Round or Morse socket adapter for drills?
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  1. #1
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    Question Round or Morse socket adapter for drills?

    Good morning all. I'm looking to use some Allied Machine & Engineering T-A spade drills on my turret lathe. The drill bodies I need come with 1" round, #3 Morse, or #4 Morse shanks. The turret takes 1-1/2" OD shanks and has a clamping mechanism but no set screws to hold the tool shank. I'm leaning toward using a solid Morse socket but can be persuaded to use a split bushing. Thoughts? Also, should I get a hard or a soft socket?

    Thanks,
    M

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    round shank you usually can adjust length if needed. morse taper on tool tip failure the tool can get pushed in taper with tons of force and be "difficult" to remove
    .
    i have had a few morse tapers be stubborn before and absolutely refuse to come out. if tons pushed it in taper it aint coming out that easy

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    Back in the day (like about 45 years ago) and on the other side of the Atlantic, a young and very green Sami used to run (mainly?) Ward turret lathes (there were 1 or 2 Herberts) up to 15HP & more torque than was good for any human being, ……………..tooled with (often ?) straight shanked big drills, reamers and die boxes etc etc etc, …………...often on tough / hard / ornery metals, held in shop made (as in soft) split bushes - firmly gripped by the cotter style clamping bolts in the hex turrets.


    Hard or Soft? ………..my old mentors (and hence my) preference was for soft sleeves and bushes, that way if you get a ''spinner'' (shit happens!) the chances are the bush will be KO'd and not the more expensive tool shank.

    Like Tom I've had MT's ''stick for good''


    A Tip ;- If you're going to run spade drills, make sure your coolant pump has enough mumbo, IME ;- at anything much over 1 x dia deep, poor chip flushing kills off more spade drills than anything else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DMF_TomB View Post
    round shank you usually can adjust length if needed. morse taper on tool tip failure the tool can get pushed in taper with tons of force and be "difficult" to remove
    .
    i have had a few morse tapers be stubborn before and absolutely refuse to come out. if tons pushed it in taper it aint coming out that easy
    Why the hell is everything catastrophic for you? You got a bunch of monkeys working there or what??

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    if you dont tap many holes you dont break many taps.
    .
    if you drill easily over 100,000 holes then you see a few sudden tool failures. obviously bigger machines with more power can push a tool more into morse taper.
    .
    many a big cnc can easily move a 10 ton part in a fixture. what do you think happens to tool that got pushed with 10 tons of pressure. tends to not be easy to get apart
    .
    and if not pecking just a straight G81 in a deep hole many a drill not making much more than normal noise has a sudden tool failure. even if 1 out of 1000 holes you have problems you tend not to forget especially if you spend many hours and even days recovering from the tool failure

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    Quote Originally Posted by mountie View Post
    Good morning all. I'm looking to use some Allied Machine & Engineering T-A spade drills on my turret lathe. The drill bodies I need come with 1" round, #3 Morse, or #4 Morse shanks. The turret takes 1-1/2" OD shanks and has a clamping mechanism but no set screws to hold the tool shank. I'm leaning toward using a solid Morse socket but can be persuaded to use a split bushing. Thoughts? Also, should I get a hard or a soft socket?

    Thanks,
    M
    Morse is for rotating spindles in hor bores and drillpresses that have for ages provided no better option. Serious ones - HB near-as-dammit always, drill press as well if they are functioning adults, use locking keys as well as the taper.

    Where the shank is NOT rotating, be glad you can hold straight shanks instead.

    Very glad.

    PS: W/r "push back" on straight shanks, bushed or otherwise?

    Just bottom the arse-end .. or use a spacer slug .. at set up if skeered spitless of that.

    Can't push back .. and still won't "wedge" as Morse can do.
    Last edited by thermite; 07-20-2019 at 01:19 PM.

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    basically got to think "what if"
    .
    1) what is drill tip failure and machine keeps feeding what happens. morse taper gets pushed into taper and can be extremely difficult to remove. obviously drill can break too.
    .
    2) set screw weldon shank flat drill in theory shouldnt move far is if flat bigger than setscrew .030" than thats all drill movement you have. of course what if drill push overloads a single set screw. often having to use a press to push drill out of tool holder is common as well as grinding or removing set screw. typically more problems on failure with tool holder rather than part problems from tool failure. hollow set screws are used to make it easier to grind set screw but it can still take 1/2 hour or longer to grind out set screw
    .
    3) drill has a long flat for 2 set screws. can adjust length for more which is good or bad. obviously if while drilling the drill gets pushed into holder 1" that can cause problems for next tool like a tap or reamer if its not a through hole
    .
    so record all problems last 10,000 parts or more and see what causes the most problems. if broke drill 10" deep into a part that can be time consuming to get out or remake part. if you have to work on problem tool holders that is time consuming but maybe can do while a cnc is running. obviously if hydraulic press and needed repair tools are not nearby and you have to shut down cnc while you go do repairs you are loosing machining time. assuming nobody nearby can watch your cnc while you are away doing repairs. some shops operators just put broken stuff in a big tray and it gets sent out for others to repair. that can make it difficult for operator to tell cost of repairs. that is if operator didnt loose time but tool repair was charged $1000. especially if brand new tool holder replacement is cheaper than $1000. its easy for costs to go unnoticed. obviously if trying to save 1 hour of machining time per year and its costing 2 hours in labor repairs or a extra $1000. in repair costs per year than you are spending more trying to save a hour. like crashing a car cause you dont want to slow down turning a corner. didnt really save time on the car trip with the car crashing by not slowing when needed while driving

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