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General grooving and part off for very high quantity runs

as9100d

Stainless
Joined
Apr 19, 2019
Location
Paris, Arkansas
So I see a reoccurring issue in the shop lately since we added some dual spindle live tool lathes.

We are doing more and more grooving, and turning with grooving tools as well as parting off.

The fine folks are Lloyd's have been helping me out with the tooling quotes but I wanted to reach out to the forum and see what everyone else is using.

We have the following in the queue:

1) 1.5" 4240ht, solid 1.5" part off no hole, 20,000 pieces

2) .75" 304 ss, solid .750 part off no hole, also has grooves and turning with a groove tool, 4000 pieces

3) .25" 304 ss, solid .250 part off no hole, turn with groove tool, 8000 pieces

Can't post photos but that's the basics of it.

Looking at Walter for part off and considering iscar do grip and Jenna metal beyond evolution for groove.

Looking for process reliability, speed to order more parts



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Also love pH horn but lead times are usually too long for stuff we do and very expensive to get in to.

I fear my guys run stuff to hard and will break those beautiful tools.

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Ultimately, it comes down to predictability of Tool life. No matter which way you do the count, predictability is the answer. Part-off is too catastrophic.

Figure out exactly how many pieces you get off of one, and stop the program and change it.

I personally like Iscar tang grip for all parting and grooving.

R
 
Have you looked into Y-Axis parting? It may just be a gimmick, but the videos look promising.
Maybe have your rep bring out some guaranteed test tooling?
Whatever manufacturer you go with, HPC should go a long way with chipbreaking and tool life.

The .250" parts sound the most challenging, doing them on swiss?
Walter/Sandvik are usually my first choice, but Kenna and Iscar do have good offerings.
 
Have you looked into Y-Axis parting? It may just be a gimmick, but the videos look promising.
Maybe have your rep bring out some guaranteed test tooling?
Whatever manufacturer you go with, HPC should go a long way with chipbreaking and tool life.

The .250" parts sound the most challenging, doing them on swiss?
Walter/Sandvik are usually my first choice, but Kenna and Iscar do have good offerings.
Y axis parting looks good but doesn't help my grooving issues.

Having a rep come by is worthless, every one that stops by is a snake oil salesmen and only sees dollars when they see my big ass building.



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Y axis parting looks good but doesn't help my grooving issues.

Having a rep come by is worthless, every one that stops by is a snake oil salesmen and only sees dollars when they see my big ass building.



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Agree on most reps, but if you find one that is good they are an asset. I told the one I trust, don't call me i'll call you, the rest don't have access... What grooving issue are you having specifically?
 
Agree on most reps, but if you find one that is good they are an asset. I told the one I trust, don't call me i'll call you, the rest don't have access... What grooving issue are you having specifically?
No issue yet. Just looking for a good option for long part runs.

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No issue yet. Just looking for a good option for long part runs.

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Y axis grooving may also be a good solution, even if only to rough them in. MD turning should be consistent especially if you can grip both ends with the sub, provided you can break a chip. Really depends on what size tool and round vs square inserts, contour shape. I've probably been drinking too much Sandvik kool-aid, but prime turning is pretty awesome as well.
 
I can't help with actual tooling, but the late Mark McGrath ran (amongst others) multispindle cam autos (screw machines) and told me they changed out inserts after so many cuts - regardless of the tip condition, ..............the number of cuts set well below what practice and experience had established.
He also changed the blade / holder after so many parts as he found they wore as well, and would ''drop the tip''

He cited that changing the tip on a known number, was insurance, for if the tip went, by the time the machine had stopped it had taken out the blade as well, etc etc.
 
I can't help with actual tooling, but the late Mark McGrath ran (amongst others) multispindle cam autos (screw machines) and told me they changed out inserts after so many cuts - regardless of the tip condition, ..............the number of cuts set well below what practice and experience had established.
He also changed the blade / holder after so many parts as he found they wore as well, and would ''drop the tip''

He cited that changing the tip on a known number, was insurance, for if the tip went, by the time the machine had stopped it had taken out the blade as well, etc etc.
I'm aware of best practices.

Just looking for best insert for cost, process reliability, speed, and predictable.



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Pick your flavor for cut-off and grooving, they all make good stuff:

Iscar, Sandvik, Seco, Kennametal, PH Horn....

Just have to try one or all, figure out what works best in your machines and for your parts.

The “coolant-through-the-blade” types might help with reliability....?

Cut-off is not a process to maximize absolute speed of metal removal, if you want true process reliability.

ToolCat
 
At this point it's between Walter through blade and kennametal beyond evolution.

The kennametal is cheaper to get started and cheaper to maintain vs Walter.

Walter coolant is better but both have coolant through.



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