Thread: Ammo...........non existent like fairy dust........

Originally Posted by Kurt Learning

I simply cannot accept that the market is not artificially manipulated. Even the toilet paper shortage has come into alignment in a very short time.
If Walmart had lines of customers winding around the block wanting Beanie Babies, Walmart would place one call to China and the problem would be fixed in short order.
Part of the problem is that we have fewer manufacturers.
I don't care how busy the manufacturers are, if there are not enough of them, they will never meet demand.
In a free market, there would be new start-ups daily.
I can only imagine, like so many other markets, it isn't free.

It's all a conspiracy.......



--
Pat Jones
Firestone CO

Originally Posted by pat_j0nes

It's all a conspiracy.......



--
Pat Jones
Firestone CO

Your simian response is irrefutable.

The TP shortage came into alignment quickly because the online sales sites blocked scalpers from selling TP at 10x normal price.....so far ,online sites have not blocked the sale of ammo and components at 10x normal price.As long as people are paying $1.00 a round for 22 rf,and others have access to contract deliveries that can be diverted to the lucrative scalper market,the shortage will continue ,and as the scalpers become very rich ,they may even further restrict supplies to push prices further...Josef Stalin saw this occur in the wheat market,and instituted a cure.

Originally Posted by john.k

The TP shortage came into alignment quickly because the online sales sites blocked scalpers from selling TP at 10x normal price.....so far ,online sites have not blocked the sale of ammo and components at 10x normal price.As long as people are paying $1.00 a round for 22 rf,and others have access to contract deliveries that can be diverted to the lucrative scalper market,the shortage will continue ,and as the scalpers become very rich ,they may even further restrict supplies to push prices further...Josef Stalin saw this occur in the wheat market,and instituted a cure.

I'm not sure I understand the meaning of your Stalin reference.
Is this what you are talking about?

https://youtu.be/vlozEkKU2bI

People stocking up to have a good reserve for when the ace is dropped on private citizens owning guns.

Government Bozos know that you cant control the working class when they have guns.

Yes, there are some good guys/gals government who love hunting and gun sports...likely fake news will eat them up, or they will have to go along to get votes..darn.

Originally Posted by Kurt Learning

"The shortage of small arms ammunition is certainly not going to be addressed by "new start ups daily"".
Why not?
It is done in every other industry.

"Ammo manufacturing ain't as simple as sourcing a stuffed toy."
Uhm… Yes it is. It has been going on for more than 170 years just for .22 ammo alone.
If it were a I-phone in question, concept to delivery would be 6 months.

"Considering the new administration has made promises regarding firearm safety legislation"
The new administration has made no promises regarding firearm safety legislation, his promises were on controls and confiscation.

Kurt....You better slow down on the Brandy Old Fashioneds....With Tony Evers you would be lucky to make it through the permit process in 6 years much less 6 months.

What 'ya figure the lead time is for the specialized machines? 6 months?????? LMAO

Three 50 round boxes - old ammo- $45 a box, who would have thought.

Originally Posted by Kurt Learning

"The shortage of small arms ammunition is certainly not going to be addressed by "new start ups daily"".
Why not?
It is done in every other industry.

"Ammo manufacturing ain't as simple as sourcing a stuffed toy."
Uhm… Yes it is. It has been going on for more than 170 years just for .22 ammo alone.
If it were a I-phone in question, concept to delivery would be 6 months.

"Considering the new administration has made promises regarding firearm safety legislation"
The new administration has made no promises regarding firearm safety legislation, his promises were on controls and confiscation.

You sound like someone who has little idea what it takes to get a company up and going and making ammunition.

In the last 15 years, I've seen lots of ammo startups. Some began with a guy making ammo in his shed, on the side, selling as training/competition ammo for cheap. Starting with commercial reloading equipment, then once a name was established, bit the bullet (ha ha...) and went in on some very beginner automated equipment. Some of them eventually become a small time little guy in the business, but now qualify as being "commercial ammo" and not just "this guy's hand loads".

Some of them have boxed ammo in stores, now, even, in local gun shops as well as box stores like Academy Sports.

This isn't something you just take a wing at overnight. People with the capital to do it 'overnight' also aren't going to drop the coin on a big enterprise after seeing how volatile the market is.

This isn't just a matter of buying a few HAAS machines and hanging a shingle.

I haven't even talked about licensing, either, just the practical manufacturing.

[QUOTE=JNieman;3713797]You sound like someone who has little idea what it takes to get a company up and going and making ammunition.

QUOTE]

I do. And it shouldn't take more than 5 or 10 years.

The whole ammo shortage is pretty tough if you are looking. I have built up quite a stash, when shopping at Walmart I used to grab a box every week or two. 9mm, 40 S&W, cartons of 22LR, 12 and 20 gauge buck and slugs. Even 223, 308, 270, 300WSM, 7mm Mauser, 357, 44mag, and even 480 Ruger when I could find it. I did the same thing with reloading supplies, primers powder and bullets when I was where they were available. I got to the point where I thought I have so much I am going to have to break this bad habit. LOL, I never thought we would see this type of shortage again. Remember when Obama was coming into office we had the same shortages. The Obama admin's did place a huge order for ammo for the military, and shut down the last lead smelter (Doe Run) operating in the US. Now in the US we only recycle lead, or import lead. WE do not produce lead from ore anymore. Anyway the huge order for ammo, and shutting down the Doe Run smelter was intended to interrupt ammunition production for the public. It did succeed in doubling the price of car batteries too.

The thing to think about with everything from toilet paper to ammo is: What ever amount the public consumes on a regular basis is what the industry sets up to manufacture. To setup additional manufacturing facility's that would just go idle when demand goes back to normal just wont happen. It would be a bad business decision. Setting up ammunition production is very expensive, that prevents additional manufacturing from being setup, because it would just be temporary. That and bear in mind that Remington Ammunition filed bankruptcy and closed its doors recently, that tightens the supply to meet the demand. Vista outdoors acquired Remington outdoors and ammunition assets in October 2020, I don't know when they will be in production again, Obviously reappearing with the name Remington on the ammo boxes will happen, most people wont even realize there was a change of ownership. Happening right in the middle of the shortage, makes the shortage worse. The fact that Remington ammo went belly up will be hidden to whatever degree they can, that way people will readily gobble up those green boxes of ammo when they see it again. People questioning whether the new Remington ammo is just like the legendary stuff, might lower demand/profit. Now I did see two boxes of .357 Sig ammo in the otherwise empty ammo case at Walmart a few days ago. I was looking at my ammo stash a few days ago, and I still have boxes of Sellier & Bellot 9mm price marked at $5.95 per box, this was from the pre Obama era Buying ammo has evolved a lot in the last 15 years.

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 Vista outdoors acquired Remington outdoors and ammunition assets in October 2020, I don't know when they will be in production again, Obviously reappearing with the name Remington on the ammo boxes will happen, most people wont even realize there was a change of ownership.

It shouldn't be to much longer they had a segment on the local news about reopening the Lonoke plant. Trying to get the employees that had been laid off to come back. As long as people are willing to pay the inflated prices the shortage will continue. It took almost 3yrs after Sandy Hook before you could find reasonable priced box of 22lr or almost anything else. A 500rd case of Federal 9mm was 99 dollars in Feb 2020 its right at 400 dollars now if you can find it.

Amen that Brother , I keep a lot for times like this plus reload if the need arises, however right now I haven't been shooting much because dont know when if ever I can replenish. The next 4 years will be like this until Xiden is out , that is if we ever see another fair election after the recent crimes against "We The People"

Our woke Walmart has discontinued, rifle and ammo sales total!

I would buy on the net but don't want the net to know I have guns.

Likely when they take our guns having ammo won't be much use...

There is nothing said about ammunition in the 2nd Amendment.

Originally Posted by oakme2

That and bear in mind that Remington Ammunition filed bankruptcy and closed its doors recently, that tightens the supply to meet the demand. Vista outdoors acquired Remington outdoors and ammunition assets in October 2020, I don't know when they will be in production again,

Just bought 500 rds ($40) of Remington Thunderbolt 22LR from Turners this last week. They had 1400rd buckets ($120) as well. Didn't get the 1400rd bucket as I was short on cash, and by all accounts the Thunderbolt 22LR isn't very good ammo.

Still no primers but IMI 5.56 is available again and priced at $.79/round in case lots..
Of course I haven't had the time to get to the range so it doesn't really matter.

Originally Posted by michiganbuck

Brainwashing is so effective that when we gun owners are made a low percentage, the never have touched a gun people will vote us right out of our guns.

Writing this will probably hurt my social credit score but, that's what happened last year in Canada. Through Order in Council(aka dictatorship) under the guise of an "assault weapons ban" Our far left Minstrel Trudeau government banned anything that looks like an AR, lots of semi-auto's like Mini-14's, everything .50cal bmg or variant, anything that "could" make over 10,000 joules of energy which banned a lot of the big safari/collector rifles, anything over 20mm bore, which even banned certain older 12 gauges shotguns. List has about 1500 models on it. Next on their list is handguns, airsoft and paintball... and everything else after that.
Sadly its not just those who never touched a gun, even most hunters(98% of which are clueless about guns) don't care at all and think the gov is making us safer and rest of the sheep here are even happier (They'd probably complain if someone was holding up the line to get on the train) The media propaganda is working amazingly well and in many ways... and nobody cares about the Canadian manufacturers and dealers losing money or going out of business.

I hope this shit doesn't happen to the USA but you can bet they'll try damn hard to take you down with the rest of us. This isn't about public safety, this is all about the government, the far left government, having all the power so they can steal and do anything they want and nobody being able to do or say a damn thing about it, stay in your place peasants! You'll have nothing and you'll be happy!


As to ammo, I mostly reload for TR/FTR(not banned yet...) and reloading components like primers and powder are pretty much all out of stock everywhere and most don't know if/when they'll get more. Thankfully I have enough to get through this year, and could switch to F-open and use other stuff I have if I can't shoot 308 next year. For .22lr there's still some Lapua/Eley stuff around which is what I mostly use, but regular garbage plinker .22lr is either all sold or almost as much $ as match .22lr ammo.

Couldn't tell you what/actual quantities, but the owner here last week bought something like 10 cases of ammo. I assume different types as the boxes were different sizes and shapes...

Originally Posted by Kurt Learning

Your simian response is irrefutable.

Outstanding! Thanks for posting. I grabbed a copy of that graphic to share with friends.

God makes people
Government and media make sheeple