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Thread: Machine Cost

  1. #1
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    Default Machine Cost

    A bit of a generic question, but I am looking at a 2002 haas vf4 with between 12000 and 13000 hours of spindle time. Machine has been maintained very well according to seller, and is loaded option wise for the year and comes with a 4th 210. I am in Ontario, Canada so price is in CAD $. The asking price that has been set seems too much in my opinion based solely on the age and runtime.

    What is a realistic price for this machine to pursue?

    And how is machine support for this era of machine through Haas?
    Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by valleyduramax View Post
    Machine has been maintained very well according to seller,


    Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk
    How can you go wrong then? If the salesman says it's a good deal, go ahead and jump in with both feet.
    Seriously, dealers asking prices are usually 200% of realistic price.

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    Well the maintained part is the main selling point for me like you say but for a comparison, the salesman is asking $50000 CAD for this vf4 and then there is a private sale for a 2016 VM3 fully loaded with a bunch of tooling for $105000 CAD. Yes its 1 model smaller but also 14 years newer and has around 4000 hours if I remember right. My issue is that this vf4 machine is old and high hours for the asking price. Yes I know it's how it goes but these machines dont show up often with options they have in my area.

    So what would a realistic price be to offer????, as this is my first machine of my own if I pursue it.


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    go new

    I have done the numbers and used is not a good investment on Haas if your keeping it more than 7 or 10 years .. the day they install it your going to loose about 10K and from there on its about 2k a year ,, so if you buy a new loaded vf2ss for 70k after 10 years it well cost you about 30k to own it ... if you buy someones USED 10 year old machine for 40K in 10 years it well be worth about 10K ... so why deal with a USED machine when a new one costs you the same amount over the next 10 years ?

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    The older machines have a processor board that is no longer supported by Haas. They offer a New Upgrade that will get you back to running again. That is the upgrade...running again. Cost I have heard is in the 10-15k range for the new board and all its goodies that do you little good.

    The up side is supposedly the Old Processor board can be repaired for a good deal less coin, just not by Haas.



    A machine that is well maintained, not crashed can run for a good long time and make a bunch of great parts for you.

    My older machines are a 91 and (2) 95's along with machines up to last years models that all run 5 days a week, 10-12 hours a day since new.

    The newer machines run a little faster...a little nicer features at the Control and more memory, plus easier to download...not that any oar tough.


    One point is the seller always says his machines are run easy and well maintained...

    Little trick here...get the serial number and call the HFO for service records on that machine. If they serviced it you will see the history and try to line that up to what the seller and machine says. Expect a couple switches, X Axis cable, maybe a motor or two, an amp, Vector drive on the list of a well maintained and used machine. Start seeing visits for sheet metal repair, traming head, new ways and ball screws, ball nuts...the machine had a tough life.


    A good machine that pumps out parts is worth a few extra bucks...even if a little older.

    See whats around and compare...

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    Location location location..

    Just a little tidbit here. I worked at a place that made some questionable decisions IMO, anyways, we sold an ST20 lathe that had about 30 cutting hours on it for around 20k. Right place right time for the buyer.

    I don't have any idea what a used machine is worth, but like DDmachine said, new is probably the way to go if you can. You will get a nice ROI selling it used in 5-10 years if/when you upgrade....

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    Have you ever seen a dealer claim that a machine was poorly maintained? Even in the face of objective evidence?

    37k USD sounds awfully high, especially for an orphaned control. Maybe 25k.

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    I would absolutely rather buy new but I am starting out on my own and have a budget.

    I was thinking right around the $35000 range when I first inquired about the machine again based on runtime age and support. Definitely not the asking price of $50000. My issue is I buy said machine and regardless of maintenance, the comp board craps out and I have a paper weight due to limited factory support.

    Thanks for the replies. I have some serious thinking to do.

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    Been down that road a few times...if its worth 35K to you, then thats what you base your offer on.
    Worst he say no and you keep looking. He says yes...you check machine out with a fine tooth comb and decided if 35 is really the number you want to go with.

    I went to look at a VF-1 in a plant that was relocating and they wanted 18k for. They had a little older machine at 15k and an automatic saw for 5k.
    Non of the machines hit my mark...but could do what I needed as a package so I offered 25 for it all...I got a snicker and a no way. No hard feelings, I thanked him for his time and I was on my way. I got a call the following week, if I could get it out of there by weeks end, it was mine at 25. Two days later they pulled up here.

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    With a budget of 35k why don't you opt for a toolroom mill with options you want. That's the route we went and here we are 3 years later, sold the toolroom mill for 3000 less than I paid and just took delivery of a new VF4SS. If you are a business look into leasing as you can write off 100 % of your payments. Just my 2 cents.

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    I have a 1998 VF0 with tooling and 4th axis rotary table and extremely low hours near Ottawa, Ontario. Look in machinery for sale on this website.

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    Hey Steve, I have looked at your add a few times as I'm in Ottawa also. Machine isnt big enough though for what im looking for. I need a VF3 or machine of comparable size. X and Z travel are my needs atm. Thanks for letting me know though!

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    Good luck with your search. If there's anything else you might need for your shop, let me know. I have a couple of lathes for sale (manual), a 35 ton press brake, a small HBM and a bridgeport plus numerous machine shop tools and a large surface plate (about 4' x 6').
    Steve


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