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norton sanding belts are coming unglued

tnmgcarbide

Diamond
Joined
Jul 6, 2004
Location
N. GA- 33.992N , -83.72W usa
i bought a case of 100 norton 4" grinder belts around 2006. okay, so they're 12 years old but does that mean that the
splice holding them together should all fail? anyway , i've trashed about a dozen or so . interesting that
the Deer Brand taiwanese belts i bought around 1999 are still together.
they were all stored in the same cabinet.

is there any decent shop-method for re-splicing grinding belts? i've reinforced the joint with the fiberglas
packing tape, done glue jobs with denim and contact cement... but i'm not looking to reinvent the wheel.

i suppose i 'd just feel guilty trashing the remaining 20 or so away.
 
I haven't tried it yet, but I was told by a woodworker the iron patches for clothing work. This was involving 25" x 75" belts so the economy was a little different.
 
A rant

i bought a case of 100 norton 4" grinder belts around 2006. okay, so they're 12 years old but does that mean that the
splice holding them together should all fail? anyway , i've trashed about a dozen or so . interesting that
the Deer Brand taiwanese belts i bought around 1999 are still together.
they were all stored in the same cabinet.

is there any decent shop-method for re-splicing grinding belts? i've reinforced the joint with the fiberglas
packing tape, done glue jobs with denim and contact cement... but i'm not looking to reinvent the wheel.

i suppose i 'd just feel guilty trashing the remaining 20 or so away.
A rant,I just wish that someone would invent a worthless time wasting teenage game that somehow used sanding belts. You would THEN FINNALY see endless seamless sanding belts.Just dreaming. Edwin Dirnbeck
 
its not just the 4x36 . the 4 x 106 on my somaca, the 6x48 on my rockwell. they all fail at the splice.
interesting that the chinese ones seem to hold up better over time. i will just have to modify my habits of
buying in bulk...treat abrasives like produce.

don't get me started on the "beartex' non-woven wheels that turned to shit. (if only they had woven them...)
it really sucks when a $200 deburring wheel delaminates.. and you have several more in the box....
 
Previous threads over the years on here show your not the first to suffer this, i dont think its all that brand specific more glue specific. Don't thnk any of the big abrasive names glue there own belts, they are all made up by others.

Only sure fire solution seams to be use - buy in quantities you can use up in a few years and keep them dry and in the dark cool environment. Seam to recall last time this came up life span issues were reported from about year 5-6 onwards.
 
don't get me started on the "beartex' non-woven wheels that turned to shit. (if only they had woven them...)

Never had a issue with thoes, that said i generally try to stick with 3m and theres seam to be more melted together than stuck with a bonding agent. That said i hate the labels on the 3m cubitron flap discs, they always fail in use and make me jump!
 
I have a number of Norton belts, among other brands, some I'm sure going back to the age of those of the OP, and haven't experienced join failures. Belts are stored in large plastic bags on a bottom shelf of the grinding station. The plastic bag is mainly to exclude airborne grinding dust, although it also probably reduces exposure to dampness.

-Marty-
 
its not just the 4x36 . the 4 x 106 on my somaca, the 6x48 on my rockwell. they all fail at the splice.
interesting that the chinese ones seem to hold up better over time. i will just have to modify my habits of
buying in bulk...treat abrasives like produce.
Cheap Chinese ones that I have seen have overlap joint that tends to "bang" every time it passes the workpiece. 3M and many others use separate tape "patch" that runs smoother but is apparently more prone to fail.

Never used but Misumi is selling what appears to be actually seamless belts:
Endless Abrasive Belt WK by KOYO-SHA | MISUMI online shop - Select, configure, order
Koyo-Sha Co., Ltd. > Products Information > Industrial Products Index > Abrasive Cloth Products Index > Abrasive Belt

They can make seamless T-shirts so why not grinding belts? :angry:
 
I think they do have a shelf life, and, after that, are more likely to fail.
That said, I have never had that happen with a klingspor, and I have been running em since the late 80s.
They do make their own, some here, some in Germany.

I usually only have a 3 year stock, though, so I cant swear I have run 12 year old cask aged belts.
 
the asian belts i have don't have a chunky seam , but they are directional . arrows printed
inside say the way to go. can't really imagine wanting to turn the thing around . maybe that's a woodworking
trick.

haven't tried a kilngspor, but i have many german hermes belts that delaminated. it's ok. my dad appreciates
when i give him "rolls of sandpaper"
 
the asian belts i have don't have a chunky seam , but they are directional . arrows printed
inside say the way to go. can't really imagine wanting to turn the thing around . maybe that's a woodworking
trick.

haven't tried a kilngspor, but i have many german hermes belts that delaminated. it's ok. my dad appreciates
when i give him "rolls of sandpaper"


I like Klingspor. Mine have taped joints but also have directional arrows. I figured that's so they if they are removed that they can be put back on in the same direction. I've had some fail, but not sure how old they were, probably 5 years or more.
 
i bought a case of 100 norton 4" grinder belts around 2006. okay, so they're 12 years old but does that mean that the
splice holding them together should all fail? anyway , i've trashed about a dozen or so . interesting that
the Deer Brand taiwanese belts i bought around 1999 are still together.
they were all stored in the same cabinet.

is there any decent shop-method for re-splicing grinding belts? i've reinforced the joint with the fiberglas
packing tape, done glue jobs with denim and contact cement... but i'm not looking to reinvent the wheel.

i suppose i 'd just feel guilty trashing the remaining 20 or so away.


I've never bought a case of belts at a time. The shop I worked at did, but I think more disappeared to other machines throughout the company than were actually used in our shop. I now buy them half a dozen at a time mainly because of the issues you are talking about. It seems that over time the glue joint dries and it doesn't take much pressure against the belt for it to fail. It's probably more expensive to buy them in small quantities, but at least they all get worn out rather than disintegrating before your very eyes.

I've also taken to buying the 12" disks in smaller quantities. About 3 years ago I ordered a couple dozen of them. By the time I got to the last few they wouldn't even stay on the platen for more than a day if they weren't used. They would slowly peel off and fall inside the motor cabinet. When I would pull them out they seemed sticky, just not sticky enough to stay adhered to the cold steel.

Now I order both the belts and the disks half a dozen at a time. I get them either from McMaster or a local supplier. I seem to go through them fast enough that they still have enough adhesive to remain intact or stuck to the platen until it's time for a change.

The only trouble with McMaster is that you really never know what brand you're going to get. So far so good. The one time I did have a quality problem with one of the product they sell (not with sanding belts) they sent me replacements at no charge including shipping.
 
I have also noticed this problem. I don't do a lot of wood work but I have two hand held belt sanders. I only buy two or three belts at a time and I have often had the second and third one fail after only a minute or two on the sander. Not worth even buying a second one when I have a project at hand. Why the heck can't they find a good glue? Perhaps they do not include a shelf test in their QC programs.

I never thought of buying the cheap, import belts as a solution.
 
I gave up on my heavy duty Rockwell 6" belt grinder years ago. Any belt - and I tried them all - more than a few days in stock or in service self destructed in a most noisy and spectacular way

I figured it was Houston humidity, but who knows

I even tried storing some in the house in air conditioning - same result
 
I purchased a large lot of belts from Porter Cable figuring I would be stocked up for the foreseeable future. After 5 years or so, I found the seam would fail as soon as the belt warmed up.

I spoke to a retired chemist who worked for 3M. He stated the adhesive will degrade over time no matter how you store them. He was surprised that they lasted 5 years before I had seam failures.

The adhesive is specific for this application and not generally available.

I just pitched the remainder of the belts and now only purchase as required. I have observed seam failure on belts from a number of manufacturers, The more interesting question is whether the adhesive could be modified to last longer or whether it was designed to degrade over time...
 
The real test on any belt joint is grinding 3/4 inch corner radii on a heavy mold insert.A heavy block of steel 3x8x12 .As an apprentice years ago ,I was told to "just do it". There was a lot more manual skills needed in the "old days" to compensate for stupidity and doing the same dumb things over and over.Edwin Dirnbeck
 
Cheap Chinese ones that I have seen have overlap joint that tends to "bang" every time it passes the workpiece. 3M and many others use separate tape "patch" that runs smoother but is apparently more prone to fail.

Never used but Misumi is selling what appears to be actually seamless belts:
Endless Abrasive Belt WK by KOYO-SHA | MISUMI online shop - Select, configure, order
Koyo-Sha Co., Ltd. > Products Information > Industrial Products Index > Abrasive Cloth Products Index > Abrasive Belt

They can make seamless T-shirts so why not grinding belts? :angry:
I looked at the MIUMI SITE ,and they do indeed have TRU SEEMLESS ENDLESS SANDING BELTS.You must register and be a corporation to buy from them.Who does this anymore? This is 2018 .Edwin Dirnbeck
 
All is not lost, even it the splice fails. You can still cut them up and use them on oscillating sanders.

I've got some old Harbor Freight belts that were made in Russia. After 7-8 years, they seem to hold up OK.
 
Now your results may vary, but I have some Scotch #27 Glass cloth Electrical tape. It is meant for heat controls in ovens and furnaces. It is real strong but thin. I apply on the back of the belt overlapping the original splice a few inches on either side longways and cut the tape at a slant depending on which direction the belt runs. I have a bunch of old belts and I do this to them before I put them on the machine. Doesn't cause a bump that I can tell. Haven't broken one yet,.. but I might be just lucky.
 








 
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