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  1. #21
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    Machine shops never have know it all ass holes working in them lol.

    Quote the idiot double, tell him to provide material and half down. WTF, might make some money. Or waste time posting to PM.

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  3. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hillside Fab View Post
    True - still hard to imagine there wasn't a smaller shop within an hour drive that would at least answer the phone and talk nice to him, even if that was only to refer him to a competitor.
    Big multinationals have screwed the local shops so bad, their PA's can't even get a phone call returned.
    120 days payment, "target prices" so low, etc.

    So they go overseas right away.

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    As we speak, I have a friend who owns a medium-sized plumbing supply house. He expanded and moved to a new, better location in January and he has still not been able to get any sign maker to give him the time of day. He wants to buy a new sign for the front of his business; the sort that is illuminated from inside, etc. with his company name and logo. He has sent requests to 5 sign companies (which is the sum of the sign companies within a 100 mile radius) and none of them seem to want the business.

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    Cant get anyone to do shit. Won't answer phones, no callback, don't show up when they say they will etc etc. Turning into some freekin banana republic. Get up late, take a siesta, get shit faced, repeat.

  7. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Miranda View Post
    I would say that these days 90% or more of the work that we do requires substantial interaction with the quote originator. When we get rfq's that don't require three or four back and forth emails/phone calls we consider it very refreshing.

    We are finding that there are fewer engineers that know what they are doing. Most need hand-holding, some need dental work (as in getting the necessary info from them is like "pulling teeth" - is that even an expression any more?).
    Engineers that know what they are doing,......yeah OK, how about the drawing I got a while back, It showed an aluminum part welded to a stainless one! I pointed it out to the train driver, his reply, oh, you can't do that? What a doofus.

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  9. #26
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    I don’t how any of us can be surprised the job went to China....

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    Yeah ,job to China.....then you hear the sad stories.....samples were excellent,paid in advance for a container load ,easiest money we ever made!....Container arrives ,not to spec,not even close,galvanizing is actually a thin wash of aluminium paint....half are already rusty.

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  12. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by moonlight machine View Post
    Engineers that know what they are doing,......yeah OK, how about the drawing I got a while back, It showed an aluminum part welded to a stainless one! I pointed it out to the train driver, his reply, oh, you can't do that? What a doofus.
    Introduce him to explosive welding. And there's other ways too:

    How to Weld Aluminum To Steel | ESAB Knowledge Center

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  14. #29
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    We ended up passing on the job. We are a two man shop and we just don't have the capacity or the time since we are already very busy. The purchasing agent did say he had trouble getting quotes though. Anybody here have bad experience with platers? Like denting parts, etc?

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    Also, that job would require over 6 1/2 miles of round bar. In 8 weeks, I don't think so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Milland View Post
    Introduce him to explosive welding. And there's other ways too:

    How to Weld Aluminum To Steel | ESAB Knowledge Center
    Safe to say a shock/spring height setting fixture is not the place for explosive welding or any thing other than compatible metals.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cgrim3 View Post
    We ended up passing on the job. We are a two man shop and we just don't have the capacity or the time since we are already very busy. The purchasing agent did say he had trouble getting quotes though. Anybody here have bad experience with platers? Like denting parts, etc?
    Having wiped the tea off my screen !!!!!!!!!!!!!! I will counter that with ''Anybody here have good experience with platers?''

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  19. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by moonlight machine View Post
    Safe to say a shock/spring height setting fixture is not the place for explosive welding or any thing other than compatible metals.
    You're no fun anymore...

  20. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Limy Sami View Post
    Having wiped the tea off my screen !!!!!!!!!!!!!! I will counter that with ''Anybody here have good experience with platers?''
    Of course!

    The Platters - The Great Pretender - Lyrics - YouTube




    Oh, wait - "platers". Sorry...

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  22. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by cgrim3 View Post
    Hi all,

    We got this insane request for quote. I want to hear what everybody here thinks about this. The company who sent out the rfq is having a very hard time getting quotes.

    A company contacted us and wanted us to make some shafts, basic carbon steel (I asked what kind and they said the cheapest carbon steel we could find). Shaft is 33 inches long with 3/8-16 male threads on each end with a turned section in the middle of about 1.5 inches with two wrench flats. No big deal.

    The shafts then have to be zinc plated. There was nothing on the hand drawn print telling you how far under to make the pitch diameters of the threads and the turned section in the middle before plating. Depending on what class of thread your shooting for, I am pretty sure that for every .001" of plating, the pitch diameter must be decreased by .004" but there was nothing on the drawing about it. I said something to the purchasing agent and they said it was a good catch and they would let the engineers know. Also no tolerance block since it was a hand written drawing and there was no runout, total runout, cylindricity, etc call out either.

    Sounds like a so-so job you might get. The only thing is, they wanted 2000 pieces in a week, with a total of just over 12000 pieces in 8 weeks. Plating would be included in this time too.

    We are a two man shop. Needless to say, we aren't quoting it.

    What do you guys think? Would you have quoted it? We just don't have the man power or the time. Plus, the customer just sounded stingy with the money
    LOL!

    I am just finishing up a 10K pc order for a 1" version - similar to what you are saying.
    Running 2500/wk.
    Absolutely I'd quote it!

    And what's with the concern over all the little stuff?
    PD?
    CYL?

    You need the draftsman to tell you how to produce plated threads?

    I have yet to find the "rediculous" part of the RFQ in your post?


    As for stingy, at 12K pcs - you need to find a source that is competitive at this sort of part.
    What is "race to the bottom" pricing for one shop is $120/hr at the one accrost the street.


    ------------------

    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox

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  24. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by cgrim3 View Post
    Also, that job would require over 6 1/2 miles of round bar. In 8 weeks, I don't think so

    You didn't say the size of the barstock, but ass_u_meing that it is 3/8" CDR, you are only looking at 14,000#.
    This job may not be in your (apparently a LOT of yours') wheelhouse, but there is nothing ridiculous about it.

    Sure, getting parts that quick may not happen, but that is what they are asking for.
    They will either work with the best offer they git, or maybe the job will end up not getting done if no-one can meet the deadline.


    Quote Originally Posted by Limy Sami View Post
    Having wiped the tea off my screen !!!!!!!!!!!!!! I will counter that with ''Anybody here have good experience with platers?''

    Sure, my local guy!

    Years ago - I didn't know that there was a plater in our county.
    We took our parts to the city. (where I had to wait and wait)

    We had a batch of bleeder bodies (for remotely bleeding slave cylinders) out for plate, and I got the call that says that they couldn't doo them.
    They had ran them before - no problem, but apparently this time they jacked it up, and every time they stripped them to try again - they got worse.

    We picked them up, and I remembered a cold call that I got recently from some plating outfit local.
    I looked them up and took them over.
    "Can y'all fix these?"
    "Yep"

    And fixed they were!

    And he gets any and all of my plate work that fits him since.


    --------------------

    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox

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  26. #37
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    12,000 pcs in eight weeks might be repeat and steady 80,000+ per year for many years.
    Do things look different at that level?
    Yes, details, frustration and much hustle and lost money at first.
    Ox no rookie to this type run or work and has succeeded so I'd listen there to experience.
    This takes a very different point of view than a one to ten part runoff job shop. "Outside the box or a different box".
    Bob

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarbideBob View Post
    12,000 pcs in eight weeks might be repeat and steady 80,000+ per year for many years.
    Do things look different at that level?
    Yes, details, frustration and much hustle and lost money at first.
    Ox no rookie to this type run or work and has succeeded so I'd listen there to experience.
    This takes a very different point of view than a one to ten part runoff job shop. "Outside the box or a different box".

    Bob

    Yeah, maybe, but the other 68K are en-route from Suez as we speak....


    --------------------

    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ox View Post
    LOL!

    I am just finishing up a 10K pc order for a 1" version - similar to what you are saying.
    Running 2500/wk.
    Absolutely I'd quote it!

    And what's with the concern over all the little stuff?
    PD?
    CYL?

    You need the draftsman to tell you how to produce plated threads?

    I have yet to find the "rediculous" part of the RFQ in your post?


    As for stingy, at 12K pcs - you need to find a source that is competitive at this sort of part.
    What is "race to the bottom" pricing for one shop is $120/hr at the one accrost the street.


    ------------------

    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox
    I do this type of stuff all the time. Right now I am working 5k parts 8.75" long, Diamond knurl on one end, 1/4-20 on the other, 303 SS.

    Platers all have their own specialties. Anything threaded I would sent to a rack plater. They cost more due to the parts all being handled individually, but it is worth it. Electroless Nickel on anything threaded. Zinc is the same.

    I have a nickel and zinc plater that uses the barrel tumbled method. He tells me not every part can handle being tumbled. He wont do threads or knurls. Cheap lot charges though.

    I got some quotes from the electroless plater and smaller parts were around .35 cents for nickel. The same part I described above that I am making from 303 SS was quoted with zinc plated steel. Zinc was .80 cents each, rack plating.

    It was cheaper to pay more for 303 and not have to plate it.

    Anodizing shops all have their own specialties. I know a bunch of them that only do certain colors. The platers I know of in the Northeast all seem to know what they can and cant do. They dont try to do things they arent set up for.

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  30. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ox View Post
    Yeah, maybe, but the other 68K are en-route from Suez as we speak....
    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox
    Is there some reason you want to step on me so hard???
    My deal is do it here and find a way to do it here in my shop and compete.
    The real thing for others that you have have been there and seen the chaos.
    Much respect given.
    Bob


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