Thread: Guns to scare off grizzleys

Originally Posted by Kurt Learning

Isn't this akin to a thread "things to say to ward off IRS agents?"
You shouldn't count on scaring them.

They are just folks with a shittier than average job. Usta bump into the Head of the IRS at School PTA meetings, kids the same age, lived nearby. No more hooves, horns, nor fangs than our kids had. Parents were "normal" as well.

Years earlier, just back from 'nam I was actually looking at a "B" in an Accounting 101 course. This ain't right!

Hooked-up with a really cute IRS newbie Auditor. She sorted me out on the concept of Tee Accounts. Never missed an "A" again.

Debits to the window, credits to the wall, do it again faster and deeper, then do the rollups, same way! Some things yah won't ever again forget, willyah?

Bears, on the other hand...?

What d'yah suppose the chances are yah can get Miz Bear to AT LEAST go in for a Bikini Wax?

??

Here's a thought;

Extract;
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Karelian Bear Dogs have been used for bear control at Yosemite and Glacier national parks, and with the Washington State Department of Fish and Wildlife.[3] Karelian Bear Dogs were introduced in 2004 in Karuizawa, Japan, a popular resort town 170 km northwest of Tokyo, where they reduced the number of bear incidents from 255 in 2006 to four in 2017.
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Rest of the article if you care enough:

Karelian Bear Dog - Wikipedia

It is clear the dog doesn't pounce on the bear and break its neck. They are agile enough, smart enough, and fearless enough to have clocked great success at HARASSING the piss out of the Bear so seriously as to put even the most competent of bears right TF off their game without gettin nailed for their impudence.

Bears already having wired-in caution as to Wolves as "pack" troublers, the stats indicate it works rather well with just a pair of "Björnhund" tag-teaming B'rer Bear's priority to flight rather than fight, and stressed - VERY! - that it isn't going according to Bear's plan "A" OR plan "B", even so.

As with hired-help in general, there are overheads... coupla Finns in winter-camo patiently dragging up a sledge- mounted 20 mm Lahti "sniper rifle" to take out the Bear .. or a Soviet tank commander - at half a mile - prolly no longer on the menu?

Originally Posted by thermite

They are just folks with a shittier than average job. Usta bump into the Head of the IRS at School PTA meetings, kids the same age, lived nearby. No more hooves, horns, nor fangs than our kids had. Parents were "normal" as well.

Years earlier, just back from 'nam I was actually looking at a "B" in an Accounting 101 course. This ain't right!

Hooked-up with a really cute IRS newbie Auditor. She sorted me out on the concept of Tee Accounts. Never missed an "A" again.

Debits to the window, credits to the wall, do it again faster and deeper, then do the rollups, same way! Some things yah won't ever again forget, willyah?

Bears, on the other hand...?

What d'yah suppose the chances are yah can get Miz Bear to AT LEAST go in for a Bikini Wax?

??

And bears are just another mammal that lives in the woods.
But under the right circumstances, they take control and can ruin your life.

Originally Posted by thermite

Here's a thought;
Extract;
=====================================
Karelian Bear Dogs have been used for bear control at Yosemite and Glacier national parks, and with the Washington State Department of Fish and Wildlife.[3] Karelian Bear Dogs were introduced in 2004 in Karuizawa, Japan, a popular resort town 170 km northwest of Tokyo, where they reduced the number of bear incidents from 255 in 2006 to four in 2017.
=====================================

Once again proof that a good dog is better to have with you than than a gun in the wild or in the city.
Wife liked to go grocery shopping late as in past midnight in parts of Flint.
She wanted to get a CCW seeing many shady types in the parking lot or somewhat following her in the store.
Could not talk her out of shopping late so I said "Take the dog".
Oversized Samoyed and a mini-van with a remote door opener.
Walk out, push the button and what looks like a huge white wolf comes running across the parking lot to escort you.

No grizzly here and this breed the most nice dog with people and small children you can have but camping wilds up north, a black bear foraging and she was all over go away.
"This is our ground". The first time I thought she would get killed for sure. More than one bear and and so much bigger.
Want to hike into areas or concerned , bring the behaved dog. They know way before you what is going on.

Not sure any big gun noise for scaring off such works, maybe a flare gun shot downwards?
Bob

Since the original question was about guns I previously mostly kept my replies confined to things that fire projectiles (the air horn was an exception) but from the start I've been wondering "why not bear spray?" as they must sell so much of it for a reason.

This site lists several types of deterrents and how to use them. Bear Pepper Spray is at the top of the list and an air horn (Wildlife Deterrent Horn) is also on the list and described as "can be an effective means of scaring bears away."

Bear Deterrents - BearSmart.com

And here is a video on Bear Spray vs. Pistol for defense against bears.

Bear Spray vs. Pistol: Which Is Better for a Bear Encounter? (Tip) - YouTube

How effective any arm, firearm, knife, whatever, will be is highly dependent on skill, which for most people is dependent on training and practice. I would guess that some amount of preparation (like at least reading the directions) improves the odds with bear spray as well.

Originally Posted by bryan_machine

How effective any arm, firearm, knife, whatever, will be is highly dependent on skill, which for most people is dependent on training and practice. I would guess that some amount of preparation (like at least reading the directions) improves the odds with bear spray as well.

Exactly, and the pros seem to recommend the non-lethal deterrents over firearms. A handgun for most of us is only good at close range and at over 40 mph a grizzly could flatten you before dying. It's hard to miss with pepper spray and the bangers are shot near the bear (but never at it) while it's still off a ways. An experienced bear who's been sprayed before might still attack, same as some really tough ex cons can still operate after being pepper sprayed or maced but there are lots and lots of reports of people whose lives the spray saved.

looks like bear spray works..but the guy still blead to deathe form a bite and a shake..
5 Shocking Bear Attacks Caught on Video - YouTube

Originally Posted by michiganbuck

looks like bear spray works..but the guy still blead to deathe form a bite and a shake..
5 Shocking Bear Attacks Caught on Video - YouTube

Yeah, BUT ... the spray wasn't used until AFTER the bear inflicted the fatal bite. It is known that even used full in the face it doesn't always stop an attack and it's apparently less effective on black bears but is has saved quite a few people. With nothing only luck can save you.

If I were in grizzly country I'd probably carry both spray and a powerful sidearm, with a shotgun close to hand whenever possible. These are incredible creatures and they are built to dismantle anything they encounter.

One hunter I knew referred to black bears as an ultra sensitive nose attached to a huge appetite, backed up by serious demolition tools.

Originally Posted by Scottl

One hunter I knew referred to black bears as an ultra sensitive nose attached to a huge appetite, backed up by serious demolition tools.

Well. there is SOME evidence the Black is smarter, too, also not always as hard-wired agressive if (s)he can but "farm" humans - let 'em live to keep-on BRINGING more food ...instead of eating up the equivalant to the Pizza-delivery guy "all at once", first delivery to yer door!

Bear's only priority is "Bear first!", any social graces purely incidental. So they ain't to be trifled with, casually.

I will say black bear are pretty sensitive to smell

~8 years ago spraying deer off around the property at dusk suddenly 'crash crash crash crash crash crash crash'
I cannot see a thing as it is too dark.
Coyote don't run away, they walk, Deer crash crash and they are half a mile away


A sound like a horse snorting, only really loud
http://bearsmartdurango.org/wp-conte...3/06/chomp.wav

Year later same location same time of evening, working quietly with a cordless drill just finishing up a project and the mosquitoes are killing me. If finally give in and grab the spray the wife had left out and as soon as I hit the button I could feel it in the ground as he ran away.

Our Animal Control Officer at the time was pissed because the powers that be didn't want to admit there were bar around, even though one got hit on the highway

Anyway, point being, black bear at least don't like stinky stuff

A bit OT, but pertinent nonetheless ...

My nephew Chris is a long-time wildlife biologist for the U.S. Forest Service.

I once asked him how to tell the difference between a Grizzly and Black Bear, because -- according to the internet -- "Not all black bears are black and not all grizzlies are 'grizzled'."

He said if you encounter one, climb a tree.

If it's a Black Bear, he'll climb the tree and knock you out of it.

If it's a Grizzly, he'll knock the whole tree down.

Originally Posted by gustafson

Anyway, point being, black bear at least don't like stinky stuff

Bear have rather good eyesight, but "not only". And it isn't just bear.

ANY (heavily) "nose brain" animal reacts to the strong smells of "whatever" out of the masking effects of all other more subtle scents more than to the specific smell itself.

Much as you or I would react to our vision being heavily impaired by being enveloped in dense chemical smoke whilst in a potentially dangerous situation.

They shift from being fully aware of their environment to paranoid-vulnerable to "something bad" they cannot now as readily smell moving about nor coming after them.

So long as not already in "attack mode' and committed to completion, they'll want to motate OUT of that sort of blindness-zone to some other place where they have full "awareness" again as master-and-commander AKA predator-in-charge, not as potential prey nor victim of some accident they could otherwise easily dodge.

Mice don't much mind 5 packs of smokes a day. No food here, it wasn't until I opened a wall to alter it and found a cache of nuts they had hauled in on their OWN initiative that I twigged that I was running a safe deposit bank vault for the competitive little f**kers.

It's when I go at the place with air fresheners and most of all, Zep "Smoke odor eliminator" they bail out.

Those don't "eliminate" any odors at all.

They simply shut down the sense of smell!

Originally Posted by kustomizer

Just travel with a short fat guy with a limp and let him carry the guns, pepper spray and tents, you carry the truck key and booze.

And WHY d'you think I'm down from 235-245 Avoir to 185 and goaling 175 over the past six or so years? It ain't only my PUTZ as has been getting shorter!

Advancing age has the scoliosis I wuz born with gradually morphing into curvature of the swine!

No visible favoring of either leg for a limp, though. Was a clever bastard about balancing moving machinery and simply f**ked up both knees, equally!

How's THAT for "stealthy" cheating?

Originally Posted by bryan_machine

How effective any arm, firearm, knife, whatever, will be is highly dependent on skill, which for most people is dependent on training and practice. I would guess that some amount of preparation (like at least reading the directions) improves the odds with bear spray as well.

Not so sure how to practice with a bear, all that skill, target practice and such goes out the window when the panic flood sets in your head.
Bob

Originally Posted by CarbideBob

Not so sure how to practice with a bear, all that skill, target practice and such goes out the window when the panic flood sets in your head.

I'd rather see a bear than hear a rattlesnake

IME a rattlesnake makes noise to say "Go away, don't bug me".
Other than the normal snorting a bear only makes noise to say "I'm coming for you".
Bob

I thought the sidearm was to use on yourself so the bear didn't eat you alive

What does scare a grizzly gone wild?
Sound, light, hits from a gun or maybe a club?
How many shots from an AR could one of these bad boys take if Kentucky shooting in panic mode?
Some do this hunting with a bow and arrow.
Bob