Home made tangential lathe tool

tarawa · Apr 2, 2013

While not considering myself a machinist by any means, I was able to follow some leads on this site to make a tangential (diamond) lathe tool. Of course if I had studied my math in high school, it would have been easier to use the sine vise, which I had no idea on setting up. All in all it was a good excersise in basic machining and the tool works. There is so much knowledge on this site.

tdmidget · Apr 3, 2013

Tangential? WTF was wrong with "tangent"?

Limy Sami · Apr 3, 2013

Tangential is the adjective of tangent.

Mark McGrath · Apr 3, 2013

thermite said:
All that is missing here is a small tool-steel chipbreaker atop to turn those spirals into shorter and safer cee-curls.

Bill

Hence Camscan pointing out it was missing the chipbreaker groove.
I don`t think you have set a lot of tools in a production machine,Bill.You would get laughed out the shop with loose chipbreakers on a tangential tool.
I know it was used on early insert turning tools but that was being set before the tool was put in the machine.

Mark McGrath · Apr 3, 2013

tarawa said:
While not considering myself a machinist by any means, I was able to follow some leads on this site to make a tangential (diamond) lathe tool. Of course if I had studied my math in high school, it would have been easier to use the sine vise, which I had no idea on setting up. All in all it was a good excersise in basic machining and the tool works. There is so much knowledge on this site.

There was quite a big thread within the last year on a Homeshop forum about the manufacture and use of these tools.
Very,very common on automatic lathes and capstans but rare on centre lathes in industry.
See of you can find anything on Google for Herbert Chipstream.

DDoug · Apr 3, 2013

Mark McGrath said:
See of you can find anything on Google for Herbert Chipstream.

Roller Box Tooling Products | High Quality Rollerboxes | CNC Lathes

or deese guys.....

Maybe they are one in the same ?

tarawa · Apr 3, 2013

Thanks. I think the diamond designation just refers to the shap of the square tool,once it is sharpened at the 30 degree angle.

tarawa · Apr 3, 2013

The lathe is a round head (circa late 1960s) Colchester Triumph. It seems to have plenty of power and is quite solid. I have it set up with a Jacobs Speed Chuck. I was able to purchase the chuck from another PM member.

thermite said:
..and works well. Good job.

Dunno what lathe you have it on, but if you had not yet noticed, these can do a lot of work with not much power, and be sharpened very rapidly once the basic form has been shaped.

Bill

Mark McGrath · Apr 3, 2013

digger doug said:
Roller Box Tooling Products | High Quality Rollerboxes | CNC Lathes[/url

Maybe they are one in the same ?

Totally different,more modern than Herbert.

Herbert produced the slipstream tool with a deep vee across the face to produce the tightly curled chip.You then mounted a little guard for it to hit to break it of in short lengths.

Mark McGrath · Apr 3, 2013

camscan said:
There is a very good one made by Brock in Coventry UK (now Wickman I think) which releases at the end of the cut, no return marks, brilliant.

I have a few of the Brock T I boxes including ones with auto release to stop marking on the pull off.I had them for Wickman multis too.

Mark McGrath · Apr 3, 2013

thermite;2009166 NOT grinding the top of a HSS blank said:
And how exactly did you sharpen these tools when you were not allowed to grind the top of them?

Mark McGrath · Apr 3, 2013

thermite said:
BTW 'separate'. Not 'loose'.

Nothing 'loose' about 'em or they just don't do their job.

Bill

They were loose while you were setting the tool,surely.

Limy Sami · Apr 3, 2013

camscan said:
30 degrees seems heavy but we all had to learn. You might like to look up Brown & sharpe set up booklets

The higher the sheer angle the easier the tool will cut (handy on some ''stringy'' materials) against ;- the edge will wear faster, especially on tougher / harder materials.

IME, Sometimes ''breaking the rules'' on tool angles is the only way to get the job done in a given circumstance.

sfriedberg · Apr 3, 2013

camscan said:
You say you have done skiving in the past then you must have lipped the skiving tool to get decent results surely.

You were asking thermite, not me, but no, I don't lip my skiving tools for the Hardinge DSM-59. The holder's got 5 degrees of work-side clearance built in, which makes tool layout for form grinding more of a nuisance than for other machines. But I grind the cutting faces for sharpening flat with appropriate approach and rake angles and let it go at that. No attempt at a chip breaking lip.

Mark McGrath · Apr 4, 2013

camscan said:
Mark, I have been trying to reply to your PM but am mailing fiserably (no surprise there). I agree with you ref. tool holders but they are hard to find,

Hi Ken.I got your PM`s.Nice to talk to you.

Mark McGrath · Apr 4, 2013

thermite said:
For sure.

And the majority of the wild ideas don't work after all. Some even lead to a share of 'Oh shit!' moments.

Bill

I was cutting the irrelevant bit`s out of this post and got down this,but don`t see much of relevance here either,but,will need to leave something or it won`t be a quote.
It`s nothing personal Bill but you really need to stick to what you know about.

See,the people I`m agreeing with in this thread come from a lot of years of on the floor experience.
The experimental stuff has been carried out over thirty years ago,they have done the learning,they know what works and what doesn`t work.
When companies such as the worlds big automatic lathe builders give you a book and say this in our experience is the best way,well then you listen to them.

Mark McGrath · Apr 4, 2013

digger doug said:
Roller Box Tooling Products | High Quality Rollerboxes | CNC Lathes

or deese guys.....

Maybe they are one in the same ?

I was rereading this and am now thinking Brock copied the Herbert tool to the extent their carbide inserts have a groove to curl the chip.
Will need to take a look at one.

tarawa · Apr 4, 2013

I picked up my Colchester Triumph 7 1/2 (15" x 30" ) from a craigslist ad. I was actually looking for a Monarch 10EE, but prices on one that was usable seemed high here in Florida. The Colchester was sitting in a shop in Miami not being used. The seller disclosed that it had some problems, including the fact that there was no half nut installed, but the parts were included. The seller was real cooperative when I told him that I couldn't pick it up for about a month while I was on a work assignment. Delivery to Palm Beach cost me $300.00 and this included removing the Sheldon Lathe and setting the Colchester. When I got the lathe finally running, I realized that the motor was running hot (wired for 480V) and that some of the other wiring was totally wrong. I also made a new half nut and got it working again. All in all a great beast of a lathe. Now to learn to use it correctly!

thermite said:
Pragmatic choice for a small shop.

Have to admit I grumbled a bit when a reasonably well-equipped Triumph 2K went for under US$ 1,600 within 50 miles of the house only about a month after I had hauled a 'naked' 10EE back close-to 500 miles. Transport and rigging equipment rental had added damned near the price of that 2K on top of the 10EE's purchase price before it was even off the skid.

Figure the 10EE will have $4500 - $5,000 in it before year's end, and will still only have 20" between centres.

Mind, a 10EE isn't otherwise what one would class as a 'hardship'..

Bill

Mark McGrath · Apr 4, 2013

tarawa said:
I picked up my Colchester Triumph 7 1/2 (15" x 30" )

These are the best Triumph models.Far better quality than the square heads that followed them.Still average in terms of industrial lathes though.

atomarc · Apr 4, 2013

Mark McGrath said:
It`s nothing personal Bill but you really need to stick to what you know about.

+1 The cat is out of the bag...finally! :crazy:

Stuart

Home made tangential lathe tool

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