Tradesman Grinder

Anyone have any experience with the Tradesman DC grinder, Home - Tradesman Grinder ? I'm looking mainly to use this for HSS tooling, etc...they make claim to running slower, having diamond and CBN wheels that don't wear and run cool, and have a bunch of add-on accessories....

The belt/wheel grinders look like underpowered toys.

the endmills and drill shapeners are simply re-badged chinese junk.

To my surprise, I agree with digger doug. To the OP, suggest a used 7" 3600 rpm Baldor with a soft, course grit wheel, or better if you can find one, a 10" 1800 rpm Baldor. The 10" did come in both 115 volt and 220 volt and would be the one I prefer. If you have money, also get a Baldor carbide grinder and change the wheels out to grind HSS. Easier for a beginer to get desired angles this way.

L7

drcoelho said:

Anyone have any experience with the Tradesman DC grinder, Home - Tradesman Grinder ? I'm looking mainly to use this for HSS tooling, etc...they make claim to running slower, having diamond and CBN wheels that don't wear and run cool, and have a bunch of add-on accessories....

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Housing may look Taiwan "Tradesman" table-saw grade of 30 years ago, but the "about us" and Jeff Toycen say US designs, high give-a-damn-level, and a prestigeous assortment of major-name customers.

Looks aside, it may be closer FUNCTIONAL kin to the plain-looking but effective Glendo and Darex class of "JFDI" goods.

What sort of costs are you looking at?

On order of $1200 for base unit and up to $4000 with all the accessories. And my impression was high quality given the Jeff Toycen design behind them.

drcoelho said:

On order of $1200 for base unit and up to $4000 with all the accessories. And my impression was high quality given the Jeff Toycen design behind them.

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That isn't too far away from basic Glendo/Darex nor even much more than a Taiwanese knock-off of a Deckel/Alexander/Gorton-Lars "SO" ++ style.

Got to pondering sumthin' else, though.

Fond as I am of Dee Cee, I'd have to question the use of either a PM OR wound-field DC motor around Iron-family magnetic-responsive "grinder turd".

AC motors are essentially constantly de-magnetizing their own shells, so to speak. DC not so much - the field is "influenced" by the Armature, but not ordinarily being reversed, "PM" least of all, and the field is "ordinarily" outermost, and next to the shell.

One wonders if what they did was to apply "inside out" DC motor design? The Armature magnetic fields DO reverse, same as AC, just off local control, not VFD or utility mains incoming reversals. That's what either of brushes & commutators ELSE brushless sensors and solid-state switches DO.

We need either type of motor to "perpetually chase its own tail" lest it be useful only as a rotary solenoid, the one big "thump", then hold like a mean-ass junkyard dog on a fresh bone!

In DC motor, the rotating armature sits inside of the enclosing fixed magnets, no EM field beyond the magnets, won't get outside the motor casing.

drcoelho said:

In DC motor, the rotating armature sits inside of the enclosing fixed magnets, no EM field beyond the magnets, won't get outside the motor casing.

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That's the theory. Even classified projects with deep pockets have a hard time finding and using materials sufficiently righteous to deliver to a 100% for the real-world reality of it.

PM motor magnets very much do "make their presence known to the world at-large." IIRC, I only even have the one. USUALLY, I want a field I can weaken with the movement of a dial, not the "laying-on of hands", physically with opposing magnets!

And..lest we forget, we do not yet know WHAT the OEM used.

I didn't look. Not my ox at risk of being gored. But might they have a "white paper" online as to what they have done?

drcoelho said:

In DC motor, the rotating armature sits inside of the enclosing fixed magnets, no EM field beyond the magnets, won't get outside the motor casing.

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Yeah but the iron fillings off a 180 grit CBN wheel will sure get inside!

drcoelho said:

On order of $1200 for base unit and up to $4000 with all the accessories. And my impression was high quality given the Jeff Toycen design behind them.

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drcoelho said:

In DC motor, the rotating armature sits inside of the enclosing fixed magnets, no EM field beyond the magnets, won't get outside the motor casing.

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Your starting to sound like you have a vested interest in said company....

Is the OP wanting to grind HSS lathe tooling and the occasional chisel/axe? Ie, nothing needing a tool and cutter grinder? If so, why the heck would one spend crazy money on the proposed grinder when a cheap and cheerful Baldor will do as good a job? Call me Scottish...

L7

lucky7 said:

Call me Scottish...

L7

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In Canada no less...
Royal Canadian Air Farce - Get Stuffed! - The National Debt - John Morgan - YouTube

Looks good.
I didn’t see where the power was listed.
I like how they have a bracket for tormek holders, I did the same when I built my 14” low speed grinder.
Price is reasonable all things considered.
What’s the arbor size? Can youse anyone’s wheels or are they proprietary?
I wouldn’t expect to be contouring blades with it though.

Gotta say digger doug, I enjoyed that blast from the past. Sheesh, twenty years ago and still mostly true. Amd we've got a Trudeau in power again... About to go slight rude and OT here, but I'll censor myself so the topic can return to grinding...

L7

lucky7 said:

Gotta say digger doug, I enjoyed that blast from the past. Sheesh, twenty years ago and still mostly true. Amd we've got a Trudeau in power again... About to go slight rude and OT here, but I'll censor myself so the topic can return to grinding...

L7

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Used to adjust the rabbit ears, and it came in directly across the Lake.

digger doug said:

Your starting to sound like you have a vested interest in said company....

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Give me a break. I'm simply asking whether anyone has any experience with this product. I'm trying to work out what grinder or grinders to buy for my small shop.

The EM field question from thermite was just interesting to me as I'm an electrical engineer, and has NOTHING to do with whether this is a good product or not, it was a generic question about DC motors.

lucky7 said:

Is the OP wanting to grind HSS lathe tooling and the occasional chisel/axe? Ie, nothing needing a tool and cutter grinder? If so, why the heck would one spend crazy money on the proposed grinder when a cheap and cheerful Baldor will do as good a job? Call me Scottish...

L7

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Yes, I'm just trying to grind HSS lathe tooling, etc....I'm pretty new to this stuff, and just evaluating various product that are on the market. Am I am leaning toward a Baldor but was just curious about this other product based on claims they were making on their web site.

drcoelho said:

Yes, I'm just trying to grind HSS lathe tooling, etc....I'm pretty new to this stuff, and just evaluating various product that are on the market. Am I am leaning toward a Baldor but was just curious about this other product based on claims they were making on their web site.

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I would definitely not buy one for that use. There's no reason to spend thousands on a grinder to sharpen HSS. You can quite easily do a great job sharpening and shaping HSS by hand on a good grinder with very little practice, even doing special form tools. Those machines are neat but totally unnecessary. If you are going to burn through tools it would be a way better idea to buy insert carbide tooling, get parts made 3-5x as fast, and just plop in new inserts. A carbide insert generally has 2-6 cutting edges, and for $3-20 an insert you're way ahead of HSS.

To add to that, while I don't really like carbide tooling on beat up manual mills, any good manual lathe will run carbide tooling very well. I love insert cabide on lathes.

Stay away from brazed-insert carbide tooling. The only time I'd grab that is if I needed a special form tool I was going to grind, and it needed to be carbide.

drcoelho said:

Yes, I'm just trying to grind HSS lathe tooling, etc.

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Not the best of choices, then.

A new Taiwanese, or used, Deckel/Alexander/Gorton-Lars SO type, "maybe" a "Cuttermaster" - I am simply not "hands on" with one, ever/so-far.. is far the better and more otherwise-useful deal.

A collection of SEVERAL cheap-ass HF 8" spindles is what I actually USE. Smooth-running ones get the good wheels, rougher-running ones mount the wire-brushes and muslin buffs.

I might WISH I had a Royal-Oak, KO Lee, or Cinncy T&C cutter grinder or even an Oliver of Adrian, or an over-tooled Gardner, Parker-Majestic, or Gallmeyer & Livingston SG.

But I don't NEED any of those, nor can spare the space.

Grinding in general is a speciality. To be any GOOD at it, one has to have "current" experience, LOTS OF IT, and more choices of wheels, workholding, alignment, chucks, heads, coolant systems, dust collectors and "Oh, BTW", multiple grinding MACHINES, not just the one.

I don't HAVE that, and I KNOW I do not. I don't want to divert time, funds, nor even space, to GETTING it.

It makes more sense to send anything that actually NEEDS precision ground badly enough OUT to he who does have it, and has it ALL.

Ask michiganbuck or cash masters what it would take to duplicate a decent grind shop from a bare slab.

"Sight unseen" I can pretty well ga-ron-f**king-tee you $1,200 would not even pay for the phone calls to order the equipment, arrange for power, and schedule the installation by the time it was making sparks. There are not a lot of "half measures" in that business that make good sense.

Stay down in the basics: Baldor or similar plain-Jane-spindle, Deckel SO/clone, Darex / Glendo with diamond lap, and that's about all you can effectively put to use before the cost or time invested against the "learning curve" takes you away from any other projects AT ALL.

Look at member Ballen. He has "discovered sex" in the form of a neat and seriously precise cylindrical grinder.

When the only tool you have is a hammer? He's precision-grinding every damned thing within reach he can even fit into that grinder, whether it NEEDS ground or NOT! You'd have to understand sex, I guess. Or at least cylindrical grinders?