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Slotting .oo6 in steel 1018

blgmachine

Cast Iron
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
Location
Wisconsin
Does anyone have any experience in slotting steel with very then slotting saws.
Would like to compare notes.

Depth of cuts
cutting RPM and feed speed

.006 cutter 3" diameter
depth .040

Thanks Gus
 
We’ve used Robbjack saws in 1” diameter down to .008” thick in C110 copper.

Hollow ground helped but the saws were very particular and sudden tool failures were common and expensive at $80ea several years ago.

I’m not sure if Maritool still makes their slitting saw arbors but an interval tool would definitely be my recommendation.
 
used them down to .004 the main trick its to make your own arbor leaving the blade to stick out past the arbor just enough for clearance.
store bought arbors of steel and dont hold the blade to a good dia. ground steel tends to slip on small thin blades.
we make ours out of alum then hit it with sand paper to rough up the faces.
you can taper the flanges so it fits your application. if the flanges on the arbor are too small the saw will walk like crazy. in a cnc climb cutting works best, on a hand mill with hand feed conventional milling.unless you have a very tight mill.
the more your blade stick out for the arbor flanges the less speed and feed your going to be able to achieve. lots and lots of coolant or oil.

the 14-15 dollar high speed ones work great in stainless as well as everything else thats below in hardness. we used them in Monel they work but you have to use a ton of lubrication. only time we eve break them is if we take too deep of a cut, too fast of a feed with too small a flange.

if you want to wast your time take a diamond file and back cut the non cutting part of the blade teeth( but with 80-120 teeth it takes time). the only reason to do this though is if you have a very deep slot like .100 depth.
now saying that I have pros and cons about back cutting the blades. gummy materials it tends to catch the chips and rub the sides giving it a bad finish.

The better you indicate the blade in both runout and flatness they better you can hold size and not have any issues.
 
Unless you really need a 3" diameter, you'd be better off with a smaller OD. Much cheaper saw blades, and from a practical standpoint, less blade "in the cut" - cord span is shorter with reduced diameter, so less rubbing.

I'd shoot for a tooth pitch of .05" to .08", and as already mentioned, make an arbor with integral flange that's as large an OD as possible to maintain flatness. I would suggest steel for the arbor to improve stiffness. With proper design of arbor/flange/clamping washer (the washer must mirror the flange geometry, and both should be relieved from about .15" inward) and a decent screw size, you'll have all the torque transfer you'll need.

For speeds and feeds, get the vendor's suggestions to start, then use ~80% of those values until you're comfortable with your setup. Then you can try pushing them if needed. Chip flushing is critical, do all you can to get lubrication and cooling into the cut.
 
As already mentioned, clamp the saw between two flanges with just a little over the depth of the cut exposed. The flanges must be accurately done to keep the blade running true. Any sideways movement can contribute to failure. For shallow,narrow cuts I am using small saws; 1" or less in special arbours. A good source of slitting saws for narrow/shallow cuts are underacting saws for slotting risers of commutators. Those are available in 0.25" to 1.5" OD in may thicknesses and cost $3-$5 each (in HSS, available in carbide as well). Sometimes I surface grind them to get the thickness I need. A small saw blade like this is very rigid.
 
Thanks for replies
I think i will try smaller diameter cutters.I have been paying $32 each for 3" and have been going thru more than usual.
I leave .005 on each side for clearance and use cold air gun.
I indicate top plate with no run out.
How deep are you guys cutting per pass and at what RPMIMG_20190418_180730989.jpg
 
I think I'd try two passes, maybe .022, then .040 depth (first pass deeper to balance total rubbing per pass), but ditch the CAG or add misting to it with a lubricious coolant - you need lubrication AND cooling here if using HHS on steel. I'd much rather have proper flood cooling, but if you don't have that available you really must use a mister.

For speed try 100sfm for steel to start, .0002/tooth. Just a WAG, talk to your vendor for better recommendations.
 
I do quite a bit of slitting in 1018 steel, but never with that thin a saw.

I use a range of saws and keyseat cutters depending on the part.

For something like this I would walk away from using a slitting saw, as the arbor/shank and saw are separate pieces, just introduces unnecessary error. I try whenever possible to use a saw(If I can get away with it) with an integral shank, like a narrow width keyseat cutter.

In this case, I would have started with an off the shelf keyseat cutter with the smallest diameter possible. Being that i'm not aware of one .006" thick off the shelf, I would just ground it thinner far enough into the saw to make the cut.

With HSS in 1018, I usually start with 200sfm and a .0005" chipload, and see what it can handle. Being that i've never slit with a saw that thin, you might want to dial that back to start. We slit down to .060" thick saw regularly, but a much deeper cuts.

Thin Slitting saws are much more sensitive to cutting conditions then say endmills. A couple important factors are chip evacuation, flood coolant(I wouldn't mist a HSS saw in steel), saw rigidity(Smallest diameter possible), part needs to be rigid, saws don't perform well with vibration. etc.

IMO, when it comes to slitting saws and such, using the smallest diameter saw is my starting point. Using a 3" saw to cut .040" depth seems like the first thing I would change.
 
To everyone commenting in this thread, where do you all buy your thin saws?

Thanks for any replies.

Back in the day when we had a real tooling place here in the Valley it was dieugenio, I still have a ton of them.
now I get them at mc mastercarr they go down to .004 thick.

when I bought my citizen it came with a ton of saw blades both in carbide and hss
the label on the box says
Fullerton tool co.
121 perry st.
saginam Michigan 48602
made in the U.S.A.

no phone number
 
Maritool does currently make slitting saw arbors. Whether you buy or make, make sure you have spare end-pieces; they can get damaged when a saw breaks, at which point they'll hold the next saw less accurately and may apply point stresses, both of which will increase the chance of breaking the saw.
 
I will check with my vendor if they can make .006 thick 3" od in solid carbide.

Hi Frank,
Save your efforts, that would be an "insta-break" blade. How about in the 1" to 1.5" range, that's more likely to work (and not be crazy expensive or as fragile). And the OP said he was going to investigate smaller sizes, 3" isn't really optimal for his uses anyway.
 
Last year I made a number of prototype collets for a Black Diamond drill grinder. I tried a number of different materials including 1018. While the slots were a bit wider .009" - .012" they were quite deep at .750". Most were done on an ancient US Machine Tools #1 horizontal mill with a 1" diameter arbor and 3" OD HSS hollow ground slitting saws. As with the story of the tortoise and the hare, slow and steady wins the race. I ran the machine at it's lowest spindle speed of 150 rpm and took cuts between .062 and .120 deep. Even at that speed it was a bit nerve racking.

In the end I made a couple dozen prototypes, but managed to destroy one saw. The saw was destroyed in an instant. One second it was cutting fine. A second later there was a pop and the saw disintegrated. I have no idea what caused the failure. Whether a tooth got caught, I advanced the table too fast, or hit a hard spot. In any case the saw was instantly junk.
 
in 3-4 weeks these will be in stock and will be a standard item. .006" thick is not a problem for 1", 1-1/2", and even 3" diameters.

201-3.0-1.0-.006-72T
201-1.0-.375-.006-72T
201-1.5-.500-.006-72T
 








 
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