What can we as individuals or a group do about gun violence? - Page 102
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    Regarding homemade firearms in California:

    YouTube

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    Quote Originally Posted by mhajicek View Post
    Regarding homemade firearms in California:

    YouTube
    Not surprising. A very high percentage of people on this forum (excluding the poseurs) have the skills and tools to create firearms. Only laws and the desire of most people to conform to them prevents it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    Not surprising. A very high percentage of people on this forum (excluding the poseurs) have the skills and tools to create firearms. Only laws and the desire of most people to conform to them prevents it.
    I waited 18 months and finally got the tax stamp for my suppressor which cost me $1000 for something I could make myself with drops in a day or two. The people who make these laws are the same types who decry hunting because you could just go to the supermarket.

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    Remember that guns that are still current today like the Mauser 98 and 1911 were made on machines that are considered primitive today. I could make one of them , or an AK or AR in my shop, every XXXing part from scratch, including rifling, just mount the barrel on the 4th axis of my CNC mill and synch it to the X axis. I made a .22 pistol when I was 13 on a 9" Logan lathe.

    You could ban ammunition, but we could still turn out casings. Primers might be more difficult, but they were all made by ordinary people and can be made again.

    Bill

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    Quote Originally Posted by 9100 View Post
    Remember that guns that are still current today like the Mauser 98 and 1911 were made on machines that are considered primitive today. I could make one of them , or an AK or AR in my shop, every XXXing part from scratch, including rifling, just mount the barrel on the 4th axis of my CNC mill and synch it to the X axis. I made a .22 pistol when I was 13 on a 9" Logan lathe.

    You could ban ammunition, but we could still turn out casings. Primers might be more difficult, but they were all made by ordinary people and can be made again.

    Bill
    Many years ago I saw a rifling machine built by a shop teacher who was seriously into black powder in the days before replicas were widely available. It was based on the ones used 200 years ago but had some modern refinements to make it easier to use. Basically it was a rotating hardwood cylinder with spiral grooves that mated with guide pins. It was mounted in a frame with a large Tee handle at one end. The rod with the tooth that cut the rifling was pushed into the barrel and then pulled to scrape a shallow groove, pulled out completely and then rotated to the next groove on the cylinder before the process was repeated. The originals used paper shims to increase depth for each pass but I THINK (it was a long time ago) this one used a fine pitch setscrew for quicker adjustment. As I recall, it also used metal shafts and bearings.

    Like the originals it was time consuming to use but produced very accurate barrels, according to the builder/owner.

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    take away the kids smart phone and internet,
    then boot the over indulgent parents in the butt.
    it's not a coincidence that school shootings started
    a few years after the use of the internet became wide spread,
    and you were bad if you didn't just give the kids what ever they wanted
    and bad behavior no longer had consequences.

    that almost every teen started playing doom and the other first person shooter games
    hasn't helped.

    just play a few games of fortnite it will become clear.

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    Tons of things are affecting Gun violence. Guns left in cars which end up stolen and in the hands of criminals.
    Violent video games.
    Single parents too busy to spend quality time to properly guide their children.
    And of course... the war on drugs. I’m all for having laws to prevent drug abuse. But damn...I’ve witnessed the evolution of the War on Drugs... and the only results I see is that drugs are easier than ever to get and drug abuse and related deaths are 10 times higher than 40 years ago.
    It’s just not working to help drug abuse. It’s broken. Maybe it’s time to rethink the war on drugs.
    Reminds me of prohibition. That didn’t work either. FWIW.... deaths of police officers killed in line of duty seem to now be approaching the all time highs set during prohibition.

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    A look into when the widespread use of SSRI drugs (prozac, etc) started , shows a startling relationship with when the mass shootings started in this country. They are widely known to cause suicide and extreme aggression in a small fraction of users, ESPECIALLY UNDER 25 YEARS OLD. This is widely known, but seldom talked about, the pharm companies have a lot of pull.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stoneaxe View Post
    A look into when the widespread use of SSRI drugs (prozac, etc) started , shows a startling relationship with when the mass shootings started in this country. They are widely known to cause suicide and extreme aggression in a small fraction of users, ESPECIALLY UNDER 25 YEARS OLD. This is widely known, but seldom talked about, the pharm companies have a lot of pull.
    That was commented on somewhere back in the last 2000 posts. The poster said that most of the mass shooters either were or had been on SSRIs recently. I have personal experience with the ability of a tiny amount of a drug to radically change behavior. A friend has bipolar disorder and a tiny amount of Risperdal, half a tablet if things are going well, makes the difference between an intelligent and delightful person and a raving lunatic.

    I have no trouble at all believing that SSRIs could have such an effect on behavior.

    Bill

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    Quote Originally Posted by 9100 View Post

    You could ban ammunition

    Bill

    To an ignorant Dane like me, this seems like a good idea.
    Seriously, what's wrong with it?
    Regards, fusker

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    Not surprising. A very high percentage of people on this forum (excluding the poseurs) have the skills and tools to create firearms. Only laws and the desire of most people to conform to them prevents it.
    It's very interesting to see the tools Browning used to create his firearms. The John M. Browning Firearms Museum in Ogden, Utah has many of his original models and tools.

    Have a look at John M. Browning Firearms Museum | Ogden, UT

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    Looked at the Browning website I only saw one machine shop photo flash by. The lathe in that series looked like an Atlas. Wonder if some of the sticklers here would have tried to have him banned as not professional?

    Could not find the stirring the pot icon as suggested by Rob F, so I inserted a plain smiley.
    Last edited by FredC; 12-20-2019 at 10:05 AM.

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  20. #2033
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    Quote Originally Posted by FredC View Post
    Looked at the Browning website I only saw one machine shop photo flash by. The lathe in that series looked like an Atlas. Wonder if some of the sticklers here would have tried to have him banned as not professional?
    You really should use this stir pot icon when making a statement like that

    A little more on the browning museum: Shows the lathe his father brought on a covered wagon in 1852 as well as a rifling set up probably like scottl described above:
    YouTube

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    Quote Originally Posted by fusker View Post
    To an ignorant Dane like me, this seems like a good idea.
    Seriously, what's wrong with it?
    Regards, fusker

    unconstitutional for one.
    But perhaps you don't know about basic human rights, having had your rights given to you by your superiors.

    I have no superiors, But one

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    Sorry, CalG, I dont get you.
    Could you spell it out, please?
    fusker

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    Quote Originally Posted by fusker View Post
    To an ignorant Dane like me, this seems like a good idea.
    Seriously, what's wrong with it?
    Regards, fusker
    Do the math.

    Estimates are that something like 5 BILLION rounds of ammunition are sold in the USA each year. Rough estimates are that something like 200,000 rounds per year are involved in murders, suicides, accidents, and mischievous property damage. That's about 0.004%, and no society in the world has ever totally eliminated criminal and bad behavior. If deaths caused by war between rival drug gangs were eliminated the U.S. "gun violence" stats would be among the lowest in the world.

    One manager of a local club told me they calculated that something like 1-1.5 million rounds were fired in their indoor range last year. The estimate was based on the tonnage of lead and jacket metal retrieved and sold for scrap, along with an estimate of the percentage of each caliber fired. That's five times the amount of "bad" rounds fired in the entire country and every one of those rounds fired in that range was done so legally, safely, and with provisions to protect both shooters' health and the environment.

    The United States 2019 population is estimated at 329,064,917 people at mid year according to UN data.

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    A family friend shoots on weekends with his son. They can, and on a somewhat regular basis, shoot 20k-40k rounds. When he buys ammo, it is usually pallets via LTL. He bought a connex container of .30-06 for one of his brownings.

    You can try to ban whatever you want, constitutionally or otherwise. If the courts uphold it, then it is up to the people whether or not to uphold it.

    I have a friend in Virginia who said things are getting serious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FredC View Post

    Could not find the stirring the pot icon as suggested by Rob F, so I inserted a plain smiley.
    On my computer it ( ) is 6 rows down, 2nd from the left. This is from the smiley icon box right above the text window.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fal Grunt View Post
    I have a friend in Virginia who said things are getting serious.
    I saw this story and was reminded of your quote above. Is this an accurate account of what is happening?

    Virginia Activates Official Militia to Defend 2nd Amendment

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fal Grunt View Post
    A family friend shoots on weekends with his son. They can, and on a somewhat regular basis, shoot 20k-40k rounds. .
    20 to 40 thousand rounds in a weekend of shooting?
    Gun control should be about being able to hit your target, not cutting down a forest.
    I know this is way neat to do and I may have chopped down a few trees but.....even in two or there months this a serious amount of fire in not at war situation.
    I'm more a one shot placed right type of guy but if you want to spend the money I will not step on your rights to go play as long as you do it somewhere safe.
    Problem is that now I see some who never learn to actually shoot or hit the target and just want to "spray lead". This is how you hurt those not involved.

    Some will think we should never have guns and that will end violence. Good luck with that end, swords and machetes come to mind.
    Some will think we need unlimited firepower as a right. Yea, and now guided missiles and drones in the mix?
    Do I have a constitutional right to my own nuke or space based platform? For sure there are people here in the USA that could afford such with ease.

    How do we outlaw violence at any level? How does one make rules that all are happy with?
    People want to feel safe from threats. Some worry about the big government, some worry about walking the street and a punk ass kid with a gun or those who think a home invasion.
    Same worries, different focus.

    I'm sort of in the range of why worry. If you want or like to do play time with all kinds of these things I'm just fine with that.
    Guns, knives, gas or explosives are not the problem. Upset individuals are.
    Born like you and me and gone off track somewhere and somehow. Perhaps some outside influences? Can you legislate or stop that?
    How do you stop what seems crazy?
    Bob


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