ChipChaff
Cast Iron
- Joined
- Dec 15, 2007
- Location
- Mid-Wisconsin
I bought some stuff back when Hoff was Hoff-Hilk and still get notices when auctions are coming up. Their "July Machinery Exchange" came up and I saw some things I'd like to have if the price were right so I placed an initial bid of the minimum amount just so I could keep track of the items by my bid until things started to heat up towards the end. I have an odd memory for numbers and I kept seeing what I think were the same bidder numbers bidding against me as I'd seen in previous auctions. I figured it could be someone like me who places minimal bids to track items, or a reseller, or someone who just wanted to jack up the price. Still, I thought there'd be no harm in writing the company to see what their policies were regarding sellers bidding up their own items and whether they had any mechanisms for identifying shills. It was a very matter of fact, non-accusatory request for information which went unanswered.
I figured by law they would have to disclose the rules of the game - this is excerpted from the "Terms and Conditions" from their site:
3. RESERVE: All assets in the auction shall be sold to the highest bidder. Some items may be auctioned with minimum reserve prices, and/or subject to the sellers right of confirmation. On lots with a reserve the auctioneer reserves the right to bid on behalf of the seller. Hoff Online Auctions reserves the right to reject any bid that is only a minimal increase over the previous bid.
13. ADDITIONS OR WITHDRAWALS: Hoff Online Auctions may, in its discretion, offer the assets for sale by the piece or by the lot, or in any manner that best serves the interest of the seller. The seller has the right to add assets before the bidding, or remove assets from the auction either before or after bidding has been completed. In the event of a removal after bidding has been completed, the purchasers sole remedy shall be the refund of any purchase price actually paid.
Couple the fact that the auctioneer can bid up the price of an item to drag legitimate buyers along with the right of the seller to withdraw an item after bidding has begun or even ended and the only recourse is the refund of any purchase price actually paid (which is almost certainly zero) with a 15% buyer premium and 7.75% mandatory sales tax (24% above and beyond the bid) and it's a rigged game. Caveat emptor!
I figured by law they would have to disclose the rules of the game - this is excerpted from the "Terms and Conditions" from their site:
3. RESERVE: All assets in the auction shall be sold to the highest bidder. Some items may be auctioned with minimum reserve prices, and/or subject to the sellers right of confirmation. On lots with a reserve the auctioneer reserves the right to bid on behalf of the seller. Hoff Online Auctions reserves the right to reject any bid that is only a minimal increase over the previous bid.
13. ADDITIONS OR WITHDRAWALS: Hoff Online Auctions may, in its discretion, offer the assets for sale by the piece or by the lot, or in any manner that best serves the interest of the seller. The seller has the right to add assets before the bidding, or remove assets from the auction either before or after bidding has been completed. In the event of a removal after bidding has been completed, the purchasers sole remedy shall be the refund of any purchase price actually paid.
Couple the fact that the auctioneer can bid up the price of an item to drag legitimate buyers along with the right of the seller to withdraw an item after bidding has begun or even ended and the only recourse is the refund of any purchase price actually paid (which is almost certainly zero) with a 15% buyer premium and 7.75% mandatory sales tax (24% above and beyond the bid) and it's a rigged game. Caveat emptor!