Carding Rust Bluing

tbonesmith · Jan 7, 2014

Hi Guys,

I rust blue rifles when I need to refinish them, or I rebarrel them. I have a bench grinder that I sometimes use with a fine wire wheel for carding, but it runs far too fast, so for the most part I card off with fine wire brushes by hand and fine steel wool. I tried it once running the carding wheel in the drill press at about 500RPMs and that was great. If I could get that speed off a grinder/polisher that would be ideal

I saw once a guy with a belt running off his grinder to another shaft that was turning the wire wheel to reduce the speed, and I had thought of rigging something to spin it on the lathe, but there's a big penalty for getting hung up with that.

Has anyone got any pictures of how they get enough reduction in speed to run these carding brushes. I'm not unhappy with my results, but I want to save some time.

Cheers

ButchC · Jan 7, 2014

I used an old 1/3 HP 1100 RPM motor and an extended arbor shaft made in the shop. Now a days you can pick up a small VFD on fleabay for pocket change, probably how I would go.

How are you doing your rusting? I used a product by Pilkington for quite a while but not long before I retired I was using a fume cabinet and sulfuric with great results.

CalebWelte · Jan 7, 2014

get one of these: Craftsman Bench 6" Grinder
or Grizzly.com

Claude Wright · Jan 7, 2014

I use a old electric motor that is about 300 rpm
As Butch said, I made a arbor in shop , runs on pillar bearings
With a loose belt
Use a soft wire wheel bought from Mark Lee
Will post picture/video when I get to shop later.

RWO · Jan 7, 2014

A VFD requires a 3-phase motor.

RWO

ahall · Jan 8, 2014

RWO said:
A VFD requires a 3-phase motor.

RWO

True and the slower you go, the less cooling the motor gets if its fan cooled.
Like anything, VFD's have limitations.

Reduced speed with a belt system and proper guards is a good way to go.

VFD's work if you happen to have a 3 phase motor, and the fractional HP ones are almost give aways on the second hand market, but your talking about speeds so far below name plate, it may have performance problems. Do some reasurch before going in whole hog on that idea.

An upper end home owner tread mill drive may be a good choice. Variable speed and designed for single phase, 110 V

ButchC · Jan 9, 2014

Apologies for the inaccurate info on the VFD, I am running three of them but of course all on 3 Phase motors. When I first experimented with the process the carding brush was either chucked in the drill press or I would vise the part and chuck the brush in a variable speed rill. Truthfully I found carding to be a very forgiving, non-technical process as long as the correct brush was used.

tbonesmith · Jan 10, 2014

ButchC said:
I used an old 1/3 HP 1100 RPM motor and an extended arbor shaft made in the shop. Now a days you can pick up a small VFD on fleabay for pocket change, probably how I would go.

How are you doing your rusting? I used a product by Pilkington for quite a while but not long before I retired I was using a fume cabinet and sulfuric with great results.

I'm just using a solution like Pilkinton, but made by a colleague of mine, I steam the parts after a day and then card, and repeat. I guess I'll just keep an eye out for some suitable bearings and a motor.

Froneck · Jan 10, 2014

A VFD is not for single phase motors however there might be someone making one. Most 3 phase VFD controls will power a 3 phase motor and use single phase input especially the low HP ones. Getting a 3 phase grinder and connecting a VFD wired to Single phase will work! Probably the most expensive way but it will work and you will get a wide speed range. Check with the guys in the Transformers, Phase Converters and VFD forum. Quite a few there that know VFD controls very well!
I had an older Craftsman, Dunlap if I recall correctly, of the type with a pulley driven by a belt from a motor mounted near-by. I had mine mounted on a wooden bench top, cut a hole in the table and mounted the motor below so that the weight of the motor provided tension on the belt. The Spindle had one size pulley but I mounted a 5 Vee cone pulley on the motor. The motor was attached to a 3/4" pipe that was thru eye bolts to support the motor. It was easy to lift the motor and side it to what ever pulley diameter on the motor to align the belt. I therefore had a poor mans variable speed. Worked great!

Frank

gzig5 · Jan 13, 2014

Carding a barrel seems pretty straight forward, but what is the method for all the nooks and crannies, including the bolt bore on a receiver? I'm guessing de-oiled steel wool? Seems like it would be extremely difficult to not overwork the edges.

JBCGUNS · Jan 13, 2014

Brownells make little wooden handled carding brushes that are cheap and work a treat. They kind of look like a tooth brush.
As for Rpm of bench grinder, my 1100rpm bench grinder with modified arbor is no problem as long as I watch what I'm doing.

tbonesmith · Jan 13, 2014

What model runs at 1100 RPM's? Mine is going about 3000(Abbott and Ashby 8").

JBCGUNS · Jan 13, 2014

tbonesmith said:
What model runs at 1100 RPM's? Mine is going about 3000(Abbott and Ashby 8").

Solly, solly, solly......I read 1100RPM in a post below and typed it in mine. It's more like 2400RPM.
Don't even know the brand because it's that old and the plates are worn.

gzig5 · Jan 13, 2014

JBCGUNS said:
Brownells make little wooden handled carding brushes that are cheap and work a treat. They kind of look like a tooth brush.
As for Rpm of bench grinder, my 1100rpm bench grinder with modified arbor is no problem as long as I watch what I'm doing.

Thanks, had heard of the grinder mounted ones, but not soft brushes on a handle.
BTW...several of the reviews of the Brownell's 6" carding wheel mention mounting it in a drill press spindle. Should be easy to go as slow or fast as needed that way and plenty of room to maneuver.

Claude Wright · Jan 14, 2014

gzig5 said:
Carding a barrel seems pretty straight forward, but what is the method for all the nooks and crannies, including the bolt bore on a receiver? I'm guessing de-oiled steel wool? Seems like it would be extremely difficult to not overwork the edges.

I use degreased steel wool wrapped on a stick for a brush or just a piece of steel wool

ndh78 · Jan 15, 2014

gzig5 said:
Thanks, had heard of the grinder mounted ones, but not soft brushes on a handle.
BTW...several of the reviews of the Brownell's 6" carding wheel mention mounting it in a drill press spindle. Should be easy to go as slow or fast as needed that way and plenty of room to maneuver.

Carding barrels is actually easier in a drill press because you can run the entire length back an forth with a better view and not be stooped over. Hopefully everyone here cards barrels lengthwise.....

MDH · Jan 18, 2014

No need for VFDs, a very simple and cheap pillow block /pulley arrangement will work fine. A smaller pulley on the motor shaft, a larger pulley on the pillow block shaft and you have reduced the pillow block shaft speed. Some simple math and you can get any speed you want.

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