Help me choosing horizontal arbor for FIL250 universal mill
Close
Login to Your Account
Likes Likes:  0
Results 1 to 12 of 12
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Estonia
    Posts
    696
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    187

    Default Help me choosing horizontal arbor for FIL250 universal mill

    Hello !

    SK50 - BISON-BIAL S.A.

    These are my options, and as you see there are different types of horizontal arbors available. I need about 600..800 mm length. I dont have the "end support" or how do you call this triangular piece with bearing, so I have to buy this too.

    Please recommend what is the best option.

    Probably have to buy multiple arbors for different slitting saws and mills ?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Houston, TX USA
    Posts
    29,314
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Please recommend what is the best option.

    What suits the job AND THE MILLING CUTTER to be used is the best option

    If you have a bunch of 50mm bore cutters it would be silly to buy a 22 mm arbor

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Estonia
    Posts
    696
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    187

    Default

    Of course, I understand that the arbors needs to have same diameters as cutters.

    Question is - what kind of "end bearing" do i need ? There are multiple versions of same shaft with different end termination - thats why I need recommendations.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Hesperia, SoCal
    Posts
    4,362
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    987
    Likes (Received)
    646

    Default

    Normally, you'd shop for the arbor support(s) that fit your mill first. They come in a variety of support connections, ordinary centers, very commonly in small and large diameter bronze bushings with oil reservoir and "frictionless" bearings, ball, roller or needle. I'd avoid the center type, I recently converted a small industrial horizontal mill from disappointing center support to oiled bronze bushing.

    Then it's easy to select one or more arbors that are compatible with the arbor support and best fit the cutter ID's that you have the most of or are the more readily available at the best value.

    But I'm not certain that your mill is the typical "horizontal, universal, milling machine". Does it look like # 7 in this list? Master Group S.R.L.: Machining centres, Mechanical machinery, boring machines, milling machines, lathes or one of these? http://www.google.com/search?q=FIL25...w=1362&bih=798

    Bob
    Edit: Ah, found this, FIL250 universal mill answers my question, "is your mill the typical horizontal, universal, milling machine"?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails posterity.jpg  

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Estonia
    Posts
    696
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    187

    Default

    Looks like this: FIL FA 250 UNIVERSAL BED MILL

    I think that I need to manufacture the end support. So, which one of bearing types would work best for high quality low duty application ? I mean, I will use the horisontal only occasionaly for making T-slots etc. Bronze bushing seems good for vibration dampening, or perhaps bronze with "holes" and solid lubricants ? (I mean the yellow one with dark spots

    Please share experience !

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Hesperia, SoCal
    Posts
    4,362
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    987
    Likes (Received)
    646

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Madis Reivik View Post
    Looks like this: FIL FA 250 UNIVERSAL BED MILL

    I think that I need to manufacture the end support. So, which one of bearing types would work best for high quality low duty application ? I mean, I will use the horisontal only occasionaly for making T-slots etc. Bronze bushing seems good for vibration dampening, or perhaps bronze with "holes" and solid lubricants ? (I mean the yellow one with dark spots

    Please share experience !
    For your stated needs, the bronze bearing should work well for you.

    By the way, if you'd included "bed" with horizontal, universal mill, the responses would have been different. Not a matter of conversing in a non-native language, (which you do very well) just the full description.

    I'm now curious about the FIL 250's arbor support base. Does it resemble those that are optional for horizontal boring mills, (though I can't see the stationary mounting pad that it would need to work with the universal head) and did it come with the FIL 250? Another "by the way", to my eye the mill is magnificent!

    Bob

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Hesperia, SoCal
    Posts
    4,362
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    987
    Likes (Received)
    646

    Default

    OK, looked a little harder at the pic and now see that the arbor support mount would be a common one, the dovetail on the overarm. Common on Cincinatti horizontal mills and others. Should not be difficult to manufacture.

    A weldment makes the oil reservoir easy, though the steel dove tail would be a little less ideal than gray iron. With a little extra work, provision for an iron pad for the stationary side, (opposite the "iron" gib) could be made, or if an iron foundry is available, it's not out of reason to make a wooden "loose pattern" and simple core box, my personal favorite.

    It's not likely that another brand support can be found that can be modified for your machine, example: the narrow dimension of Cincinatti overarm dove tails are about 4-1/2" for the no. 2 and 6" for the nos. 3 & 4, with some material to increase those slightly and to possibly change the angles but another dimension would have to also be very close, dovetail to center of bearing.

    Bob

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Estonia
    Posts
    696
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    187

    Default

    Hello !

    The picture is not my mill, just same type. My piece of iron is fully repaired, but not yet painted (will be during next month Then I put some real pictures

    I will make a drawing about dovetail and horizontal spindle placement, and place it in forum, so perhaps something can be bought from ebay..

    Machine works great and if I compare it to the Soviet machines at the same era (80's), then it has less weight, more rigidity, more versatility and more travel. My neighbour has 20 ton soviet mill which occupies more floor space, has no horizontal spindle and vertical has fixed position (no tilting). And X travel is only 1600mm ! I'm very happy that I discarded the plans of repairing and overhauling that machine and bought FIL instead !
    Also, I have to make some fixtures on it and, when I asked price offers for these fixtures, the total cost was almost the price of FIL. And I think that its a 20 day job to make these fixtures.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Houston, TX USA
    Posts
    29,314
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    If going with bronze bushing, it is good to know that the fit up for the end of the arbor always includes a RUNNING BUSHING. These are the only "spacers" that are used as bearing surfaces and are ALWAYS slightly larger in diameter than the spacers themselves. The bushing in the arbor support will determine what arbors can be run in the machine. As a for instance, lots of smaller horizontal mills have 2 1/8" bores in the bronze bushing. You are not going to be able to run a 2" arbor in that machine simply because there are no RUNNING BUSHINGS made for that combination.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Estonia
    Posts
    696
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    187

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by johnoder View Post
    If going with bronze bushing, it is good to know that the fit up for the end of the arbor always includes a RUNNING BUSHING. These are the only "spacers" that are used as bearing surfaces and are ALWAYS slightly larger in diameter than the spacers themselves. The bushing in the arbor support will determine what arbors can be run in the machine. As a for instance, lots of smaller horizontal mills have 2 1/8" bores in the bronze bushing. You are not going to be able to run a 2" arbor in that machine simply because there are no RUNNING BUSHINGS made for that combination.
    Thanks ! So, if you could look to the Bison link - there seems to be different "running bushings" types available, one of them seems tapered - could this be the best choice ?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Houston, TX USA
    Posts
    29,314
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Never mind your Bison link.

    What I am talking about is easier to see here. Here is a running bushing. The bore is for a 1 1/4" arbor. The OD is for an arbor support that has a 1 7/8" bore in the bronze bushing.

    Arbor Running Bushing 1 7 8 x 3 1 8 x 1 1 4 Bison Bial | eBay


    Here is another running bushing. It is for an arbor that is 1" OD and its larger OD is for an arbor support that has that size bore it its bronze bushing

    5" x 1" Milling Arbor Running Bushing New | eBay

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    ch
    Posts
    2,093
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    194
    Likes (Received)
    274

    Default

    how do you set preload (or play) on a tapered bushing?


Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •