Tesla Announces the model 3
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    Default Tesla Announces the model 3

    How many of you guys are buying?


    Tesla Model 3 Will Be A Bargain At $35, Before Incentives

    Will be interesting to see how many jobs it will create?

    dee
    ;-D

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    It's still a shapeless blob....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderedge View Post
    It's still a shapeless blob....
    yeah, it is but the innards are different

    dee
    ;-D

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderedge View Post
    It's still a shapeless blob....
    To perpetuate comparing cars to women...

    You don't go with the cheap ones for their looks. The lookers cost too much..

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    Quote Originally Posted by dcsipo View Post
    How many of you guys are buying?


    Tesla Model 3 Will Be A Bargain At $35, Before Incentives

    Will be interesting to see how many jobs it will create?

    dee
    ;-D
    Any particular reason you linked to an article written a year ago vs current news?

    Model 3 | Tesla Motors

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    Quote Originally Posted by Philabuster View Post
    Any particular reason you linked to an article written a year ago vs current news?

    Model 3 | Tesla Motors
    that was a mistake .

    Thanks for the fresh link...

    dee
    ;-D

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderedge View Post
    It's still a shapeless blob....
    What a bitter comment. If you do not have anything nice to say, do not say anything at all....

    Math on this car, as well as timing. Makes me sign up for one.

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    "What a bitter comment. If you do not have anything nice to say, do not say anything at all"

    Uh, this forum is not a subsidiary of the Politically Correct consortium .
    We are firm believers in free speech.

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    Guys, April fools should've made my first comment a bit more jokey.

    Tesla I doing some great work in the EV market, they show that potential in Motorsport won't be lost once standard IC engines get phased out. I do believe Ev's are the future, but major energy companies need to work on renewable low solution energy.

    No point in driving an EV if the power plants are contaminating the planet just as much as gasoline.

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    I guess Elon has big plans for going to Mars. Maybe he should figure out how to make a car that isn't a piece of crisp first.

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    I would not mind one, problem over here with electric cars is resale value, it plummets faster than a descending rocket 1st stage! Add in all sorts of weird shit battery monthly rental deals here on a lot of the current offerings and i really don't know what to think. That said they are becoming more and more main stream both new and second hand.

    200 mile real world range would cover any trip i have made in the last 10 years. 0-60 in 6 secounds certainly sounds good too.

    That all said, for the asking price i could buy enough fuel currently to do another 500,000 miles in my current truck. hell if you factor in road tax (free for all electric) plus servicing costs ignoring things like tyres which a electric still needs, its not going to make any sense for me for more than a decades + real world motoring.

    If electric motoring is going to make sense and realy hit the mass market place, over here that means its going to have to work in a second hand 3+ year old car viably and economically. If the battery tech can still deliver 75% of new range 4-5 years down the road, yeah they will take off, but if your looking at buying a 4 year old car thats then going to need a even more expensive battery swap, its going to be a deal breaker in the used motoring market place, which at least over here is the main market place!

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    Quote Originally Posted by adama View Post
    I would not mind one, problem over here with electric cars is resale value, it plummets faster than a descending rocket 1st stage! Add in all sorts of weird shit battery monthly rental deals here on a lot of the current offerings and i really don't know what to think. That said they are becoming more and more main stream both new and second hand.

    200 mile real world range would cover any trip i have made in the last 10 years. 0-60 in 6 secounds certainly sounds good too.

    That all said, for the asking price i could buy enough fuel currently to do another 500,000 miles in my current truck. hell if you factor in road tax (free for all electric) plus servicing costs ignoring things like tyres which a electric still needs, its not going to make any sense for me for more than a decades + real world motoring.

    If electric motoring is going to make sense and realy hit the mass market place, over here that means its going to have to work in a second hand 3+ year old car viably and economically. If the battery tech can still deliver 75% of new range 4-5 years down the road, yeah they will take off, but if your looking at buying a 4 year old car thats then going to need a even more expensive battery swap, its going to be a deal breaker in the used motoring market place, which at least over here is the main market place!
    Dunno how bad you are getting screwed by your import taxes and VAT, etc., but here in Canada with a 75 cent dollar in comparison to the US, that $35K car is well into the territory that will buy me several cars new off the lot, each of which I should expect to get ten years life out of. Just checked. At the current rates, that is a $46+K car. I can buy a pretty nice Toyota off the lot for $22K.

    All I see in these is an answer to the First World Problem, of feeling guilty about ones own well-being, and being well off enough to be able to spend a portion of ones disposable income on yet ANOTHER car, so as to feel like one is DOING something.

    Pure waste.

    I won't touch a used Hybrid, nor will I consider a new one off the lot. The fuel savings do not come close to matching the added cost potential in maintenance and esp., troubleshooting. I am certainly not going to spend the money needed for a DIY effort, on the computers that would be needed to do such at home.
    I have witnessed firsthand, far too many extremely high repair bills on modern vehicles, mostly caused by the inability of the mechanics in the dealer's own shops, to stay caught up and effective, when dealing with constantly changing tech. Those things are pure marketing genius, but they certainly won't solve the planet's 'problems', any more than carting ones groceries home in a shitty reusable bag will. Feel-good bullshit.

    I still want to know how well the windows stay clear when it is 20 degrees below zero and humid out because it just warmed up outside (from -40C), as well as how that will affect the battery life. Issues like that will keep these cars at the level of a third or fourth vehicle for those that can afford it. Sunny summer days only.

    As to the renewable energy issue, the Ontario electrical grid is currently paying aprox 75 cents a KWH for supposedly renewable electricity that sells for 12-14 cents a KWH. That cannot last, they are already digging a fiscal hole they may never get out of. Eventually there will be an end to that foolishness, and when there is, there will be rather a lot of high tech junk left about the countryside, abandoned by companies that will have been dissolved and vanished. When the subsidies die, so do the projects. Rinse and repeat. Lots of broken glass on the ground out of sight where this has happened already.

    Oh yeah. Savagmachines. One fucking post in nearly six fucking years, and it's to whinge about someone else's post? Don't be a twat!

    Cheers
    Trev

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    " problem over here with electric cars is resale value, it plummets faster than a descending rocket 1st stage! "

    Good point. The last gas-powered car I bought, was worth more when I drove it off the lot, than when I bought it!

    Not.

    215 mile range on that thing, stock. Not bad. A bit expensive as a commuter car though.

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    There is another thread on this, I started a few days ago.

    http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...-tesla-318477/
    Hope the link works.

    There are quite a number of technical/commercial reason for and against Tesla, mostly for.
    On technical aka engineering grounds, and on $$ ie investment grounds.

    One prediction I did late last year came to fruit - Tesla had a massive hit and will, almost 100%, become a new auto major.
    The risks were
    1. running out of money and
    2. autopilots killing people- neither happened. Ie bodged tech of some sort.

    They had presold 7.5 billion of new sales in 2 days, and might hit 10 billion on monday, most likely.
    Count was at 230.000, and rising. At avg 42k, thats 9.6 billion sales, and 230 million cash now.

    But the execution risks were (ludicrously ?- VBG )high.

    My predicion for Tesla is 2022 production of 2-3 million cars and a valuation soemwhere north of 60 billion ex energy.
    Also, 1-4 of the top 5 auto companies will die around 2020, +/- a few.

    Reasons: Financial- stocks and bonds.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hanermo View Post
    There is another thread on this, I started a few days ago.

    http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...-tesla-318477/
    Hope the link works.

    There are quite a number of technical/commercial reason for and against Tesla, mostly for.
    On technical aka engineering grounds, and on $$ ie investment grounds.

    One prediction I did late last year came to fruit - Tesla had a massive hit and will, almost 100%, become a new auto major.
    The risks were
    1. running out of money and
    2. autopilots killing people- neither happened. Ie bodged tech of some sort.

    They had presold 7.5 billion of new sales in 2 days, and might hit 10 billion on monday, most likely.
    Count was at 230.000, and rising. At avg 42k, thats 9.6 billion sales, and 230 million cash now.

    But the execution risks were (ludicrously ?- VBG )high.

    My predicion for Tesla is 2022 production of 2-3 million cars and a valuation soemwhere north of 60 billion ex energy.
    Also, 1-4 of the top 5 auto companies will die around 2020, +/- a few.

    Reasons: Financial- stocks and bonds.
    This is not 7.5 billion in new sales.

    What they got was a $1000 deposits on a possible orders of 230,000 so far. There is no product yet, just the prototype. Presently there is no production start date or promised delivery dates. The deposit is fully rescindable at anytime.

    There is a large herd and greed mindset in this deal. I see 230,000 people that didn't have anything better to do with a thousand dollars than to stand in line for a current vaporware product.

    Until Tesla has the Model 3 coming off the assembly line and can give a delivery date for an order, this all just vapor.

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  23. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by trevj View Post
    Dunno how bad you are getting screwed by your import taxes and VAT, etc., but here in Canada with a 75 cent dollar in comparison to the US, that $35K car is well into the territory that will buy me several cars new off the lot, each of which I should expect to get ten years life out of. Just checked. At the current rates, that is a $46+K car. I can buy a pretty nice Toyota off the lot for $22K.

    All I see in these is an answer to the First World Problem, of feeling guilty about ones own well-being, and being well off enough to be able to spend a portion of ones disposable income on yet ANOTHER car, so as to feel like one is DOING something.

    Pure waste.

    I won't touch a used Hybrid, nor will I consider a new one off the lot. The fuel savings do not come close to matching the added cost potential in maintenance and esp., troubleshooting. I am certainly not going to spend the money needed for a DIY effort, on the computers that would be needed to do such at home.
    I have witnessed firsthand, far too many extremely high repair bills on modern vehicles, mostly caused by the inability of the mechanics in the dealer's own shops, to stay caught up and effective, when dealing with constantly changing tech. Those things are pure marketing genius, but they certainly won't solve the planet's 'problems', any more than carting ones groceries home in a shitty reusable bag will. Feel-good bullshit.

    I still want to know how well the windows stay clear when it is 20 degrees below zero and humid out because it just warmed up outside (from -40C), as well as how that will affect the battery life. Issues like that will keep these cars at the level of a third or fourth vehicle for those that can afford it. Sunny summer days only.

    As to the renewable energy issue, the Ontario electrical grid is currently paying aprox 75 cents a KWH for supposedly renewable electricity that sells for 12-14 cents a KWH. That cannot last, they are already digging a fiscal hole they may never get out of. Eventually there will be an end to that foolishness, and when there is, there will be rather a lot of high tech junk left about the countryside, abandoned by companies that will have been dissolved and vanished. When the subsidies die, so do the projects. Rinse and repeat. Lots of broken glass on the ground out of sight where this has happened already.

    Oh yeah. Savagmachines. One fucking post in nearly six fucking years, and it's to whinge about someone else's post? Don't be a twat!

    Cheers
    Trev
    Imagine you had a 1500 Watt hair dryer to defrost your windows. That's the equivalent of only 2 HP -- probably not too taxing on the batteries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tomato coupe View Post
    Imagine you had a 1500 Watt hair dryer to defrost your windows. That's the equivalent of only 2 HP -- probably not too taxing on the batteries.
    At -40 thats a significant percent of battery capacity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gbent View Post
    At -40 thats a significant percent of battery capacity.
    Rough calculation:

    The Tesla Model S has a battery capacity of 85 kWh and a stated range of 270 miles at 55 mph. That gives you about 5 hours of driving time, with the motors drawing 17 kW. So, using a 1500 W defroster (continuously) would reduce the driving time by about 9%. I don't know if that fits your definition of significant, but I would disagree with the statement that the Tesla is suited for "sunny summer days only."

    Cheers

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    Yeah but most the people on the planet don't live some were were it gets anything close to -40 just like most of us don't live some were were it tops a 110 all that often either. Hell most humans on the planet would consider thoes kinda environments one of the last places to call home and go look for some were more hospitable to life as we know it!

    Its like saying to henery ford whos ever going to buy your cars and need transport, i live on the isle of white! aka little island of the south coast of england but a couple of miles across.

    FYI im well aware new petrol or diesel cars plummet once being driven off the lot, but electrics over here do it at least 50% faster which is a pretty significant difference. Nissan leafs are recooned to depreciate at a rate of the first year being equivelent to 3 years for a normal car. That said, its kinda brining it more in line with what that kinda model of car normally sells for secound hand a a similar petrol - diesel would be over 1/3rd cheaper new!

    To make real sense to the majority electric cars have to have a real comparable life cycle cost, not just a cheap fuel source at vast costs every other way. Don't get me wrong, the teslas a good step in that direction, but the nissan leaf over here is doing pretty good too + its made here, current range is 155 miles, which accounts - is more than enough for a lot of secound cars in house holds here. Don't get me wrong performance is down on the tesla, but its also damn near a 1/3rd the cost! I think if there not carefull come 2017 there going to be just selling another electric car, this is not the space industry, the auto world moves fast, currently tesla seams slow! Im sure more than a few others are going to be launching new electrics before then that no doubt will be avalible for certain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tomato coupe View Post
    The Tesla Model S has a battery capacity of 85 kWh and a stated range of 270 miles at 55 mph.
    -'Couple points...

    One, that 270 miles of range is generally an absolute perfect-conditions potential best. As virtually all real-world full-electric drivers have found, that's anywhere from mildly to wildly optimistic.

    Two, your calculation doesn't take into account the power loss from the cold itself. I have no data on how Tesla's high-tech batteries handle the cold, but since virtually all batteries work via some form of chemical reaction, and physics dictates that chemical reactions slow as they get colder, total range-per-charge will be strongly diminished.

    Being an Alaskan, I'm well aware how a good strong conventional car battery, which can fire a hot high-compression big-block within half a revolution on a warm day, can barely turn over a small four cylinder on a cold day.

    And three, a 1,500 watt electric heater, I will also attest from direct personal experience, will NOT keep the passenger area of your car comfortably warm- or even just reasonably warm. Parked, maybe. With moving air, and having to draw cold air in for the defrosters, no way in hell.

    Now, don't take that wrong. I have nothing against electrics. I'd love to have a Tesla, personally. But generally speaking, full electrics are simply NOT a truly viable choice outside of the Sun Belt.

    Doc.

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