I'm looking at the seco turning catalog and see torque values for set screws in nm (Newton Meter), but the values are listed as 0,5 Nm, 10,0 Nm, etc, with a comma between two numbers. I can't seem to find anything referring to what the two values on either side of the comma mean? Can anyone point me in the right direction?
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Torque values for lathe I serts
- Thread starter jpkulu
- Start date
- Replies 21
- Views 4,601
European practice, comma is the new decimal seperator, Dots are used for thousands, i tell you its a stupid as the whole metric - imperial thing yet again every fucking human has to come up with a new unique retarded approach just to confuse shit needlessly.
gregormarwick
Diamond
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- Feb 7, 2007
- Location
- Aberdeen, UK
It's not new, and we in the UK/US/Commonwealth countries are the exception not the rule in using the period as a decimal separator in metric notation. It's just another convention grandfathered in from the imperial system.
thermite
Diamond
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2011
Conflicting prior usages - several - more than just "grandfathering" it seems. All that had to be reconciled "somehow". See Ministry of Technology, 1968, within:
Decimal separator - Wikipedia
gregormarwick
Diamond
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2007
- Location
- Aberdeen, UK
Yes, clearly not quite as black and white as I stated.
Nonetheless, the gist of what I wrote is at least semi-accurate!
In the development and adoption of the metric system, the comma separator came first. The period separator came later, whether for familiarity or conflict resolution, or just because.
thermite
Diamond
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2011
Aye, "current", anyway.
The "best news" is that USUALLY one can tell a 'puter to use decimal or comma for "point", or sometimes just which currency - and the rest follows-suit automagically - pretty much the developed world-over by now.
I still use the superscript/underscore when hand-writing a bank cheque (about one a year!), otherwise, the 'puters do all the "creating" and we have only the two to sort vs a dozen of yesteryear.
partsproduction
Titanium
- Joined
- Aug 22, 2011
- Location
- Oregon coast
Most ape men in US shops don't bother with torque wrenches anyway, just pop the heads off and snicker quietly while the boss picks the screw out of the holder. He couldn't hear the snickering anyway because he's too loudly complaining about how the ape men tighten screws, but hey, it all pays the same huh?
To teach employees to use a torque driver means using it himself, and he is in too much of a hurry to waste time on them since HE never over tightens insert screws.
To teach employees to use a torque driver means using it himself, and he is in too much of a hurry to waste time on them since HE never over tightens insert screws.
Mark Rand
Diamond
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- Jul 9, 2007
- Location
- UK Rugby Warwickshire
If you use the torx/allen drivers with the plastic flag handles without a crescent wrench cheater, it's fairly hard to over tighten the screws unless you are taking it as a challenge.
plastikdreams
Diamond
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- May 31, 2011
- Location
- upstate nj
Tight plus a little bump...that's all ya need.
Red James
Stainless
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- Jan 26, 2013
- Location
- Plainfield, Indiana, USA
The original question was 'I can't seem to find anything referring to what the two values on either side of the comma mean?'
One Newton (unit of FORCE) is about 0.22 pounds, or 3.5 ounces. The torque of 0.5 Nm is 0.175 oz pushing on one meter, or about 7 inch-ounces. Not a whole lot!
One Newton (unit of FORCE) is about 0.22 pounds, or 3.5 ounces. The torque of 0.5 Nm is 0.175 oz pushing on one meter, or about 7 inch-ounces. Not a whole lot!
thermite
Diamond
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2011
Most ape men in US shops don't bother with torque wrenches anyway, just pop the heads off and snicker quietly while the boss picks the screw out of the holder. He couldn't hear the snickering anyway because he's too loudly complaining about how the ape men tighten screws, but hey, it all pays the same huh?
To teach employees to use a torque driver means using it himself, and he is in too much of a hurry to waste time on them since HE never over tightens insert screws.
Well he wouln't, would he? Condom would slip first!
Bobw
Diamond
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2005
- Location
- Hatch, NM Chile capital of the WORLD
No No No No... You tighten until its starts to get loose again, then back off a quarter turn...
Or so I was told growing up... My Dad and I spent a lot of time playing with eazy outs...
Sidetrack with my Dad.. A few winters ago he was fixing something on his plow, and he FINALLY
decided to use a torque wrench.. Some sheet metal thing held down by a single bolt in the center.
Said to torque to 14..... So he did, Ft*Lbs... Squished the whole damn thing and had to buy a new one..
He didn't notice that the unit was Inch*Lbs.. Though I was proud of him for using a torque wrench.
Thanks for the responses. Ive been running lathes for a few years and I'm at a new shop. We have been having issues with employees breaking Allen wrenches trying to unscrew my seat screws and keep saying they I'm tightening them too tight. Knowing how to tighten them from experience, my logic to them was that I used the same Allen wrench to tighten them and I didn't torque them enough to break them (not even close), so if I didn't apply enough torque to reach the failure point of the wrench (for it to break), and it breaks upon loosening, obviously the screw got tighter on its own for it to require more torque than the wrenches breaking going to unscrew it. The problem is we don't use anti sieze, operator's don't use two wrenches to untighten too tight of screws and when inserts break so bad that the shim seat gets severly damaged we continue to use the damaged shims for lack of having more on hand. I believe that without a shim that is properly supporting the insert, the tool runs and the insert is pushed down in a way that creates leverage and the back side of it pushes against the screw causing it to get even tighter. I'm going to try logic in explaining all of this in addition to explaining the proper torque of the screw since others still think that the answer is that it's too tight and they barely tighten theirs down so that I can actually remove theirs with my fingers and no wrench at all, smh
CarbideBob
Diamond
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2007
- Location
- Flushing/Flint, Michigan
Is this a N/L pin and seat or a plain screw down insert?
Plain N/L or top clamp also?
Anti-seize should not be needed. Two wrenches also should not unless a wreck.
In a pin/clamp this should never occur in normal use. If torqued this hard you have killed the holder's cone which someone took much pains to put int the right spot for you or at least ruined the pin..
Tight on a torx screw down insert is not the same for a pin/clamp center.
Not sure what you have. Tilt pin alone, pin and clamp, or insert screw.
Sounds like you have a pin, these will not hold downwards if you tighten them a bunch.
In fact they often will lift the front tip of the insert off the seat. (bad)
This is a very common mistake on standard pin/clamp holders.
If you need two wrenches top and bottom you have done something wrong, overloaded the holder/bit, or the pin/holder is going bad.
This is a warning sign of the tooling speaking to you as loud as it can. You should not have this problem.
Your OP is looking up set screw torque but later you mention two wrenches....I make holders and I'm a bit confused on holder design.
Perhaps you could clarify? There are three basics, screw in insert alone, tilt or cam pin in insert alone, and pin with a top clamp.
Bob
Plain N/L or top clamp also?
Anti-seize should not be needed. Two wrenches also should not unless a wreck.
In a pin/clamp this should never occur in normal use. If torqued this hard you have killed the holder's cone which someone took much pains to put int the right spot for you or at least ruined the pin..
Tight on a torx screw down insert is not the same for a pin/clamp center.
Not sure what you have. Tilt pin alone, pin and clamp, or insert screw.
Sounds like you have a pin, these will not hold downwards if you tighten them a bunch.
In fact they often will lift the front tip of the insert off the seat. (bad)
This is a very common mistake on standard pin/clamp holders.
If you need two wrenches top and bottom you have done something wrong, overloaded the holder/bit, or the pin/holder is going bad.
This is a warning sign of the tooling speaking to you as loud as it can. You should not have this problem.
Your OP is looking up set screw torque but later you mention two wrenches....I make holders and I'm a bit confused on holder design.
Perhaps you could clarify? There are three basics, screw in insert alone, tilt or cam pin in insert alone, and pin with a top clamp.
Bob
And the screw isn't torqued that much when initially screwed in. I can easily untighten it immediately after tightening it if I needed to for whatever reason, but after running it, two wrenches are needed or a single wrench will break. That being said, I got ahold of a new seat and replaced it with the damaged one and the problem has stopped. Others blamed me for tightening it too much
CarbideBob
Diamond
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2007
- Location
- Flushing/Flint, Michigan
This makes no sense.
The pin should not contact or touch the seat at all.
In fact when the center pin is tightened down hard without an insert the seat should be free floating and moving.
This is a check you make when building holders.
This pin should be light finger tight, it only serves to push the insert against the wall.
It should only be unscrewed 1/2 turn max when changing inserts.More than this introduces problems.
I see people totally remove the NL pin, put an insert on it and reassemble. All I can do is cry and shake my head at that point.
Bob
You're right, I didn't mean that the pin touches the seat, I don't know the best way to explain it other than to draw a diagram of what I think is happening. The clamp obviously will stop the insert from going up on the back, but there is still leverage being applied and force in a way that's not normal. 
