A bit OT, but I went to an "Old military rifle" shoot today
Close
Login to Your Account
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 29
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Vt USA
    Posts
    6,796
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    745
    Likes (Received)
    2356

    Default A bit OT, but I went to an "Old military rifle" shoot today

    A small gathering of 12 folks, but there must have been 40 arms in the racks.

    Some over 100 years old. 1900 the oldest stamped date.

    Metal work has been well refined for quite some number of years.

    The fit and finish on nearly all the rifles presented were inspiring!

  2. Likes MetalCarnage, 9100, UncleFrank, Pete Deal liked this post
  3. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    NH
    Posts
    1,137
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    90

    Default

    Where are the pictures?

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Country
    CANADA
    State/Province
    British Columbia
    Posts
    1,191
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    263
    Likes (Received)
    620

    Default

    I have quite a number of old military rifles. Among my favourites - for shooting and as far as quality - are the 1896 Swedish Mauser and the 1891 Argentine Mauser. The Canadian 1905 Ross is also a nicely made and accurate rifle.

  5. Likes partsproduction liked this post
  6. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Geneva Illinois USA
    Posts
    6,214
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    2666
    Likes (Received)
    2411

    Default

    Are the modern powders the same as used in these older weapons or do you need to have special powders/cartridges?

    Tom

  7. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Vt USA
    Posts
    6,796
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    745
    Likes (Received)
    2356

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TDegenhart View Post
    Are the modern powders the same as used in these older weapons or do you need to have special powders/cartridges?

    Tom
    The powder makers have a modern powder and a suggested load for just about every cartridge that has ever been popular.

    Everyone was shooting hand loads and cast boolits. Some loads were pretty soft. Adds to the interest. Less kick isn't bad either. It doesn't take a lot to punch a hole in paper board. ;-)

  8. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Brusly, LA
    Posts
    743
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    21
    Likes (Received)
    298

    Default

    we host a Pearl Harbor Memorial match every December at our range. Its an 80 shot XTC Highpower match and to be in contention to win you must shoot a rifle in Use by the US during WW2, but any rifle of that period can shoot. Mostly a lot of Garands, but a few 03's and 03a3's, couple of swiss K31's and Swede Mausers but the running joke with those is if you bring one of those to the match you can only approach the firing line and dry fire, since they were neutral countries.
    That and the Games matches at Perry are my favorite matches to shoot.

  9. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    New York
    Posts
    6
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    3
    Likes (Received)
    1

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TDegenhart View Post
    Are the modern powders the same as used in these older weapons or do you need to have special powders/cartridges?

    Tom

    There are older formulas still in use and plenty of modern powders of similar burn rates.

    The practice of selecting powder is choosing a good and appropriate powder burn rate for the job at hand.

    Generally there are fast rifle powders normally used in small cases in small charge weights. Medium burn rate powders used from small to mid to rather large cases. I really like 4895 it is one of these and is a golden oldie. Slower powders can be used from mid size cases to large magnum cases. Imr4350 is one. Get bigger like .50 bmg and you go to a different burn rate not normally used elsewhere.

    Change to a reallly light bullet for case or really heavy bullet and you likely can or should change to a different burn rate.


    ETA it stinks when they stop making an old powder formula. I hear that environmental regs and the waste by products are pushing older powders out for newer formulas. More so in Europe.

    They dropped the SR series of powders I liked for cast bullets in antique guns. Forces the user to redo all the load work up.

  10. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Illinois
    Posts
    430
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    144
    Likes (Received)
    245

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CalG View Post
    A small gathering of 12 folks, but there must have been 40 arms in the racks.

    Some over 100 years old. 1900 the oldest stamped date.

    Metal work has been well refined for quite some number of years.

    The fit and finish on nearly all the rifles presented were inspiring!
    I guess my 1942 Soviet Mosin Nagant wouldn't have fit in well.

  11. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    ventura,ca.usa
    Posts
    370
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    62

    Default

    We have similar matches out here in the peoples republik, 03's and swedes predominate but you will see model 91 mosin's and british enfields on occasion. The finnish mosins can be surprisingly accurate. The oldest swede I have dates to 1904, the metalwork still looks new.

  12. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Vt USA
    Posts
    6,796
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    745
    Likes (Received)
    2356

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kenton View Post
    I guess my 1942 Soviet Mosin Nagant wouldn't have fit in well.
    I brought a '57 SKS. Five digit serial number.
    I felt out of place as far as equipment goes (no one cares what you bring , just come shoot!)

    I was up as first auto loader after several nice bolt guns. I shot my round "rapidly", and then put the "young 'un". in the rack until we all left. It didn't look too out of place next to all the carbines, ;-)

  13. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Oregon
    Posts
    2,552
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    584
    Likes (Received)
    779

    Default

    I also have a Swede, a Karl Gustav 1896. It's in very good condition and I've yet to shoot it. I bought 100 once fired empties and primers, powder and bullets, plus a die set.
    It's amazing how nicely done the fit and finish is, and with old flat belt machinery. The story goes that the first 1896's were made by Mauser, but the Swedes insisted on them using Swedish steel. I wonder how much of that was patriotic pride and how much was metallurgical knowledge.

  14. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    ventura,ca.usa
    Posts
    370
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    62

    Default

    Weren't the swedes known for having good steel? Not just from a firearms stand point but in general. Side note to partsproduction, swedes like slower powders like H4831, and 142 grain projectiles, but powder like XMR4064 works well also. Jim

  15. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Oregon
    Posts
    2,552
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    584
    Likes (Received)
    779

    Default

    Weren't the swedes known for having good steel?
    That's what I've read, but I was thinking it may also play into the "Not made here" syndrome, ie. patriotism.

    Whats so special about Swedish steel? | Badger & Blade

  16. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Country
    CANADA
    State/Province
    British Columbia
    Posts
    1,191
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    263
    Likes (Received)
    620

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by partsproduction View Post
    I also have a Swede, a Karl Gustav 1896. It's in very good condition and I've yet to shoot it. I bought 100 once fired empties and primers, powder and bullets, plus a die set.
    It's amazing how nicely done the fit and finish is, and with old flat belt machinery. The story goes that the first 1896's were made by Mauser, but the Swedes insisted on them using Swedish steel. I wonder how much of that was patriotic pride and how much was metallurgical knowledge.
    Both the Karl Gustav and the Husqvarna are nice, quality rifles. The 6.5x55 is a popular calibre in Europe and many factory loads are available. I like the Norma Nosler 140 Grain, works well in the military rifles. I have four, including two I've customized.

    swedish-mauser-1.jpg swedish-mauser-2.jpg

  17. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Oregon
    Posts
    2,552
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    584
    Likes (Received)
    779

    Default

    swedes like slower powders like H4831, and 142 grain projectiles, but powder like XMR4064 works well also. Jim
    I confess I've never loaded a single rifle round, all pistol, 80% 45ACP.

    I asked a gun store guy known for his long range shooting what to use with the Swede and he sold me 4350 and H4831SC, also Berger 140 grn Elite Hunter.

    I have four, including two I've customized.
    What scope is that? Is the 6.5X55 good for longer ranges?

  18. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Country
    CANADA
    State/Province
    British Columbia
    Posts
    1,191
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    263
    Likes (Received)
    620

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by partsproduction View Post
    What scope is that? Is the 6.5X55 good for longer ranges?
    4-16X50, mostly used at 8-10X. I use this setup for 300 meters (the limit of a range here).

  19. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    ventura,ca.usa
    Posts
    370
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    1
    Likes (Received)
    62

    Default

    nice work on that swede Bill, is that stock maple? (I am partial to military stocked swede's but I certainly appreciate beautiful work...) The 6.5 x 55 works very well at longer ranges. I have a Remington model 700 that I shoot at 600 yards with great effect,(well,sometimes with great effect...)jim
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails img_1120.jpg   img_0319.jpg  

  20. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Vt USA
    Posts
    6,796
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    745
    Likes (Received)
    2356

    Default

    You know you can't do that with iron sights on "old military" rifles.

    So why?

    I can poke pencil hole in a sheet of paper and wow the crowd as much as any one can.

    Not the POINT!

    My pencil is sharper than yours!

  21. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Oregon
    Posts
    2,552
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    584
    Likes (Received)
    779

    Default

    A friend who likes long range shooting explained to me tonight that my 140 grain boat tail bullets will probably not stabilize because the military rifles typically had a slower twist than today's rifles. So back to the store for a shorter bullet, but it looks like the boat tail has to go. Something about Ballistic Coefficient, which sounds to me like sectional area.
    He shoots a 6.5 Creedmore and is embarrassed to tell me the size of his groups, as he despises pride.

  22. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Arizona
    Posts
    2,217
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    4
    Likes (Received)
    348

    Default

    Before you give up on your bullets, I would measure the twist of your barrel. The Swedes knew what they were doing and I would be highly surprised if the twist is inadequate for any commonly made bullet. My Lyman 47th shows the twist of their test rifles, a Swedish Military Carbine and a Husqvarna Bolt Action, as 1 in 7.5". Berger data for 140 gr bullets in 6.5 Creedmoor says 1 in 8" or faster; same thing for 6.5 x 55 Swedish.


Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •