OT: Shipping costs for large boxes

WizardOfBoz · Apr 28, 2020

With 20+ years in the house, and because during all of them we said "Put that unused _______ in the basement", we finally started to clean the basement. One day each of the last two weekends, 7-9 hours each day, and the job is still a couple of weekends away from finishing. On the plus side, its forcing us to get rid of a lot of c**p.

We had our AC redone last year, and the big (26x20x5) MERV 13 filters we had don't fit our new setup. They're expensive, so I was going to ebay them. But in checking shipping for a 28 x 21 x 11 box they came in the best I could find was 75 bucks! Holy cow! I expected 15-25 bucks. 75$ is not really cost effective for 50 bucks (2 of 'em) of filters. This issue has been resolved in the near term: we're making our homemade masks nearly n95 (not really but certainly better than just cloth) using MERV 13 filter material.

But the question remains: has the price of shipping large stuff gone up? Because of fewer commercial flights due to SARS-Cov19?

I have to ship a desktop computer to my son and I think I'm gonna take a hit doing that.

Thx.

GregSY · Apr 28, 2020

Excellent topic.

What's happened is the shipping companies have shifted their 'business model' to where if you are a big account, they will ship practically anything for dirt cheap. But, if you are the Average Joe, they screw you to the wall.

It's become more or less impractical to ship anything to anyone....I stopped bothering to sell stuff on Ebay* or anywhere else because the shipping has gotten out of hand. I guess it's the high gas prices.....

*Oddly, Ebay 'helps' in that if you opt to use their shipping, you get a break under their discount. I've found it's about 30% for bigger boxes. But I resent having to use them, and it's still expensive.

Mebfab · Apr 28, 2020

Ups has decided to reward the stockholders and is gouging on shipping.

indianamoon · Apr 28, 2020

The other thing that I believe they have done is to charge more by size than weight. Shipping a lampshade is prohibitive these days.

Rob F. · Apr 28, 2020

I just shipped a 500 lbs crate from colorado to calif and a 400 lbs crate the other way on YRC Freight. $124 for each way. Crates were about 3' sq and 18" tall. This was from YRC hub to YRC hub, not door to door delivery and pick up though. Overall it was really easy and painless. 1 week ship time with tracking.
Sounds like trucking will be getting some business back from UPS, fedex etc...

Another option if you can get weight up to 1000-1200 lbs is a fedex freightbox, this is a flat rate pallet size box. To be cost effective you want to be close to max weight. There is a thread on it here I started.

Guest · Apr 28, 2020

Since I changed my business model after the recession of 2008, now 95%+ of what I ship is in USPS flat rate boxes.
Pre 2010 I used 75% Fedex 25% UPS. I don't think I was getting much of a discount. I did remember off the top of my head approximate rates per pound by distance traveled. Around 2-3 years ago I parted out some machines on E-bay and ended up shipping quite a few things UPS. I was downright floored as the rates I had remembered from 10 years back were now 100% to 150% more. As said a couple posts above it seems they provide the big boys with deep discounts on the back of the little man. I am equally floored when I see how little McMaster Carr charges me for UPS.

WizardOfBoz · Apr 28, 2020

GregSY said:
What's happened is the shipping companies have shifted their 'business model' to where if you are a big account, they will ship practically anything for dirt cheap. But, if you are the Average Joe, they screw you to the wall.

But the USPS also had very high rates. So not sure what's going on.

But back to your premise. Higher shipping for the consumer or small businesses is really disastrous for a free economy. Think of it: you buy a lampshade (to use an example here) for 40 bucks, and the seller ships it to you for 15 bucks. SWMBO doesn't like it. To return it costs 50 bucks! This would 1) keep me from buying lampshades in the first place, and 2) would hurt my efficiency as a household in the second. Of course, I'm not talking about lampshades. I'm talking about not buying anything because you get screwed if you want to return it. This is a drag on the economy. And if I do buy something and can't return it I have to pass the cost onto the customer. Another drag on the economy.

Whether shipping is cheap or expensive is a REAL game changer. I could see this paring off or adding a couple of percent to the economy.

I'm pretty sure that Donald Trump is trying to boost his perceived friends at FedEx and UPS with his attempts to force the USPS to boost shipping. Maybe he just hates the USPS. But if the USPS prices rise, so will the other guys' prices. I wonder of his Donaldness has considered this. A drag on the economy - any drag - will cost him votes.

Note that I'm not saying whether I view fewer Trump votes a bad or a good thing. I'm just saying high shipping prices are bad for pretty much everyone in the general public and most businesses.

GregSY · Apr 28, 2020

Trump has nothing to do with shipping rates. It's really an issue of (as others said) the big guys getting their breaks and the little guys getting screwed.

USPS is no saint...they know full well what the other shippers charge and they can all adjust accordingly. For what it's worth, USPS (I believe) loses money whilst UPS and FedEx makes lot of profits.

What is comes down to is...if you want to send anything larger than shoebox, forget it.

Rob F. · Apr 28, 2020

With all the small local stores being slowly driven out of business and now in lock down for who knows how much longer it is forcing people to do online buying from larger stores.
A couple weeks ago I had to order socks on line because local places were either lockdown or already out of business. Had 3 pairs when lockdown hit, just hadnt got to the stores yet.
Large companies (target, amazon....) will get the good shipping prices for a short while until us little guys wise up and stop having thing shipped, then most of their income will be from those large companies and the prices will surly climb.

steve45 · Apr 28, 2020

bosleyjr said:
I'm pretty sure that Donald Trump is trying to boost his perceived friends at FedEx and UPS with his attempts to force the USPS to boost shipping. Maybe he just hates the USPS. But if the USPS prices rise, so will the other guys' prices. I wonder of his Donaldness has considered this. A drag on the economy - any drag - will cost him votes.

What a STUPID comment!

The little shippers are merely subsidizing the big ones. Amazon, and others, ship free because WE pay for it elsewhere. Just like a hospital charges $6 for an aspirin to cover indigent care.

I bought a case of snacks on Amazon a couple of years ago for about $20. They sent the wrong flavor and I returned them. They told me to pay the shipping charges, send them a copy of the receipt, and they would reimburse me. $44 to ship a $20 case of chips! And, yes, Amazon gave me credit for it. Oh, yea, this was under Obama.

gustafson · Apr 28, 2020

GregSY said:
Trump has nothing to do with shipping rates. It's really an issue of (as others said) the big guys getting their breaks and the little guys getting screwed.

USPS is no saint...they know full well what the other shippers charge and they can all adjust accordingly. For what it's worth, USPS (I believe) loses money whilst UPS and FedEx makes lot of profits.

What is comes down to is...if you want to send anything larger than shoebox, forget it.

Oh come on, do stay current

trumpski just yesterday[?] threatened to not help USPS unless he got control of rates
USPS does not lose money on operations, they are "overpaying" their pension obligations which drives them underwater

IIRC they can set package the littlethe littlethe littlerates however they want

On Topic: 90 inches LWH is the really bad number always has been
There have been no Covid changes AFAIK
20 pound drop in weight overcharges started Dec/Jan

gustafson · Apr 28, 2020

bosleyjr said:
we're making our homemade masks nearly n95 (not really but certainly better than just cloth) using MERV 13 filter material.

Well there is your answer, profit selling your homemade masks and put em in a flat rate box

dalmatiangirl61 · Apr 28, 2020

Dualkit said:
Since I changed my business model after the recession of 2008, now 95%+ of what I ship is in USPS flat rate boxes.
Pre 2010 I used 75% Fedex 25% UPS. I don't think I was getting much of a discount. I did remember off the top of my head approximate rates per pound by distance traveled. Around 2-3 years ago I parted out some machines on E-bay and ended up shipping quite a few things UPS. I was downright floored as the rates I had remembered from 10 years back were now 100% to 150% more. As said a couple posts above it seems they provide the big boys with deep discounts on the back of the little man. I am equally floored when I see how little McMaster Carr charges me for UPS.

Yep, I had to change my business model to smalls too, shipping larger items simply was no longer working, customers will only pay so much. Only way to move the big/heavy stuff was to sell so cheap that customers would pay the shipping.

GregSY · Apr 28, 2020

"The little shippers are merely subsidizing the big ones. Amazon, and others, ship free because WE pay for it elsewhere. Just like a hospital charges $6 for an aspirin to cover indigent care."

Lol. Exactly. Recently had a kid w/ broken arm....made me livid to see families obviously with no insurance getting the EXACT same treatment as me, who ended up $4500 poorer even after insurance.

No insurance = free
Insurance = $4500

My friend, who is in Accounting at the hospital, tells me OVER 53% of their annual budget is for 'indigent care'. That's another term for 'freeloaders'.

bhigdog · Apr 28, 2020

hat's happened is the shipping companies have shifted their 'business model' to where if you are a big account, they will ship practically anything for dirt cheap. But, if you are the Average Joe, they screw you to the wall.

i ORDERED 4 COVERALLS from Aramark shipped from Reno, NV. They were too big so I returned them for an exchange. It cost Aramark $5.99 shipping via UPS. It cost me $43.27 to return them. Lesson learned..........Bob

Larry Dickman · Apr 28, 2020

bhigdog said:
hat's happened is the shipping companies have shifted their 'business model' to where if you are a big account, they will ship practically anything for dirt cheap. But, if you are the Average Joe, they screw you to the wall.

i ORDERED 4 COVERALLS from Aramark shipped from Reno, NV. They were too big so I returned them for an exchange. It cost Aramark $5.99 shipping via UPS. It cost me $43.27 to return them. Lesson learned..........Bob

should have spent the 43 bucks on donuts. They might fit now.

Fish On · Apr 28, 2020

gustafson said:
There have been no Covid changes AFAIK

Yes there have - everything is now being delivered late.

Mebfab · Apr 28, 2020

Wait, little guys subsidize the big corporations? Sounds like socialism.

EPAIII · Apr 28, 2020

It is not so much a shift as just plain competition. I was employed by a small to mid sized company in "Smallville" Iowa. Not a company you would have ever heard of unless you were in the business. But they did a lot of shipping, mostly small boxes. Their shipping could have easily fit into the USPS flat rate system. What I observed was that all the big shipping companies; UPS, FedEx, etc., and yes, even the USPS were competing for their business. Their reps would visit and offer a better deal than the other guys. One month we were using UPS and the next FedEx. On and on it went.

So even for a company that was not a "big guy" but who did have a lot of shipping, they got ever decreasing rates. While I worked there I could use their shipping and get the low rates. And they were lower than anything I could ever get on my own.

The shipping companies' were not changing their business model in any way except to aggressively go after the available business, even in that small town. How could they do this? Well, if they picked up a (ONE) package at my home, that had a cost in the time for the man and truck. But if they picked up a hundred boxes at one location AND all of those packages were ready for the driver to just scan, then that took less time than two packages from individual shippers. Even if you take the package to their "store", it still takes the clerk there time to accept it. And that time as well as the truck or store costs them money.

In a way this is no different than other areas of commerce. I have paid prices between $0.02 and $0.25 for resistors I needed for electronic projects. I have paid a similar range of prices for nuts and bolts. Many other items. The reason for those differences? Quantity. If you buy one or two of an item, the costs of selling it are the same as if you buy 1000 of them in a single transaction. And those sales costs need to be paid as well as the intrinsic cost of the item. So if I buy resistors by one or two, they are quite expensive. And if I buy 100 or 200 of them the price per item goes way down. Those same resistors become even cheaper (a small fraction of a cent each) if you buy tens of thousands of them in an order. And if you place multiple such orders each month, then the price goes down even more.

It is just simple economics along with competition.

Bill D · Apr 28, 2020

gustafson said:
Oh come on, do stay current

USPS does not lose money on operations, they are "overpaying" their pension obligations which drives them underwater.

Congress, in 2006, forced the USPS to prepay all their pension obligations for the next 75 years within ten years. Same as if you hire a new guy and fully fund his retirement plan in ten years. This money was to be saved and sued to fund retirement for the next 75 years. Congress of course took the money to spend on pet projects and issued IOU's without interest. i assume all of us started work at age 18 and retired with all the money we saved at age 28 just like congress expects the postal service to do.
For some reason I can not find the names of the congress members who pushed this bill into law. I assume ups fedex etal have them in their pockets. Why do they not volunteer their districts to drop USPS services including free mail for congress members.
Bil lD

House Votes to End Controversial USPS Payments for Future Retirees' Health Care - Government Executive

OT: Shipping costs for large boxes

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