Garand spring failure

OK, here’s a strange one. My buddy bought an M1 Garand for a “really good price”. Pictured are pieces of the operating rod spring that fell out when he was taking it apart for inspection (after he got home). He did cycle the action and said it seemed normal. For those new to this, it is supposed to be a single 19” long spring. The pieces show are only about 13” so he still has some stuck in the op rod to fish out. The seller said he got it directly from the Civilian Marksmanship Program (obvious lie) and did fire it (possible lie). We carefully checked the back of the receiver and it shows no sign of damage.

I know a fair bit about Garands and I’ve never heard of something like this. So, are the Chinese making op rod springs out of rebar and selling them in the US? What might cause such a failure?

Steve

Perfectly normal on older CMP rebuild guns, chemical used in hot dip cleaning process made spring brittle over time, Springs are either stripped out beforehand or different chemical is used now. I'm sure still some floating around as replacements also, best to just buy new replacement and it'll be fine, might not be bad to check and/or replace hammer spring also. I had one with spring in 3 pieces, cycled perfectly fine,. at least for the 8rnds I put through it.

That is normal for the old springs. They could be as much as 80 years old with various levels of care and abuse. Buy a good set of springs, hammer and action and have fun shooting the rifle. Remember to use rifle grease not oil on all the moving parts.

I learn something new every damned day!!! Seems odd that the CMP would use a chemical that would cause embrittlement but very possible they just didn't know that at the time. Guess that was back when everyone thought asbestos was the greatest find ever.

Will pass the word to my buddy to replace the other springs as well. Will check the springs in the several that I have. I've built two Garands from parts kits and have shot my nicest one at Camp Perry so I know my way around these.

Thanks.
Steve

I got one some years back that had broken spring in it but only in half got hold of DCM at the time and they sent me a new one. As they had just shipped the rifle to me.

Hydrogen embrittlement from plating and I suppose cleaning can be relieved by putting a part in the oven for an hour or 2 at 300F.

Somehow I don't think that any amount of heating will help my buddy's spring.

As a followup I joined the CMP web site and searched the old threads. It does seem that the CMP does not check the springs before shipping and getting a bad one does happen from time to time. So I retract my statement about the ethics of the guy who sold my buddy the rifle although every one I gotten from the CMP the first thing I did was completely strip it down.

Think I'll rig up a spring gauge and check all the springs I've got just to be safe.

Steve

The best thing to do is order a set of springs from Wolff Gunsprings for each Garand you have. New springs will work better and protect the action.

I doubt that the CMP cleaning was the cause of the broken spring. Some time back, acid was used for cleaning metallic things and that is usually where the hydrogen came from. Probably during a military overhaul.

There are a number of spring makers; my replacement springs are Orion. If you get Wolfe springs, get the standard strength ones, not the extra power ones.

Put up your spring gauge, the way to check those springs is length.
Put a new spring on a table, then take one out of s serviceable functioning rifle and put it next to it, they compress over time.
Roland beaver and other old garand mechanics said to replace springs every year of highpower season but I don’t know anyone still shooting these things xtc all season. Plus they were shooting things like the old 180gr long range load that pretty much ruined the brass. I’d say just replace them every 2-3000 rds or if it starts to act up .

akajun said:

Put up your spring gauge, the way to check those springs is length. .......

Click to expand...

Right, so you just use a tape measure to make sure the free length is between 19 1/2" and 20 1/4". Per the service manual that is only one check, the other being compressed strength. At least that is the position of the people at Springfield Armory who designed the rifle and know far more about rifle springs than you or I.

Also why I don't use Wolff springs as they also know less than the Springfield Armory engineers but I guess they figured that enough people believe that "extra power springs" must be better.

Steve

Why the hostility, I’m just trying to help you out. Btw , I build my own garands for cmp competition and have placed second one year at Perry in the as issued match with a gun I built. Ive bought sold and evaluated more garands than I can count, not as a Collecter but as shooters. I started shooting highpower in the 90’s with a 30 cal and there were still people using garands , way before the black gun ruled the roost.
I’m just telling you what was told to me by armorers who were actually trained to accurize garands that you should replace the recoil springs often. I never saw a spring gauge in use but did see a few measuring tapes. So go with what the book says, or go with what years of NM experience . I have the Kuhn Hayden manuals and copies of old usgi nm manuals, I know what they say. and what’s wrong with wolf springs? I mean I usually just find NOS usgi springs at Perry or gunnshows but I wouldn’t have a problem putting one in a gun and shooting it. If it causes problems just find usgi. Extra power might not be so bad if your shooting the old navy 180 gr loaf. Don’t be so hostile, we’re all friends here, just trying to save you time and money.

SteveF said:

Right, so you just use a tape measure to make sure the free length is between 19 1/2" and 20 1/4". Per the service manual that is only one check, the other being compressed strength. At least that is the position of the people at Springfield Armory who designed the rifle and know far more about rifle springs than you or I.

Also why I don't use Wolff springs as they also know less than the Springfield Armory engineers but I guess they figured that enough people believe that "extra power springs" must be better.

Steve

Click to expand...

For what its worth, I found out about the cleaning issue with springs as part of CMP advanced maintenance class 2017, does not really matter what is causing it, it happens, so put new spring in. Do not remember any mention of how often to change operating spring.

The armorer instructions give a maximum length and a minimum length. Springs should be straight, free of bends and kinks, no worn flat spots and measure 19 - 20 1/4 inches long

Shouldn’t be much of an argument. The spring is broken. It needs replacement.

The extra power springs are not needed and a problem in themselves. In the garand design You have a free floating firing pin, extra speed and force on closing is not desirable. Unwanted discharge is a possibility and the odds increase with speed and force.

Standard force springs. My favorite is the stainless steel ones from Orion7 on Long Island. Buy a complete spring set while you’re at it. The guns are old, the springs are old. The clip latch spring and the ejector spring are two other common failure causes. The hammer spring being weak is just a nicer trigger pull.

ETA- I have had about a dozen or more rifles from CMP. Most need a thorough going over. I have had one three piece op rod spring like the OP, several worn short, most have a kink from being on the follower rod so long. Ejector and extractor springs are often short/weak. Bad springs cause all manner of frustrating stoppages. A fresh spring set usually fixes a lot of maladies; bad timing, weak extraction, weak ejection causing expended cases to get trapped.

George, I recognize from other boards is quoting the manual. If you want THE shop manual look up Jerry Kuhnhausen’s books. His .30 caliber gas operated rifles covering the M1 and M14 are outstanding gunsmithing manuals for the rifles.

SteelonSteel said:

{ clip} If you want THE shop manual look up Jerry Kuhnhausen’s books. His .30 caliber gas operated rifles covering the M1 and M14 are outstanding gunsmithing manuals for the rifles.

Click to expand...

I just swung by a fellow shooter's place this noon and picked up his copy of that book. I've only just opened it, but it does look good. There were two other books from the same author along with. Should take care of some reading needs over the winter. (All three on loan only)