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Elgin vertical vertical mill / milling machine

I gave mine to Curtis Decker (Jeff Decker’s uncle) and regret it! What a cool machine... I wish it was on a pedestal in my living room. Really...
 
I have an Elgin vertical mill which I purchased in January of 2019 just outside Buffalo, NY. Everything on the unit is extremely heavy. There is no model number on it that I can see. It has a three phase motor which is not original to this unit. I'd prefer to use single phase. Since the motor is not original, it doesn't seem like a loss. If anyone has done this conversion, please chime in. If there's a reason to not do it, like losing the reversing feature, please let me know.20190303_163722.jpg20190304_085453.jpg20190305_110441.jpg
 
No, but I did live in Pittsford for a while a few years ago. I just noticed you live there, ha. Congrats on the Elgin acquisition. I bought a working Stark lathe and a 1930s Hardinge lathe that came from the Kodak factory while I lived there! Lots of good deals around there.
 
I have an Elgin vertical mill which I purchased in January of 2019 just outside Buffalo, NY. Everything on the unit is extremely heavy. There is no model number on it that I can see. It has a three phase motor which is not original to this unit. I'd prefer to use single phase. Since the motor is not original, it doesn't seem like a loss. If anyone has done this conversion, please chime in. If there's a reason to not do it, like losing the reversing feature, please let me know.View attachment 251503View attachment 251504View attachment 251505
Keep the present motor and add a 110 V input VFD and enjoy the added values of variable speed, reversing and ability to plug it in anywhere.

Larry
 
VFD on a 1/2 HP Elgin vertical Milling Machine

Keep the present motor and add a 110 V input VFD and enjoy the added values of variable speed, reversing and ability to plug it in anywhere.

Larry

Thanks for your response; I didn't see it until just today.

My mill is already set up with a reversing feature. Also, I have a three phase bandsaw waiting to be fired up. Both motors are less than 1 HP, 1/2 HP on the mill and 3/4 on the bandsaw. According to my reading, static converters lose anywhere between 25% to 50% of the motors rated out put. Will this also be true of a VFD? A Phase-a-matic R-2 is rated for up to 1 HP, so it would run either machine, but not at the same time. I'm fond of the saying to "cry once" when buying equipment, which is how I wound up with the Elgin mill. I was a big effort to get it. It seems that any solution will start to add up fast.

Input would be appreciated.
 
The VFD will not loose power like a static converter. You could put a VFD on each of those machines and have money left over compared to the price of the R2. You could then run both machines at once.
You don't have to use the reversing feature on the VFD if you don't want to, but be aware that the VFD needs to be hooked directly to the motor with no electrical switches or devices in between.
With a little work, you can set things up where the original controls on the machine control the VFD.
You'll also get the advantage of braking, and if you like, you can set up a E-stop button.
If you are planning on adding more three phase machines, it might make sense to buy a rotary big enough to handle all of them.
 
Good points...

The VFD will not loose power like a static converter. You could put a VFD on each of those machines and have money left over compared to the price of the R2. You could then run both machines at once.
You don't have to use the reversing feature on the VFD if you don't want to, but be aware that the VFD needs to be hooked directly to the motor with no electrical switches or devices in between.
With a little work, you can set things up where the original controls on the machine control the VFD.
You'll also get the advantage of braking, and if you like, you can set up a E-stop button.
If you are planning on adding more three phase machines, it might make sense to buy a rotary big enough to handle all of them.

Thanks for your input. My thinking was to get heirloom quality machines. I have a 1966 or 1967 Vacu-Blast 200-P dry honer, the Elgin Mill (year unknown), a 1972 Powermatic 14" bandsaw with the two speed transmission, and a 2019 Atlas Copco rotary screw compressor. The Vacu-Blast and the Atlas Copco are both single phase. I don't see why the bandsaw has to be three phase. So the mill is the only piece that would seem to benefit from three phase power. Having stretched to get the machines, the VFD on the mill is probably the way to go for the time being. Do you recommend any particular brand of VFD or any particular retailer?

Thanks
 
RPC means ............

If you just want the machines to work, make or buy an RPC. It'll work for both machines and you won't have to change a thing on the machines.

Please let me know what you mean by RPC, and how does this address the need for three phase for a small number of machines.

Thanks
 
Please let me know what you mean by RPC...

Catman has it right. An RPC is a rotary phase converter. It's basically a 3 phase motor that constructs a third phase. Started a variety of ways it provides a reasonable facsimile of a third phase, good enough to run most any 3 phase machine machinists are likely to use.

At it's simplest, it's a used 3 phase motor and a pull rope at less than $50. Sky's the limit for bells and whistles: selfstarting, phase monitoring, balancing capacitors, distribution centers, etc.

....how does this address the need for three phase for a small number of machines

Advantages for the small shop with few machines is that one RPC can serve multiple machines and no machine rewiring is needed, in contrast to a VFD. Makes it easy to change machines in and out of the shop, test motors, etc.. And if something breaks, it's easily fixable and cheap, also in contrast to a VFD.

Prob the best resource is right here on PM in the transformers, phase converters and VFD forum. A couple hours of browsing and self education and you're good to go.
 
Catman has it right. An RPC is a rotary phase converter. It's basically a 3 phase motor that constructs a third phase. Started a variety of ways it provides a reasonable facsimile of a third phase, good enough to run most any 3 phase machine machinists are likely to use.

At it's simplest, it's a used 3 phase motor and a pull rope at less than $50. Sky's the limit for bells and whistles: selfstarting, phase monitoring, balancing capacitors, distribution centers, etc.



Advantages for the small shop with few machines is that one RPC can serve multiple machines and no machine rewiring is needed, in contrast to a VFD. Makes it easy to change machines in and out of the shop, test motors, etc.. And if something breaks, it's easily fixable and cheap, also in contrast to a VFD.

Prob the best resource is right here on PM in the transformers, phase converters and VFD forum. A couple hours of browsing and self education and you're good to go.

Thanks for everyone's input. I think like the idea of the RPC for simplicity's sake. I'll definitely study a DIY on PM while I continue to troll Craigs List.
 
Thanks for everyone's input. I think like the idea of the RPC for simplicity's sake. I'll definitely study a DIY on PM while I continue to troll Craigs List.

From my own experience, I will say that the DIY approach seems more daunting than it really is, particularly when many posts talk about carefully balancing the legs using a variety of sizes of capacitors.

Eh - when I built my 3hp RPC, I tried it out and found that the balance was more than close enough, so I've never bothered to add any additional caps, other than the one I use for starting. And building one can be ultra cheap if you know someone in the HVAC business - all the capacitors and contactors you could desire. Since I already had a scrapped-out 3hp 3-phase motor on hand (pulled out of the scrap bin with a broken end bell that I tig brazed back together), the only thing I had to buy was a couple of push-button switches for the on-off and the 3-phase socket.
 
I,m a little confused on the extremely heavy part. I assume you mean ,for its size. It is a nice looking mill. It's good to know how to use a 3 phase motor to create 3 phase power. Sometime you can come across motors for nothing but you may end up spending on caps and what not to make it a little more user friendly.I'd go with the VFD, they cost $100 or less ,used on Ebay.I've always used the older Allen Bradleys but they are a little dated. they offer many features. Being able to just plug into single phase,and the variable speed ability will save you from changing belt positions as often plus many programmable features and forward and reverse but you wont be using that nice drum switch. You could sell it to offset the cost of the VFD. When the day comes for the mill to go to the next person they'll be glad you did make it run off single phase but with the options of the VFD.Enjoy learning about both these methods, once you do 3-phase will be an asset not a liability and you'll be the one explaining to others you needn't be intimidated by it.
 








 
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