What can we do to help in the Coronavirus/COVID-19 era? - Page 5
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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    A lot is not adding up. I'd be subjected to three or four pages of flaming if I went into more detail now but suffice it to say I'll update this thread with the final tally same as I did with the Ebola thread. I may also reveal a few of the magician's tricks that have caused such panic.

    Don't expect real answers now because that would destroy the magic.

    At this point I fear overreaction far more than I fear the virus. Keep in mind that CA shut down the entire state after 2 deaths.
    Funny that you mention the ebola panic. I remember seeing the video of the EMS in Dallas delivering pizzas to the family of the fellow from Africa. They were pushing the boxes with a stick towards the door. None of his family including his wife got ebola. Only two of the nurses at the hospital where he died got it.
    Ebola evidentally is a lot harder to get from a person that is not showing symptoms than this c19.

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganbuck View Post
    Agree. Many/most stores here are out of paper towels and bleach..good that Janie has a gallon of bleach for clothes washing..we are using it for a bleach solution now...
    Though you were criticized, I think you are on the right track, Buck. It makes sense to decontaminate anything that comes into the house---fruits, veggies, money, mail, packages, groceries, and needed items purchased at the hardware store, etc. Spritzing many of those items with 1:100 bleach will do a good job of killing any residual virus. It is true that the virus does not do very well on aluminum and cardboard, but it does well on slick surfaces like steel, chrome, glass, and plastic.

    I have found it quite convenient to simply cook my mail, newspaper, periodicals and the like in the oven at 200 for an hour. That is my own home-brew idea, so caution. But I am pretty sure no living thing (except perhaps prions) is going to survive at those temps for long. Certainly not Corona virus as there is good evidence it is completely eradicated at 56deg C or 132 F. Plastic envelopes and window envelopes don't survive either! ;-) I used 200 to be sure that the heat penetrated the newspaper, mail etc completely. It appears that the virus can live for days on various surfaces. So it is reassuring and easy to cook a lot of items.

    Denis

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter from Holland View Post
    You are right. I should have told my source
    The 24 hours claim I got from the RIVM The Dutch governmental site for corona information over here A good chance to learn Dutch
    Mensen met verhoging of verkoudheidsklachten moeten thuisblijven. Je moet dan ook je sociale contacten beperken. Een dag nadat de klachten voorbij zijn, ben je niet meer besmettelijk.
    Google translate :People with increased temperature or colds should stay at home. You must therefore limit your social contacts. You are no longer contagious a day after the complaints have passed.
    https://www.rivm.nl/coronavirus/covid-19/vragen-antwoorden#eigengezondheid

    Peter
    to believe the RIVM is a hazardous enterprise.
    their advise, in general, will cost a lot of peoples lives.

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    Quote Originally Posted by janvanruth View Post
    to believe the RIVM is a hazardous enterprise.
    their advise, in general, will cost a lot of peoples lives.

    Says who???

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter from Holland View Post
    Says who???
    Says JanVanRuth

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  7. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeachMePlease View Post
    Says JanVanRuth
    I think he was referring to this part :

    "You are no longer contagious a day after the complaints have passed."

    I wouldn't be so sanguine about that at this point either. This is still a pretty new virus.

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    I am not sure, but this could be the truth

    remember a virus' job is not to get us sick, it is to reproduce.
    Our immune system does much of the work, raising out temp, coughing, sneezing. The virus 'knows' this and uses it to its advantage.
    The reason you are contagious before you are feeling sick is that is when the virus is reproducing at its fastest, before immune response.
    Once the immune response is over, it is because there is no virus left.

    I am not sure that is the safest of all possible advice, but it might be the truth. I mean, you might have virus on your personal items and on your person, I guess, after you have kicked it out of your body.

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    Studies have shown people shedding virus 5 weeks after infection.

    Coronavirus can survive 5 weeks in body after infection: study

    Denis

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    Quote Originally Posted by dgfoster View Post
    Studies have shown people shedding virus 5 weeks after infection.

    Coronavirus can survive 5 weeks in body after infection: study

    Denis
    Well, that's concerning! It does give foundation to the reports that this might be a 1yr+ fight to start with. But even the initial battle may be moot if this becomes a seasonal risk like "regular" flu.

    It also points to the need for really good and fast testing results, so those still infected can quarantine themselves.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Milland View Post
    Well, that's concerning! It does give foundation to the reports that this might be a 1yr+ fight to start with. But even the initial battle may be moot if this becomes a seasonal risk like "regular" flu.

    It also points to the need for really good and fast testing results, so those still infected can quarantine themselves.
    They have gave up on testing unless result of the test will change course of medical treatment. No tests, no supplies. This is total travesty.

    If this becomes regular thing, it will decimate the population. I suspect you can beat it once, but not 3-4 times even if healthy when everything started.

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    Quote Originally Posted by coffeetek View Post
    They have gave up on testing unless result of the test will change course of medical treatment. No tests, no supplies. This is total travesty.
    A reaction to the shortage of test kits, hopefully this will change as more become available. If virus shedding remains active for 5+ weeks, we're going to need confirmed results to encourage (or enforce, if needed) people to maintain isolation.

    If this becomes regular thing, it will decimate the population. I suspect you can beat it once, but not 3-4 times even if healthy when everything started.
    It could be quite bad, but we don't know the degree to which people develop imunity after being infected and recovering. We don't know how many strains there are, how fast they mutate, whether some will improve their "out of host" lifespan, etc.

    Screw the war on drugs, the war on inflation, etc. - we need a war on viruses! Finally, something I don't mind killing with extreme prejudice!

  13. #92
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    Default Open source low cost ventilator

    Quote Originally Posted by Milland View Post

    So this is a thread for ideas, leads, suggestions on outreach to labs and hospitals, etc. No, the vast majority of us aren't doctors, but we have skills and the ability to make stuff. Surely there's some way we can serve in this new (microbe) war.
    Hi Milland,
    Just wanted to share a few links and say hello to the community here.

    I just checked Wikipedia to learn more about ventilators and sure enough the main page has links for open source projects, for which interested parties can sign up.
    I have signed up to show interest in the opensourceventilator project and will report back if I can relay useful information.

    YouTube (working model being tested in Colombia)

    Open Source Ventilator
    Register Interest – Open Source Ventilator
    ------------------------
    I will also try to see if specific companies can be helped by our practical machinist community by Medical Device companies who are already building ventilators.
    1st pass I see:
    Ventec Life Systems (I emailed them to offer support and let them know about Practical Machinist as a community who can help)
    GM
    Dyson
    ------------------------
    Here is a link to some statistics on US Resource Availability for COVID-19 from Society of Critical Care Medicine dated 3/19/20
    Among other important items, they present actual numbers of ventilators, the shortage is something that we can hope to impact and change in a positive way
    Based on reading other comments in this thread, I see that this is just one step and could provide extra tools to health care workers.

    SCCM | United States Resource Availability for COVID-19
    A PDF with more info can be downloaded from this link

    Partial Text from the link:
    Mechanical ventilators: Reports from ICUs worldwide suggest that the most common reason for COVID-19 patient admission to the ICU is severe hypoxic respiratory failure requiring mechanical ventilation.

    Supply of mechanical ventilators in U.S. acute care hospitals: Based on a 2009 survey of AHA hospitals, U.S. acute care hospitals are estimated to own approximately 62,000 full-featured mechanical ventilators.10,11 Approximately 46% of these can be used to ventilate pediatric and neonatal patients. Additionally, some hospitals keep older models for emergency purposes. Older models, which are not full featured but may provide basic functions, add an additional 98,738 ventilators to the U.S. supply.10 The older devices include 22,976 noninvasive ventilators, 32,668 automatic resuscitators, and 8567 continuous positive airway pressure units.

    Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Strategic National Stockpile (SNS) and other ventilator sources: The SNS has an estimated 12,700 ventilators for emergency deployment, according to recent public announcements from National Institutes of Health officials.12 These devices are also not full featured but offer basic ventilatory modes. In simulation testing they performed very well despite long-term storage.13 Accessing the SNS requires hospital administrators to request that state health officials ask for access to this equipment. SNS can deliver ventilators within 24-36 hours of the federal decision to deploy them. States may have their own ventilator stockpiles as well.14 Respiratory therapy departments also rent ventilators from local companies to meet either baseline and/or seasonal demand, further expanding their supply. Additionally, many modern anesthesia machines are capable of ventilating patients and can be used to increase hospitals' surge capacity.

    The addition of older hospital ventilators, SNS ventilators, and anesthesia machines increases the absolute number of ventilators to possibly above 200,000 units nationally. Many of the additional and older ventilators, however, may not be capable of sustained use or of adequately supporting patients with severe acute respiratory failure. Also, supplies for these ventilators may be unavailable due to interruptions in the international supply chain. Alternatively, ventilator manufacturers could be encouraged to rapidly produce modern full-featured ventilators to allow experienced clinicians to use supplemental ventilators that are familiar to them and can be readily incorporated into the hospital ventilator fleet and informatics systems. An analysis of the literature suggests, however, that U.S. hospitals could absorb a maximum of 26,000 to 56,000 additional ventilators at the peak of a national pandemic, as safe use of ventilators requires trained personnel.15

    Estimates of hospitalized patients requiring critical care and mechanical ventilation: The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services estimated in 2005 that 865,000 U.S. residents would be hospitalized during a moderate pandemic (as in the 1957 and 1968 influenza pandemics) and 9.9 million during a severe pandemic (as in the 1918 influenza pandemic).16 A recent AHA webinar on COVID-19 projected that 30% (96 million) of the U.S. population will test positive, with 5% (4.8 million) being hospitalized. Of the hospitalized patients, 40% (1.9 million) would be admitted to the ICU, and 50% of the ICU admissions (960,000) would require ventilatory support.17 Such projections, however, are gross estimates. Some assumptions underlying these projections are uncertain, and the pacing of a large outbreak would influence whether ICU resources in isolated locations or nationally are severely taxed over many months or quickly overwhelmed over a shorter period. Additionally, COVID-19 patients may remain mechanically ventilated for indeterminate periods of time, with some developing prolonged or chronic critical illness requiring the extended use of ICU beds, ventilators, supplies, and trained clinicians.

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  15. #93
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    In case anyone wants to see what genuine statesmanship in time of crisis might look like, here is Angela Merkel addressing Germany (you could substitute “the World"). Straight talk, no BS, no crowd of gagging sycophants herded in behind her as a backdrop, no false hope, no self-congratulations, no blaming prior administrations or calling governors snakes and not reaching out to Kin Jon-un.

    YouTube

    Denis
    Last edited by dgfoster; 03-22-2020 at 12:15 PM. Reason: quotation mark missing

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  17. #94
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    It's a poor translation, unfortunately, but agreed, rare straight talk.

    And Germany is doing something right. Coronavirus Update (Live): 343,421 Cases and 14,777 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Outbreak - Worldometer

    Their ratio of total deaths to total cases is the lowest of any country with more than 10k cases.

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    Quote Originally Posted by neilho View Post
    Their ratio of total deaths to total cases is the lowest of any country with more than 10k cases.
    South Koreans coulda beat them if it wasn't for the wacko Christians

    oops, did I say that ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by EmanuelGoldstein View Post
    South Koreans coulda beat them if it wasn't for the wacko Christians

    oops, did I say that ?
    That's not fair, even to me as an atheist. It's like calling the Branch Davidians Christian, they were a personality cult using Christianity as a fig leaf. Same-same in SK.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dgfoster View Post
    In case anyone wants to see what genuine statesmanship in time of crisis might look like, here is Angela Merkel addressing Germany (you could substitute “the World"). Straight talk, no BS, no crowd of gagging sycophants herded in behind her as a backdrop, no false hope, no self-congratulations, no blaming prior administrations or calling governors snakes and not reaching out to Kin Jon-un.

    YouTube

    Denis
    Another leaders news conference to watch was yesterday. Governor Cuomo of New York. Huge contrast to what comes out of Washington.
    Do a google search for sociopath and it will help you understand why you are hearing so much BS from Washington. That should scare you. Seriously, I listen to Dr Fauci and turn it off.
    Back to the subject. Interesting to hear that CPAP machines are of some help. I got sick in mid December and it made a huge difference to me. I normally take my mask off around 4:00 am and go back to sleep. I did and just could not breath and had to keep it on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiganbuck View Post
    I'm surprised nobody mentions washing money.. likely the biggest source of trading germs.
    Wouldn't that be "money laundering"?

    Seriously, I suspect that if you wanted to kill a virus on something like money, you could put it in the microwave with a cup of water and run it.

    The water is there to give the microwave something to act on, not to create steam, otherwise the microwave would burn out like you were running it empty.

    Steve

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    Since our leader says a few old people's deaths are acceptable to get the economy going, ask if he would lead the way.

    A little more seriously, now that we have things rearranged and are keeping a lot of businesses running, why stop now? Can he spell "exponential"? He sure as hell will find out if we go back to business as usual before we get the virus knocked down.

    Bill

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  24. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter from Holland View Post
    Says who???
    says i

    as of today the netherlands have 25 death per million.
    france 26,iran 27, spain 89 and italy 136.
    so rank number 5 in the world.
    germany has 3 death per million.

    clear enough?


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