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  1. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by plunger View Post
    But I think its a dying art anyway. I wonder how many manual machinists under forty exist.? I bet most machinists of today cant operate any machine if it doesnt have buttons.

    I learnt a long time ago that you can learn something from someone you would never expect would teach you something new.I also bet you that some old school hobbiests /part time machinests are far more skilled especially in problem solving than machinists of today.Guys in darkest Africa or some unpronounceable town in Russia may teach hot shot machinists a thing or two on some kak asian machine.
    You may be right about a majority of "machinists" these days. Except those guys aren't really machinists, they are machine operators. There is a big difference. Pushing buttons doesn't qualify you for much. Actually doing the programming and setup is a different story. Those guys are machinists.

    As regards the ingenuity and inventiveness with procedures, there's plenty of that around with the current U.S. machinists still. And no I really don't think any other countries' machinists would teach ours a thing or two, in general. The same in the other direction. Smart people are smart people, no matter where they are.

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    Here's a thing that happens regularly. Someone posts that they don't know machining, but have an engineering degree, so this should be easy. They want to do 'A', and have decided to accomplish it by doing 'B'. "How do I do 'B'?" they ask. We respond "To do 'A', you don't want to do 'B', you should do 'C'". OP replies "You're stupid, I have an engineering degree, I'm going to do 'B'". OP invariably fails, and makes excuses about why he was right all along anyway.

  4. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by mhajicek View Post
    Here's a thing that happens regularly. Someone posts that they don't know machining, but have an engineering degree, so this should be easy. They want to do 'A', and have decided to accomplish it by doing 'B'. "How do I do 'B'?" they ask. We respond "To do 'A', you don't want to do 'B', you should do 'C'". OP replies "You're stupid, I have an engineering degree, I'm going to do 'B'". OP invariably fails, and makes excuses about why he was right all along anyway.
    As an experienced person and an engineer, your example drives me crazy and it happens all too often. I for one, have no patience for stupid. degree or otherwise. Stupid people are everywhere. They are unavoidable. We here on this forum help each other. Ignorance is acceptable, stupidity is not, at least to me. Why ask a question if you already know the answer? It makes no sense and it pisses me off. I very much enjoy helping others. but if the questioner has not done his own research up front or his question is to impress the forum with his personal knowledge, he has wasted my time and it really upsets me. Jus sayin!

  5. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve-l View Post
    As an experienced person and an engineer, your example drives me crazy and it happens all too often. I for one, have no patience for stupid. degree or otherwise. Stupid people are everywhere. They are unavoidable. We here on this forum help each other. Ignorance is acceptable, stupidity is not, at least to me. Why ask a question if you already know the answer? It makes no sense and it pisses me off. I very much enjoy helping others. but if the questioner has not done his own research up front or his question is to impress the forum with his personal knowledge, he has wasted my time and it really upsets me. Jus sayin!
    Yes, I agree, if you were banned from here, it would cut in half the stoopid postings......But hey, you've got 3-phase....

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  7. #205
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    Hi All:
    You guys do know that they grade on a bell curve in any profession but they have a big incentive to pass all who make it into professional school so they skew the curve to allow morons to get their degree too. (at least that's what they did when I got my degree).

    That means a small chunk of the graduates are dumb as a box of rocks, a whole whack are mediocre but don't stand out, and a few are really really smart and a credit to their profession.

    A variation of this is true in any biological system and particularly any human performance measure.
    But Momma Nature doesn't skew the curve so Darwin naturally takes care of a goodly chunk of the dumb ones on the left hand side of the curve.

    This means some great engineers and some really really bad ones too...when we encounter the especially pig headed, I suspect we have encountered one who resides on that left hand end of the curve.
    Maybe it's not their fault, but they sure can be tedious, especially if they grade really high on the "Robust Positive Self Regard" curve at the same time.

    But going back to the notion of helping out a newbie, I like to try...sometimes I'll have a good experience, sometimes not.
    I try not to let the losers spoil the pleasure I get from helping out a good one and watching them succeed.
    So my vote goes to welcoming all...the obnoxious ones will sort themselves out soon enough and be excluded from the gene pool.

    Cheers

    Marcus
    Implant Mechanix • Design & Innovation > HOME
    Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining

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  9. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by implmex View Post
    Hi All:
    You guys do know that they grade on a bell curve in any profession but they have a big incentive to pass all who make it into professional school so they skew the curve to allow morons to get their degree too. (at least that's what they did when I got my degree).]
    That was not my experience in engineering school. There was one class sophomore year, in material science. Hard as hell, professor was a complete ahole. Later on I had other classes with same prof. He was a real pleasure. As a senior I asked him why he was such a hard a$$ in that material class. His response, we don't have enough room in the upper division classes, we need to weed out the ones that are not cut out to be engineers. "It was my job to blow these guys back to the business department"

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    Quote Originally Posted by steve-l View Post
    Ignorance is acceptable, stupidity is not,
    it really upsets me. Jus sayin!
    A-Men! :-) That has always been my take on it.
    ...lewie...

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    Site owners and moderators are doing a good job to keep the site professional and useful, or it would be so full of the same old questions thousands of times that it would sooner get boring and the site would fail.
    People should be expected to at least read their owner's manual before asking "where is the start button on my new Green Machine?

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    I don't know if it is possible with the forum software but I've often wondered if, while attempting to make their first post new members were redirected to a page with the sticky re posting rules and had to check a box stating that they have read and understand the rules.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    I don't know if it is possible with the forum software but I've often wondered if, while attempting to make their first post new members were redirected to a page with the sticky re posting rules and had to check a box stating that they have read and understand the rules.
    I can't tell you the number of times I have scrolled past walls of words just to get to the click box at the end. If there's one thing I'm sure of, it's that I'm not alone. Those things are so ubiquitous these days, most everyone ignores them.

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  17. #211
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    On the forum page where it says:
    Welcome to the Practical Machinist - Largest Manufacturing Technology Forum on the Web.
    Make it;
    Welcome to the Practical Machinist - Largest Manufacturing Technology Forum on the Web - Make a related thread title.

  18. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganbuck View Post
    Site owners and moderators are doing a good job to keep the site professional and useful, or it would be so full of the same old questions thousands of times that it would sooner get boring and the site would fail.
    Not so sure of this. Seems like "back in the day" offending threads were shut down much more quickly and ruthlessly, Milacron is just not as present on the site as he used to be.

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    I think the government should track them down and put them in a re-education camp.
    A couple of years of re-education and hard labor should straighten them out.

  20. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    I don't know if it is possible with the forum software but I've often wondered if, while attempting to make their first post new members were redirected to a page with the sticky re posting rules and had to check a box stating that they have read and understand the rules.
    Better yet: new users have to pass a quiz on the forum rules.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Erich View Post
    That was not my experience in engineering school. There was one class sophomore year, in material science. Hard as hell, professor was a complete ahole. Later on I had other classes with same prof. He was a real pleasure. As a senior I asked him why he was such a hard a$$ in that material class. His response, we don't have enough room in the upper division classes, we need to weed out the ones that are not cut out to be engineers. "It was my job to blow these guys back to the business department"
    i like it like in that movie 12 o clock high the stress test . would you want to fly in a plane that someone on the low side of this curve designed .
    [This means some great engineers and some really really bad ones too...when we encounter the especially pig headed, I suspect we have encountered one who resides on that left hand end of the curve.
    Maybe it's not their fault, but they sure can be tedious, especially if they grade really high on the "Robust Positive Self Regard" curve at the same time.]

  22. #216
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    This thread has more posts about about newb posts than we actually have newb posts.

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    Dang I must be a scam artist. I fit the profile. Not only was I born a newb and machining is my main hobby, I am an engineer and have a license to prove it. Despite being a hobbiest and engineer, I've received 1,168 Likes and put up a diamond number of posts without being tossed out.

    Knock the folks who don't follow the rules, but don't categorize and knock folks for their hobbies or professions.

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  26. #218
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    I got into this trade as a hobbyist.....over 23 yrs making a living at it....and....

    I used a shaper just the other day......I had to make a tool holder and tooling for the blind key-ways.....in some couplings....

  27. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by rimcanyon View Post
    Better yet: new users have to pass a quiz on the forum rules.
    Don't ask for shit, you might get it - or, worse, *you* will be given the task of creating the quiz!

  28. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim rozen View Post
    Don't ask for shit, you might get it - or, worse, *you* will be given the task of creating the quiz!
    What is Digger Doug's favorite hobby? Is it

    A) Finding spam posts and telling them to piss off
    B) Finding posts from home shop Harrys and telling them where to go
    C) Getting pissed off at random, seemingly benign posts and insulting the people who made them
    D) Attending wine tastings with his book club

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