lathe chuck identification

winger · Feb 19, 2020

One of the guys I work with just had to put a cheater bar on the chuck key and broke off a tooth on the pinion.

the chuck is a 6" 6jaw and about 40 years old. It was still pretty good.

Any way, there is a counterbore for a logo on the face but the label is long gone. Inside I did find a horse head logo. Any one have a clue as to the brand.
Lathe (Doall/ Harrison) was bought in 1978, but this chuck was probably a year or two later.

MSC catalog has pinions for Bison and Gibraltor, but they do not look close.
Checked Travers and McMaster, no joy.

Thought it might be a Buck.
Buck's web sight has been mostly unresponsive for me tonight.

Dave

thermite · Feb 19, 2020

winger said:
One of the guys I work with just had to put a cheater bar on the chuck key and broke off a tooth on the pinion.

the chuck is a 6" 6jaw and about 40 years old. It was still pretty good.

Hem's sake. Scroll-actuated chucks are consumables.

40 years? Just order-in pulled-pork BBQ, vegetarian pizza, or Halal chicken, wotever suits.

Hold a wake for the loyal hunk of Iron, and send it off for recycling.

New Feurda/Gator 6", 6 jaws are "decent", yah start-over with no jaw or scroll wear or damage, and it even has the adjust-true type of feature.

donie · Feb 20, 2020

If the horse head logo is a Sea Horse, it is made in Japan, and probably was a good chuck. The older Buck 6" 6 jaw chucks are pretty delicate because to put 6 jaws in a small circle does not leave a lot of metal in the front piece. Using a cheater on such a small scroll chuck will really distort it.
This is a vintage 6" Buck on a Monarch ee, the chuck has limited use for working on thin wall bushings, it does not have alot of holding power that is needed for turning hard materials.
The next size up 8" 6jaw chucks are more robust, and heavier.

DDoug · Feb 20, 2020

Have the offendee fix it.

4GSR · Feb 20, 2020

winger said:
One of the guys I work with just had to put a cheater bar on the chuck key and broke off a tooth on the pinion.

the chuck is a 6" 6jaw and about 40 years old. It was still pretty good.

.......................................
Dave

Why would you ever put a cheater pipe on a chuck wrench on a 6" chcuk of any type!!!! Especially a 6-jaw chuck. Argggg...

As Thermite said, give it a proper burial and go buy a new one. This time, fire the guy the next time he puts a cheater on the chuck wrench!!!

thermite · Feb 20, 2020

donie said:
chuck has limited use for working on thin wall bushings, it does not have alot of holding power that is needed for turning hard materials.

+1 The whole POINT of a six-jaw is for use where one cannot and SHOULD not apply a great deal of stress "per each jaw". That - and shortening the arc BETWEEN them - more "lobes" less movement, each - is why more jaws, more points of contact were needed in the first place.

It takes very little to cause a ring or tube to distort. Even when not so thin.

A six-jaw chuck is NOT a 3-J with extra grip. The opposite, rather. LESS total grip, usually on any material as WON'T flex.

They are for the "finesse" of getting by with a lighter touch and should rank about dead-last for even hard tightening, let alone applying any sort of "cheater".

My one spends most - over 99.99 percent - of its life OFF the spindle in a drawer with VPI paper.

As it should do for a special-purpose item that I'd like to be in reliable condition when it actually IS needed.

Most bushing or sleeves, I have collets large enough to manage.

Any shop as NEEDS a 6-Jaw for daily working of rings or tubes too large for collets (or step and pot chucks..), the bugger SHOULD have two-piece jaws, have "brothers and sisters" so it isn't a show-stopper, and yah should be making USE of that top-jaw advantage by machining them for best fit to your reg'lar work.

atex57 · Feb 20, 2020

If it is a three pinion then weld the hole shut and grind off the teeth.

If it is a single pinion then TIG weld up the broken tooth with 312 SS rod and make the assaulter file it back to shape.

Ed.

thermite · Feb 20, 2020

atex57 said:
If it is a three pinion then weld the hole shut and grind off the teeth.

If it is a single pinion then TIG weld up the broken tooth with 312 SS rod and make the assaulter file it back to shape.

Ed.

Too generous by half!

Weird and varied a world as we live in with forty-leben distinct sex-who's-alley-tease by now?

Must be tongue-condoms with abrasive tips on some o'those online adverts websites keep tryin' to pop-up.. or in the case of THAT sort of goods? Mebbe pop-UNDER?

Tyrone Shoelaces · Feb 20, 2020

Who uses a pipe on a chuck key on a 6" chuck ? The guy needs to consider a career change - like a strong man in a circus or maybe getting in the ring with Tyson Fury.

Regards Tyrone.

thermite · Feb 20, 2020

Tyrone Shoelaces said:
Who uses a pipe on a chuck key on a 6" chuck ? The guy needs to consider a career change - like a strong man in a circus or maybe getting in the ring with Tyson Fury.

Regards Tyrone.

Too greedy for sensationalism, that bizness of involving innocent bystanders.

More better he just does a "selfie video" of pounding 40 lbs of medium-coarse sand up his own patootie until "all gone".

winger · Feb 20, 2020

I work in a maintenance shop and this year is going to be the worst for capital, so no luck getting a replacement. The 6 jaw gets used a lot due to reworking parts and tubing.

I was a little bummed out and had told him before that the 3 or 4 jaw was better for holding.

A lot of things happen that I was taught differently.
The guy is working this weekend and I left it apart on the bench, doubt if he will attempt to fix it. He had to make a new chuck key Tue and don't think he knew he broke the pinion.. I had made the previous key and thought maybe I didn't draw it back enough was why it broke. Aside from the cheater bar'

Didn't think of building the tooth back up. that will be easier than making a new one. No loss if I fail. Fortunately the scroll still looks good.

Is Seahorse still made? google didn't find any.

About 15 months left and no longer my problem. Most of the time I just shake off some of the stupids and think Job security.

Dave

LKeithR · Feb 21, 2020

winger said:
...I work in a maintenance shop and this year is going to be the worst for capital, so no luck getting a replacement...

...About 15 months left and no longer my problem. Most of the time I just shake off some of the stupids and think Job security...

This is a working shop and they can't afford a 6" chuck? Maybe time to find another job. I know; you've
only got 15 months left--but are they going to last that long?

thermite · Feb 21, 2020

LKeithR said:
This is a working shop and they can't afford a 6" chuck? Maybe time to find another job. I know; you've
only got 15 months left--but are they going to last that long?

Fuerda/Gator 6" 6-J with two-piece jaws, THREE pinion adjust and your choice of centering adjust via the "usual suspect" of moving the body a skosh with Adjust-true mount ELSE a different system that attends to individual jaw fine adjust, will set you back a tad under one large.

Around $900 to $1000 USD.

Plain-Jane one-piece solid jaw with NO such adjust is waaay cheaper. The 'in-between choice', solid one-piece jaws but WITH Adjust-tru is mebbe $600 or a bit.

"Best 6-jaws made"? I make no such claim!

Value for money? That, they certainly ARE in semi-steel or forged, and with forged-steel backplate for the adjusting spigot's long life.

Bottom-end? A San Ou basic 6-jaw at least beats a bustid one, but I'd go for the Gator:

https://www.fasttobuy.com/six-jaw-s...ks-k13100k13125k13160k13200k13250_p36760.html

NEED a 6-jaw, yet HAVE NO 6-jaw now after living off ONE for 40 years and no budget for even a few hundred bucks?

Pilgrim? EITHER ...your employer has done et their damned seed-corn, and long-since... OR they have staff simply conditioned to be AFRAID to step up and ASK for what they need to get the job DONE!

Your paycheck ain't yet bounced at the bank? I'm betting on "Numbah TWO".

The money is THERE if it is genuinely NEEDED.

Step up, fess up, and ASK FOR IT ....under yer OWN roof.

DDoug · Feb 21, 2020

LKeithR said:
This is a working shop and they can't afford a 6" chuck? Maybe time to find another job. I know; you've
only got 15 months left--but are they going to last that long?

They will be able to in 16 months...The Op's pay will buy many new toys for the remaining employees....

winger · Feb 21, 2020

I don't think the plant is going totally down, but our main customer cut back to the point we shut down for 7 weeks last year. Probably going to happen at the end of this year also.
I never skipped a beat and had a 7 week run in a job shop and didn't have to file unemployment. Not as much per hour but enough to stay comfortable. Actually had fun making parts again. I was actually offered a full time job but I want to keep my ss taxable income up there for another year. 2 to 3 days a week is my plan after bailing out of the plant. My current job is actually pretty low pressure but the years are starting to take a toll on my attitude.

We have 2 other lathes so the need isn't dire.

Plant budget was cut by 200k this year so a new chuck is very low priority. I don't mind using a 4 jaw anyway. Most years I managed to get a large purchase through. Last year I got a digital readout on the surface grinder.

Dave

DDoug · Feb 21, 2020

winger said:
.
I never skipped a beat and had a 7 week run in a job shop and didn't have to file unemployment. Not as much per hour but enough to stay comfortable.

You've paid into unemployment for how many years ?

Consider it a vacation.

thermite · Feb 21, 2020

winger said:
I don't think the plant is going totally down, but our main customer cut back to the point we shut down for 7 weeks last year. Probably going to happen at the end of this year also.
I never skipped a beat and had a 7 week run in a job shop and didn't have to file unemployment. Not as much per hour but enough to stay comfortable. Actually had fun making parts again. I was actually offered a full time job but I want to keep my ss taxable income up there for another year. 2 to 3 days a week is my plan after bailing out of the plant. My current job is actually pretty low pressure but the years are starting to take a toll on my attitude.

We have 2 other lathes so the need isn't dire.

Plant budget was cut by 200k this year so a new chuck is very low priority. I don't mind using a 4 jaw anyway. Most years I managed to get a large purchase through. Last year I got a digital readout on the surface grinder.

Dave

Second firm I worked for after back from 'nam - early 1969 - was a seriously INTERESTING place to learn a LOT and FAST from some folks already "technically" legendary. Basic grocery-store arithmetic, OTOH? NOT so much!

Third day on the job was a payday. No paycheck due for ME - they'd put those three days onto the NEXT payroll. I was good with that.

Wuddn' yah know it? They DID bounce the entire payroll!

Took-on the additional tasking of FIXING that little problem, and left with another new skillset more in-demand than the high-tech sciences I'd been chasing when I went in the door. it wasn't that progressively more responsible Finance and Management paid better than Engineering "at the beginning". They assuredly did not. It was that they were skills more "portable" and had no pre-defined UPPER BOUND as to compensation.

It's a dynamic world.

Might not get "rich", body-corporate or body-personal, either one. But neither is sitting still and going without whilst waiting for some OTHER entity to make you well a particularly wise course, let-alone cast in stone.

2 retirements worth..

winger · Feb 21, 2020

I should have added that a 10 year supply contract was signed, but with a lesser quantity. So the plant is very likely secure. Instead of running 24-7 and 4 crews now working 40hr 3 crews. Then in summer work a 6 day(48hrs) week. A lot of unhappy campers on this. But at least enough notice to save up. Doesn't affect me 4day 10.5 hr days, but the moral of the whole place is in the dumps.
As far as unemployment, I'm not really an outdoor in the winter type so I would just be playing in my own shop. The job shop is owned by a friend and he was swamped with orders, so it was good timing for both of us.

I was really amazed at some of the jobs that came in the door. I am so used to trying to fix anything in the plant, then to see simple jobs come in from other plants around the area.
Part if his place is a fab shop with a laser and presses. That was a new experience occasionally running a press brake.

Still like making stuff and not quite ready to quit. It is still a really good job for me. Unless a machine is down, no pressure and I pick the parts I want to work on.
Market changes cause some of it, but some of the changes by current management is just because they can regardless of morale. They seem intent on making it less than great with the changes every year.

I'm also a little bummed out that with less hours this year will not at to the pension amount.

enough ranting

Dave

DDoug · Feb 22, 2020

15 more months to go.....hide the broken chuck, then on your last day find some 3/8" logging chain, 6' will doo nicely.

Weld one end to the chuck body.

Walk up to the chuck breaking fool, wrap one end of chain around his ankle, attach
it with a padlock and stroll out.

winger · Feb 26, 2020

Just for the challenge I made a new pinion. 11 tooth bevel gear.Been a couple years since I took out the dividing head.
Hand grinding the tool bit to form was the tough part.
I made it out of 4140, and works well, so I will see if it holds up.

He did get the message and fessed up that he should not use cheater bars on the chucks.

Dave

lathe chuck identification

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