Sharp LMV mill or First or a real Bridgeport maybe????

Just wanted to start a new thread about this.

I'm shopping for a vertical mill of good quality with a 9x42 table. Likely a Bridgeport Copy type of mill.
A new Bridgeport is probably a bit too expensive but then again, are they still all made completely in the USA? I never used a real Bridgeport so I don't know how their quality, accuracy and smoothness compares to the copies and if it justifies the extra price.

I see that Sharp has the LMV model, from the description it looks like a nice quality machine with a few interesting features. The First mill looks to be very nearly the same so I thought that perhaps they were making the Sharp mills since they do make some of their cnc's, but I was told that the Sharp LMV is made in China and not Taiwan... I'm not too sure that I believe that as Sharp usually has nice quality machines. Do any of you have any information on this? I do plan to ask Sharp about it but if any of you have this machine and read the label on it, please let me know what it says.

This is the First machine. http://www.first.com.tw/produc-lc.htm

I see theres a newer manufaturer in Taiwan called Argo. They also make a mill that looks the exact same to me. http://www.argo.com.tw/e-pro1-1.htm#

I'm not sure what the real differences may be as to quality... so hard to tell all those different manufacturers apart. Gets pretty confusing and I simply want to get the best I can for my $$$, of course anything would be better then the mill I have now...

So, what can you guys tell me about any of the mills that fit this category from your experience with them?

thanks

well well well answering my own thread.... turns out the price for a brand new Bridgeport Series 1 Standard is not quite as much as I expected(but close). I think this won't be such a hard decision after all, waiting to know what deposit they need

Question, chromed ways are a good thing to get right????? as they also have the basic model that isn't chromed.

If you don't really need a 42" table...
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11. Excellent J head with 36” table, chrome ways with, if not all, close to all the frosting. Very nice machine, $3500. Options: New Servo USA x table feed, $550.00
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www.plazamachinery.com

Joe has allways been fair with me.

We purchased a Sharp knee mill 10 years ago and have not had any problems with it at all.Very happy with it.Wasn't Bridgeport bought out ? Quality went bad and then Bridgeport came about again ? Thought I remember hearing or reading that.

gottabench:

Hardinge bought Bridgeport a few years ago and moved the tooling and some of the specialized production machinery to their factory in New York, where they now manifacture the mills.

alg4884

They're supposed to be all made in Elmira NY.

I've had a Taiwan built Sharp LMV for about twenty years in an R&D shop. It's been absolutely trouble free and accurate. The only things replaced during that time are the rubber sheet way cover and the rubber button cover on the Servo feed. It came stock with features optional on the B'port such as chrome ways. Very happy with the machine.

Look at the Lagun products they are much stiffer and more durable than the Bridgeports.

CD.

I've got a Sharp LMV-50 that I bought new about three years ago.

It's a dandy machine, about 250 lbs heavier than my Series I Bridgeport, and very well made. The head is quieter, it came with Chrome Ways, One Shot Lube System, and a 3 hp spindle motor.

Since I bought it, I've installed a Newall C80 DRO, switched out the rubber way scrapers for Bridgeport OEM covers and Felt Wipers, and replaced the Z column way cover it came with (which was damaged in transit). Other than that, it's needed no attention aside from the application of various lubricants.

I am very happy with the machine. It may have been made in Taiwan, but it is every bit as well put together as my old Bridgeport is, and it cost one third of what a similarly equipped new Bridgeport would have.

Charles Dolan said:

Look at the Lagun products they are much stiffer and more durable than the Bridgeports.

CD.

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Indeed. If I was going to spend big ticket money, I think I'd lean toward a Lagun as well. They were out of my range, being nearly the same price as a new Bridgeport, but they do look like damned fine machines. Significantly heavier than a Bridgeport Series I, and they look loads stiffer as well (though looks can be deceiving).

Ryan Shanks
Logic Paintball

Sharp LMVs are very nice machines. A guy on CNCZone did a CNC conversion on his a few years ago.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18284

For the $15k or whatever price for a Bridgeport, I'd rather go for a large Taiwanese bed mill. Or save up a bit more for a Haas TM-1.

As far as I know Lagun is just another importer of Taiwan and/or China machines, similar to Birmingham and all the likes. Whats not durable about the new bridgeports that would be more durable on a chinese machine? what about the tolerances they're manufactured to?

Is the Bridgeport Series 1 a bit like the Hardinge HLV-H where they simply never made much changes or updates ? I do have a brand new Taiwan HLV-H copy that I like quite a bit, except for its slight threading stop problem... at least they did make a few changes like going with VFD's and such.

Any of you who have used or own the newer Bridgeports that can say if its worth the extra cash or not????
From reading the info on the website I get the feeling it is, plus they hold their value better, nicer paint for sure, plus maybe more likely to find parts in another 20 years?

All the Taiwan mills I've seen and used even if just 2-3 years old were in a bit of a rough shape already and lots of switch troubles, belts, brakes... I guess some of it is proper maintenance and thats fine, but likely easier to find parts to fix a bridgeport if ever needed.

I'll give myself another day or 2 to make up my mind. This is likely the only manual mill I'll buy and I don't want it to be a mistake.

I still have to decide what to do regarding power feeds, that does add quite a bit of cost to the machine. 3-axis dro also and likely have to update my 3phase from a rotary to a Phase perfect.

SND said:

As far as I know Lagun is just another importer of Taiwan and/or China machines, similar to Birmingham and all the likes. Whats not durable about the new bridgeports that would be more durable on a chinese machine?

Any of you who have used newer Bridgeports that can say if its worth the extra cash or not????
From reading the info on the website I get the feeling it is, plus they hold their value better, nicer paint for sure, plus maybe more likely to find parts in another 20 years?

All the Taiwan mills I've seen and used even if just 2-3 years old were in a bit of a rough shape already and lots of switch troubles, belts, brakes... I guess some of it is proper maintenance and thats fine, but likely easier to find parts to fix a bridgeport if ever needed.

I'll give myself another day or 2 to make up my mind.

I still have to decide what to do regarding power feeds, that does add quite a bit of cost to the machine. 3-axis dro also and likely have to update my 3phase from a rotary to a Phase perfect.

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Well, then you know wrong. If you go read their website, you would find that they import their machine castings from Spain and do most sourcing, final assembly, and QC here in the states. They are not a re-badged Birmingham. WTH did you hear that from anyway? If Birmingham was selling Lagun quality machines, at the price they ask, there wouldn't be anyone else left in that market.

Lagun and Sharp have both been around for decades, and don't appear to be going anywhere soon. Both companies have warranty centers throughout the US stocked with parts, should you ever need them, the same as Bridgeport. That's a non-issue.

Bridgeport has the name, but that don't mean they're the only ones who know how to build a nice turret mill. In fact, some would argue they don't even make the best turret mill.

Also, don't overlook Wells Index, they're made in the USA. http://www.wellsindex.com/

Here's Lagun's website too: http://www.lagun.com/

Longevity of any machine is largely a function of maintenance and how it is used. You can clap out a brand new Bridgeport in five years too, if you beat on and don't maintain it.

I've only had my Sharp for about three years now, but it still looks, runs, and cuts just like new. If you're still around in ten years, I'll let you know how it's going then.

Can't imagine why you'd want a Phase Perfect to run a simple three phase motor. I've had many mills over the past 40+ years running off a simple RPC.

If a used machine is an option, I have a reconditioned series 1 Bridgeport 2HP 42" resurfaced table, top of knee rescraped,Bijur oil system, table power feed,new way wipers. .007 backlash in crossfeed nut and screw..... .009 backlash in table feed screw
$3500.00 508 892-4856 painted with PPG brand two part polyurethene
John Fahnestock
J&L Scraping Service Inc
www.j-lscraping.com

CoolHand. Notice I said, "similar to" I did NOT say re-badged Birmingham. There is a difference, as there are MANY manufacturers of mills and mill components in taiwan and china(and possibly other places) that all look extremely similar and likely share quite a few of the same parts, have it be castings, handles, whatever. I do see that on Lagun's website it says they have operations in Spain and started there. It does not say that all their castings for all their machines come from there and it does not say much about the whole operation really. I actually only deducted that their cnc castings are from there and some of their earlier machines manual machines. Lots can happen between 1978 and 2008. Now if it does turn out that their vertical mills are indeed from Spain and with better quality components than Taiwan/china machines and that the price is justified then great maybe I can get one, and I am trying to get more info on that right now. But I do know for fact that many of the lathes on their website are from Taiwan and that is why I got the deduction that they likely have other machines that are from similar places. Not that their anything wrong with it mostly if they offer a good service like Sharp does... so I'll just wait to find out more on those Lagun mills actual origins and such.... Would be much easier if all manufacturers or resellers were a bit more upfront on what they sell(although that would change everything...), and if they do have their own special castings that nobody else in the world has, they should cast their name into it like Bridgeport does. It would add a little credibility.


As to changing to Phase Perfect, theres a few reasons although I may just swap the rotary motor first to see how that does for noise levels. Problem is I should have gone with a PP right from the start last summer when I got my toolroom lathe. All part of the learning experience I guess.

FWIW I have seen the BP series I being made in Elmira NY with my own eyes.
Pretty cool seeing a machine that you use to make stuff being machined before your eyes.

SND said:

This is the First machine. http://www.first.com.tw/produc-lc.htm

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We have an older one of those at work. It's not a bad machine. It's been neglected and abused but it is still accurate and works well. A lot of small issues with handles breaking off or stripping their bolt holes. The handles are cheaply cast so I can't really fault it for that. If you can get it cheap with a DRO and power feed I'd buy it.

Do any of you know some Sharp of First resellers in Canada, say Ontario or Quebec? I contacted the one closest to me but I wouldn't mind getting a few different quotes before I make a final decision. I might see the hardinge rep next week so I'll give myself more time to get this all figured out.

All info on any of these machines is very welcome still. Although it is a little odd that there isn't more push for going with the real Bridgeport than this. Kinda figured that since its still made in the US you guys would be pushing harder for it. Now it just sounds like USA or Taiwan may not make much if any difference after all ??? humm

Whichever one I go with, I need this to be a good, accurate and long lasting machine with very few troubles. Although I take care of my equipment(oiling, maintenance and such), I also do run it so that it makes money.

For what it worth my 1986 Lagun FT-1S says "Made in Spain". And it's as nice or nicer than any Bridgeport I've used. I would highly recommend one of it's vintage. I can't speak from experience about what they are making now, but I would imagine it's still pretty damn nice if they can sell them for what they are asking.

If you read the Bridgeport and Hardinge Mills forum over at CNC Zone:

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=157

You will get the distinct impression that when Hardinge took over Bridgeport, they left a LOT of people, mostly CNC owners, hanging for support. There are some people over there who used to work for Bridgeport, who now make their living as independent repairmen. I don't know how this has affected the manual mill design / sales / service, and perhaps no one here really does. No one wants to steer you wrong based on yesterday's reputation.

Dennis