AR500 plates for a customer for a while. Thread milling was the way to go but buy more than you think I was killing thread mills at 6-8 holes per tool. I also got a few OSG taps for hard materials so that I could clean up holes that were marginal (so I could push it to maybe 10 holes before breaking). I tried tapping as well with copious amounts of oil the best tool for that was the waterjet so I could cut out broken taps.

Phil in Montana · Aug 14, 2020

The way I do it is to drill a 1 1/4 hole, machine a undercut slug from a36 and weld it in, then drill and tap to 3/4 10, works good but takes a lot of time...Phil

akajun · Aug 15, 2020

Phil in Montana said:
The way I do it is to drill a 1 1/4 hole, machine a undercut slug from a36 and weld it in, then drill and tap to 3/4 10, works good but takes a lot of time...Phil

Which kills the heat treat around the heat affected zone. That’s why targets made from ar are water cut. When you use plasma cutters, the edges get soft, which takes chunks of steel of the edge of the targets from hits on the edge or by the bolt holes.
Pretty soon Your target falls and can’t be re hung or is turned into a giant serrated blade.

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