OT: Refridgerator thermodynamics question

Off Topic. I have an automatic ice maker in my freezer. The ice is kicked out into a compartment in a pullout drawer underneath the machine. When this drawer is pulled out to get something from the freezer, be it ice or something else, often one or two cubes will fall out and hide underneath the drawer unit out of sight. This happens when the compartment fills up all the way which is most of the time with only two people living in the house. This can add up to a gallon, or more, of ice on the floor of the machine before it sublimes or evaporates away. It never builds up so high that it jams anything.
So my question is about the efficiency of removing this extra ice. I sweep it out every few weeks and dump it in the sink. Leaving it in does mean that it takes up space so less cold air spills out every time the drawer is opened. I am not sure if the sublimation causes more cooling to occur or if it takes more energy to sublimate it away.
When I was single I did keep empty bottles in the fridge so less cold air would spill out every time I opened the door.
Bill D.

PS: this extra ice does not affect the cooling since there are no coils in the floor. It has a small evaporator in the ceiling with a fan to circulate the cooled air.

If the freezer is a closed system, energy required to sublimate the ice is recovered when the water vapor condenses on another surface of the freezer. In the real life system, the frost free heaters are consuming energy to move that moisture outside the freezer.

So you have a freezer drawer on the bottom of your fridge, and an ice compartment in the freezer drawer, and the ice drops into the compartment. With two people, the ice mound in the compartment builds up and when you open the freezer drawer for any reason, some of the ice cubes spill over the edge of the compartment into the larger freezer drawer. And every few weeks you remove the gallon or so of cubes. But if you just leave them in the bottom of the freezer drawer they disappear eventually. Your theory is that this is due to sublimation?

First, if this were a game show I'd give you 100 points and the game for using the word "sublimation". Sublimation is the direct phase transition from solid to gas without ever becoming liquid in the process. So...

1) Sublimation is endothermic. That is the ice absorbs water to become vapor. If that vapor is ejected from the freezer into the outside air, sublimation is aiding your freezer. It's free energy removal. Even if that air is ejected into the refrigerator compartment it's not going to freeze again (freezing or desublimation would release heat energy) in the fridge section, and so if we have sublimation of ice, it's helping to cool things. Think of dry ice in a cooler to chill ice cream on a hot day.

In this scenario, removing the cubes means you've removed the cooling effect of the cubes.

2) Is here a drain in the freezer? Is this a frost-free unit? If so, there are heating coils that work to heat the air in the freezer periodically, causing sublimation or (if the temperature is raised sufficiently) melting and draining. In that case, you're putting a lot of heat into the system to get rid of the ice. If that's the case you're using energy to freeze the cubes, and more energy to melt or desublime them.

In this scenario, removing the cubes reduces the heating load of the defrosting unit.

3) I think though, that from an energy standpoint, the loss of the energy used to freeze the cubes probably exceeds any cooling benefit (the freezing process is not completely efficient, but the sublimation cooling process is 100% efficient).

So the big driver should be to avoid the spillage. Different ice compartment? Set the ice level sensor lower?

Next if its a frost-free unit, remove the cubes. If its not, leave em in.

My 2 cents.

Yes this is a frost free unit. I have tried to bend the bail down that rests on top of the ice to sense when the pile is tall enough with no bending since the wire is too hard to bend by hand under there. The real problem is my wife overloads that section and stuff slides onto the ice mountain so the bail can not lift up and shut off.
Bil lD

At least your reefer makes ice. Mine sucks, and I think it's because it tries to make little fancy ice.

I do not really understand how it works. If the bail is down every so often it opens a valve outside the. cool area and water dumps into the mold. Somehow it senses the water flow and shuts off when the mold should be full. I do not know if it is a simple timer that dumps the ice or it somehow knows when it has frozen solid. There is no float gauge. It is easy to pull the bail out of the rotary switch when the drawer is pulled open if there is anything above the ice. If that bail is pulled out it is not obvious and the switch never shuts down the ice maker process.
Bil lD

No idea either. This topic is timely because I'm shopping for a new one for home because I hate the ice maker I currently have. It makes hollow ice. How the hell does that happen?

I'm also moving away from water/ice in the door, that's some BS convenience feature that I don't need.

Imleaning toward this, but I've not committed yet. https://www.bestbuy.com/site/lg-26-...proof-stainless-steel/6395326.p?skuId=6395326

Sorry for the derail...

Cole2534 said:

No idea either. This topic is timely because I'm shopping for a new one for home because I hate the ice maker I currently have. It makes hollow ice. How the hell does that happen?

I'm also moving away from water/ice in the door, that's some BS convenience feature that I don't need.

Imleaning toward this, but I've not committed yet. https://www.bestbuy.com/site/lg-26-...proof-stainless-steel/6395326.p?skuId=6395326

Sorry for the derail...

Click to expand...

Our friend has an lg like that she likes it. I like the water faucet inside. Make sure the filter is easy to change from the front. I have to change mine every 4-5 months. Most makes you can bypass the filter if you have whole house filtration. I supplied mine from the hot water line so solids would drop out in the water heater. My sister's old fridge the filter was in the back so you have to pull the whole machine out to change the filter.
I installed a blowout valve on the water line at the wall. If the hose breaks the extra flow will shut off the water. Same idea as for washing machines but smaller flow rates. It is a pain when changing filters until you figure it out. Now after installing a filter I push the water button a few seconds(1-2) at a time with a 5 second pause between pushes. Keep doing this until you have clear water with almost no bubbles. If you push and hold button the rapid air flow will lock the blowout valve. You then have to turn off water to fridge or the house to rest it. Once the water has no air the blowout valve is not noticeable.
I used a 6' supply hose and held the loop up with a bungee cord.
Bill D.

Bill D said:

Our friend has an lg like that she likes it. I like the water faucet inside. Make sure the filter is easy to change from the front. I have to change mine every 4-5 months. Most makes you can bypass the filter if you have whole house filtration. {b]I supplied mine from the hot water line so solids would drop out in the water heater. [/b] My sister's old fridge the filter was in the back so you have to pull the whole machine out to change the filter.
Bill D.

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Excellent plan. It'll draw so little volume that it's unlikely any actual hot water will enter the reefer box. Mine isn't arranged that way now, but it certainly will be in the future.

Bill D said:

I supplied mine from the hot water line so solids would drop out in the water heater.

Click to expand...

I would not use hot water if its a house that still has lead soldered pipes.

We (my wife and I) got a new refrigerator a year or two ago, and it came with an icemaker. We simply didn't use the ice fast enough, and the bin would overfill and jam things up. We eventually disconnected the water feed and turned the icemaker off, reclaiming the ice bin for more cold storage space.

Cole2534 said:

Excellent plan. It'll draw so little volume that it's unlikely any actual hot water will enter the reefer box. Mine isn't arranged that way now, but it certainly will be in the future.

Click to expand...

I plumbed it with about 20 feet of un insulated 5/8 pex that dead ends at the fridge outlet. I figure the volume inside the pex is more then the draw for 30 seconds or so it takes to fill an ice cube tray or a glass.
Bill D

I would offer to pay the little guy who resides inside the refrigerator and turns the light on and off when the door is opened and closed a bit more if he would also take care of that ice sensing arm. Perhaps you could even get away with just a sweet treat left for him every day or two.

Bill D said:

I supplied mine from the hot water line so solids would drop out in the water heater. /

Click to expand...

Get a separate ice maker, one that makes crystal clear ice:
How Do They Do It? KOLD-DRAFT(R) Commercial Ice Machines Turn Ice-Making – kold-draft

You can always start selling it in bags to your neighbors.....

I would think you need to direct some questions about the flawed design toward the people that built the unit. Other than that, use more ice in your Manhattans, problem solved.

So I can tell my wife, with a straight face, that not cleaning up the spilled ice is doing my part to save the planet by conserving energy? I am not neglecting this to be lazy but only to be helpful. Sounds good to me.
Bill