OT Imron paint question

swellwelder · Apr 1, 2012

Is it possible to tint white Imron paint? And if so, what kind of tint is used? Also, is there a best type of reducer to use for spray application?

Dale Nelson

abarnsley · Apr 1, 2012

Call up the local paint supply shops that sell Imron. They know more about it than most... Additives, Haz Mat cautions, VOC's, Reducers, Tints, Primers, Topcoats, etc.

Many variables on surface prep, final use, suitability for a particular application...

sfriedberg · Apr 2, 2012

If you don't have a positive pressure air hood (or a self-contained breathing apparatus), I'd think twice and then once more before using Imron and/or Nitram While the current formulations are not as exceedingly toxic as the original, extreme precautions are required when spraying Imron or other two-part polyurethanes. There is NO approved respirator cartridge. Everyone in the exposure area must have a positive pressure clean air feed.

The original formulation required a full-on hazmat suit ("bubble suit") when spraying. The current formulation still requires positive pressure air feed, and definite protection against skin exposure.

Imron is NOT a DIY garage paint.

jocat54 · Apr 2, 2012

sfriedberg said:
If you don't have a positive pressure air hood (or a self-contained breathing apparatus), I'd think twice and then once more before using Imron and/or Nitram While the current formulations are not as exceedingly toxic as the original, extreme precautions are required when spraying Imron or other two-part polyurethanes. There is NO approved respirator cartridge. Everyone in the exposure area must have a positive pressure clean air feed.

The original formulation required a full-on hazmat suit ("bubble suit") when spraying. The current formulation still requires positive pressure air feed, and definite protection against skin exposure.

Imron is NOT a DIY garage paint.

Totally agree---Imron is nasty stuff. yes I have sprayed it before--long ago.

akajun · Apr 2, 2012

sfriedberg said:
If you don't have a positive pressure air hood (or a self-contained breathing apparatus), I'd think twice and then once more before using Imron and/or Nitram While the current formulations are not as exceedingly toxic as the original, extreme precautions are required when spraying Imron or other two-part polyurethanes. There is NO approved respirator cartridge. Everyone in the exposure area must have a positive pressure clean air feed.

The original formulation required a full-on hazmat suit ("bubble suit") when spraying. The current formulation still requires positive pressure air feed, and definite protection against skin exposure.

Imron is NOT a DIY garage paint.

I beg to differ. I and my stepfather painted a V tail Bonanaza and a Cessna 182, and my Yamaha fzr600 (twice!!!) with Imron and did it in the hangar. We sprayed the floor down to keep dust down, then commenced to spraying with an HLVP gun.
IIRC the reducer we used was Imron branded and listed on back of the can. The paint shop I bought the paint from tinted it whatever color I wanted.

sfriedberg · Apr 2, 2012

akajun said:
I beg to differ.

akajun, it's good that you and your stepfather didn't kill yourselves. But you were really damned lucky. I cannot in good conscience let this pass, because others will not be so lucky. And in fact, others have not been so lucky. One statistic is that a single exposure gives about 10% of those exposed permanent lung damage.

I repeat: Imron is not a do-it-yourself garage paint. The health hazards (permanent brain, liver and lung damage) are serious, and require professional level protection against lung and skin exposure.

If you have professional level protective gear and skills, go for it. If not, have a professional do it or choose a different type of paint.

lazlo · Apr 2, 2012

akajun said:
I beg to differ. I and my stepfather painted a V tail Bonanaza and a Cessna 182, and my Yamaha fzr600 (twice!!!) with Imron and did it in the hangar. We sprayed the floor down to keep dust down, then commenced to spraying with an HLVP gun.

Likewise -- I've painted all my machines with Polane, which is Sherwin-Williams' version of Imron. 3M has an organic vapor cartridge: 6051 that's specifically rated for isocyanates. You have to replace the cartridge within it's rated exposure time (30 hours, IIRC), and keep it sealed in the ziplock back it comes in.

The isocyanate epoxies have really smelly thinners (MAK), so if you can smell the thinner, you need to switch cartridges.

What are Isocyanates - 3M
http://multimedia.3m.com/mws/mediaw...ZgVs6EVs6E666666--&fn=TU Isocyanates 0707.pdf

moonlight machine · Apr 2, 2012

While we are on the subject of Imron....I have a '68 Camaro that I did all the bodywork on in '86 including blue Imron paint, I ended up moving and changing jobs and never finished it. I planed on white stripes on the hood and trunk lid then clear coat. I was told at the time I painted it that the white and clear had to be done within a week or you would have adhesion problems. How about now 26 years after I started the project? I swear I'll try to Finnish it this summer.......

Steve in SoCal · Apr 2, 2012

I guess I am the third exception to use Imron and other Isocyanates. I have painted a V-tail Bonanza, Cherokee and, Cessna 310 in small T-hangars. I have also painted several motorcycles and machines. I don't want to encourage anybody to be careless but, it IS possible to paint with Imron safely as a DYI er.

Regarding health hazards; they are real. I has a friend years ago who was a custom car painter that had a very bad reaction to Imron.

Steve

Mark Rand · Apr 3, 2012

I also used an isocyanate rated cartridge when I painted my HLV with two part paint. Precautions (coveralls, nitrile gloves etc) against skin contact with the hardener or mixed paint are very important, but it can be used by careful, educated and prepared amatures.

Black Forest · Apr 3, 2012

I had a sandblasting and painting business in Texas. I normally used a positive preasure clean air mask. One time I got lazy and used just a cartridge filter mask. Just because you don't smell anything in your mask does not mean you are protected. I painted all day and suffered from Methyol Isocyanate poisoning. It nearly killed me. I had severe lung problems, vision problems, headaches and severe depression issues. Nearly ten years later and I still have some lingering lung problems that will never get better.

So if you don't want to lug a oxygen bottle around for a long time be very careful and fully informed of the correct equipment. I was one of the lucky ones in that I only got sick and not dead!

thruthefence · Apr 3, 2012

This is indeed one of those "best left to professionals" product.

Regarding the aircraft painting in a t hangar, I also have known people who did that. One of them is a major COPDer at 40. (and a non smoker, at that) I also know people who grind aluminum on a bench grinder, and who dry roller bearings with shop air.

If you insist on proceeding, be sure and use ONLY the reducers & catylizers sold for the specific Imron product you have. There are several formulas, and many use totally different chemicals in the process.

rons · Apr 3, 2012

swellwelder said:
Is it possible to tint white Imron paint? And if so, what kind of tint is used? Also, is there a best type of reducer to use for spray application?

Dale Nelson

Imron T-1021 is a reducer I use with the Industrila Coatings Imron.
For people who don't want to fork out the cash for a breathing system, they should stay away from the stuff
and use the crappy rattle cans for Home Cheapo.

You can even use lacquer thinner if you get desperate. When painting machinery the Industrial Coatings line
is the way to go. Less expensive. If I was going to paint a car I would not use lacquer thinner.

TexasTurnado · Apr 3, 2012

sfriedberg said:
If you don't have a positive pressure air hood (or a self-contained breathing apparatus), I'd think twice and then once more before using Imron and/or Nitram While the current formulations are not as exceedingly toxic as the original, extreme precautions are required when spraying Imron or other two-part polyurethanes. There is NO approved respirator cartridge. Everyone in the exposure area must have a positive pressure clean air feed.

The original formulation required a full-on hazmat suit ("bubble suit") when spraying. The current formulation still requires positive pressure air feed, and definite protection against skin exposure.

Imron is NOT a DIY garage paint.

Do you (or anyone else) know how PPG Essential compares to Imron wrt saftey gear? I have been using it because it is a single stage (glossy as sprayed, no clear coat needed) two-part (three if you count the thinner/reducer, mixed 6:1:1) polyurethane meant for big trucks, etc.

lazlo · Apr 3, 2012

TexasTurnado said:
Do you (or anyone else) know how PPG Essential compares to Imron wrt saftey gear? I have been using it because it is a single stage (glossy as sprayed, no clear coat needed) two-part (three if you count the thinner/reducer, mixed 6:1:1) polyurethane meant for big trucks, etc.

The Isocyanate catalyst is the hazardous element in 2-part epoxies. The 1 part epoxies are not as toxic, or as durable. But still a considerable step-up in durability and chemical resistance from enamel.

As far as the naysayers: why does 3M make a filter cartridge specifically for Isocyanate paints, and why do they have application guides, like I posted?

motion guru · Apr 3, 2012

I painted a truck in 1982..3 time frame with Imron - I used a mask, but I don't think I took any precautions beyond that. I was an invincible teenager . . . and an apparently lucky one at that.

tailstock · Apr 3, 2012

Mack truck use to have a plant in Oakville, Ontario back in the 60's and 70', painted a large number of fleet trucks with Imron until two of their painters died. Figured out it was the paint and had to revamp the whole paint shop and go to robot painters. Imron is not to be messed with, a little here and there seems to have no affect, but unknown to you the damage is being done and after continued use you will have brain and respiratory problems. :codger:

Needless to say it never bothered me much. :willy_nilly:

TexasTurnado · Apr 3, 2012

lazlo said:
The Isocyanate catalyst is the hazardous element in 2-part epoxies. The 1 part epoxies are not as toxic, or as durable. But still a considerable step-up in durability and chemical resistance from enamel.

As far as the naysayers: why does 3M make a filter cartridge specifically for Isocyanate paints, and why do they have application guides, like I posted?

Did you mean one and two part polyurethanes (instead of epoxies)? I have never heard of polyurethanes being called epoxies...

lazlo · Apr 3, 2012

TexasTurnado said:
Did you mean one and two part polyurethanes (instead of epoxies)? I have never heard of polyurethanes being called epoxies...

Sorry John, typo -- I meant two-part polyurethanes.

Awful lot of "lucky" guys here who wore their masks as 3M designed...

MwTech Inc · Apr 3, 2012

If you must use urethanes then the Nason brand (Dupont owned) is a better choice, simply less parts per mix of the iso's.

Still a nasty paint if you suck it in.

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