Using ETD 150 Alloy for Shaper Spindle. Also Clearance Allowances.

So I recently picked up a Wadkin BER2 spindle shaper. The only spindle that came with it was a 1". Doesn't seem to be a lot of parts for this shaper floating around in the US. Interesting the spindle is straight, no taper for locating. Tolerances are tight, spindle measures .9997 +-.0001 and the bore to the best of my abilities is 1.0002. I had to tap it out with the draw bar. I'd like a 3/4" spindle and a 1 1/4" I found a 1 1/4" in England but it'll probable be $500 to get it here which seems like a lot for a straight shaft. I recently made an idler shaft for an edge sander from 4140PH which went fine but reading on PM and metal sites ETD 150 might be the ticket. Seems straight forward to turn between centers to keep everything in line. Any thoughts?

I made one like that from 1045 and it worked fine.

Any steel that isn't complete shit should work fine.

I'd consider using 4140 HT (pre-hard), as it might have a higher fatigue life due to not having Selenium as an addition for machining ease.

For comparison, the numbers I saw for 2" elongation were 7-10% for EDT 150, compared to 16% for 4140 HT. Pretty much the same tensile, yield, and hardness values otherwise. The higher elongation gives you greater toughness, which I'd value in a high-speed spindle.

The downside is likely some greater tool wear over EDT, and perhaps a little more effort to get a nice finish on the cut. I'd also leave as large a inside radius at the collar corners as I could get away with.

ETD 150 for punches - Heat Treating, general discussion - I Forge Iron

[Seems to be some variety of hardness in what vendors call 4140 HT, I'd look for one around 32Rc]

ETD150 is basically branded product of a pre-heat treated stock. They guarantee a certain level of machinability as well as 150KSI UTS. There is no chemical analysis guaranteed, just depends on what necessary alloys have to be added to the recycling stream to make strength.

I've used ETD-150 for horizontal mill arbors and slitting saw arbors with no issues. Avoid sharp corners and make the thread endings (pullouts) smooth. It's hard to picture much load, fatigue or otherwise, unless you have a big wreck. After all, the side load is not likely to be larger than what you can push with your hands, else the wood will kick back or push away from the cutter. I'll bet the drive motor shaft is wimpier than ETD-150.

gbent said:

ETD150 is basically branded product of a pre-heat treated stock. They guarantee a certain level of machinability as well as 150KSI UTS. There is no chemical analysis guaranteed, just depends on what necessary alloys have to be added to the recycling stream to make strength.

Click to expand...

I don't think that is right. There is Te, Se, or S added to enhance chip breaking, and the heat treatment is designed to get uniform properties all the way through the section with minimal residual stress.

Chemical Composition
Carbon (C) .40 Min
Manganese (Mn) .70/1.10
Silicon (Si) .15/.35
Chromium (Cr) .80/1.20
Molybdenum (Mo) .15/.25

I used 4140 PH to make 1-1/4" spindles and a router chuck for my Schneider (german) shaper. Bought it used with only a metric spindle, which I brought down to 3/4".

I wanted to see it I could get absolute minimum runout, so I turned the spindles slightly oversized between centers, inserted them in the machine and indicated them top and bottom with a tenth indicator. Then returned them to the lathe and moved the centers by lapping til they matched the recorded indicater runout, then final turned them. It worked great, got about a tenth TIR at the top of the spindle.

It's certainly not necessary to have that kind of precision, most manufacturers claim only "less than a thousandth" TIR, but as a woodworker I wanted to see what I could accomplish. Took forever, but very satisfying!

There is also "Fatigue Proof" which has the same composition as 1144 with free machining properties. It has a minimum of 30 C Rockwell hardness or Brinell Hardness minimum of 285. There are several offers on E-bay and can be obtained as ground and polished.

Hey Richard, I like that. I may try that when I turn new ones. Initial testing showed .005 at the bottom of the spindle above the bearing. I haven't checked the spindle between centers yet but get about .0015 in the bore. Seems to me if I did something similar but turn the straight section for the bore right on and oversize the upper section then indicated it in and then make any adjustments to the upper section I could get to that <.001